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Discussion Boards => Thomas & Friends => Topic started by: TrainMan2001 on November 25, 2015, 12:43:29 AM



Title: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: TrainMan2001 on November 25, 2015, 12:43:29 AM
Hello everyone. I have decided plans for a layout that I want to make for the future. I am planning on using ez app because you can have DC track power with it, unlike DCC, and I am planning on changing the couplers on my thomas stock to knuckle couplers. I am thinking about, for Thomas at least, getting a NEM coupler set and gluing it on the running board where the hook and loop would go. Do you think this will work, also, what should I do for other engines? Do you think this way for Thomas would work without derailing American body mounted rolling stock on curves?
-TrainMan2001


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: jward on November 25, 2015, 03:33:43 PM
you may have to wait a little while for the ez app. blue rail trains is making the Bluetooth decoders, but I don't think they are yet small enough to fit in Thomas or percy. when I converted Thomas to dcc I used a z scale decoder.

http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,17870.0.html


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: TrainMan2001 on November 25, 2015, 05:11:41 PM
you may have to wait a little while for the ez app. blue rail trains is making the Bluetooth decoders, but I don't think they are yet small enough to fit in Thomas or percy. when I converted Thomas to dcc I used a z scale decoder.

http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,17870.0.html

Yes I know I will have to wait a little while. It will take me a long time to get enough track and trains for a serious layout anyway.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: uscgtanker on December 04, 2015, 12:35:56 AM
You don't need to glue the knuckles to your rolling stock. My brother models british trains and has converted all our Thomas and friends to Kadee couplers. for thomas all you need to do is remove the loop and hook, keep the screw. cut a 1/8th inch slot in the buffer beam to fit a #5 kadee coupler box minus the top cover piece. He has found this sit invaluable for conversion hope it works for you to.
http://www.mumbles274.co.uk/nonnemkadees.html#pullman


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: TrainMan2001 on December 04, 2015, 12:49:58 AM
Thanks I will try that.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on December 06, 2015, 10:05:43 PM
knuckle couplers;previous thread on this subject is on page 6,3 or 4 down ,check it out!!!!
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: clan line 35028 on December 19, 2015, 01:45:15 AM
I already converted my entire collection of thomas and friends rollingstock to Kadee couplers with the exception of Donald the scotish twin. the front coupler beam is metal. this website will show you how to convert the regular train cars that bachmann has available.
http://www.modelrailforum.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3328


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on December 27, 2015, 05:37:21 PM
So,if I change my thomas stock to knuckle couplers,is that a "SACRILEGE"?Am I destroying the value of the model?
Your thoughts please,
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on December 27, 2015, 05:52:35 PM
So,if I change my thomas stock to knuckle couplers,is that a "SACRILEGE"?Am I destroying the value of the model?
Your thoughts please,
UPTODAY

I think you probably will be, because you ever want to sell your collection, you probably won't find many people wanting it because of the changes your have made, and the buying of having to buy hundreds of packs of the 78979 HO/OO International Style Hook-and-Loop Coupilers to restore the models to their original look. It will also be expensive for you to buy the knuckle coupilers, especially if you plan on selling your Thomas & Friends collection soon after you complete and show it to your grandchildren. For instance, if they become quickly not interested, you will have to try and make your money back form buying the models but also the extra money spent from the knuckle coupilers which you make not be able to get back. Personally, if the Thomas collection is something you plan to keep for a number of years and long time, it maybe beneficial to look into getting the knuckle coupliers for them, but if you do not plan keeping it for a long time, I do not recommend your changing them. Just some food for thought UPTODAY, but my personal opinion is that I would not do this, but if you would like too then it will be a project for you and something else for you too do!


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Griffin on December 27, 2015, 07:42:15 PM
So,if I change my thomas stock to knuckle couplers,is that a "SACRILEGE"?Am I destroying the value of the model?
Your thoughts please,
UPTODAY
Simply keep the hook-and-loops with their original engine- then, if you decide to sell the models, you can feel free to include the original couplers in the event the new owner wants to reset them to "default," as it were.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on December 27, 2015, 11:04:23 PM
To install the knuckle couplers properly you must remove the post that holds the hook and loop coupler.Once you have cut off that post,there is no turning back.                                     
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on December 28, 2015, 05:58:31 AM
To install the knuckle couplers properly you must remove the post that holds the hook and loop coupler.Once you have cut off that post,there is no turning back.                                      
UPTODAY

Exactly UPTODAY, and then you have pretty much spoilt the models as well, so I see it as vandalism to the models and an expensive waste of time! I really do think doing this is not worth it. If you want my advice UPTODAY, I think you should leave the models how they are and not fit these knuckle coupilers.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: AJW98Productions on December 28, 2015, 06:28:23 AM
I have to disagree on the topic of fitting knuckle couplings to them. If most of your stock has knuckle couplers (for example: a lot of American stock uses knuckle couplers) so I can see the appeal to it. I also disagree that it could harm resale value, I think it seems like there's enough of a market for Thomas stock fitted with knuckle couplings, so resale value wouldn't exactly be too badly damaged, and you save the next buyer a lot of work if they intended to fit their Thomas items with knuckle couplers.

At the very least, I'd say the term "sacrilege" is an exaggeration. I've seen a Bachmann Toby on eBay with sprung buffers fitted and screw-link couplings also fitted, as well as some detailing here and there added, it was slightly used and it still sold for around the same price as a normal Toby, because the detailing had been carried out nicely, and it looked in an as new condition. There is a market for trains that are, in some people's eyes "improved", if a knuckle coupling conversion were to be carried out correctly, I see no reason why the resale value should be drastically damaged. There is a market for that sort of modification after all.

~Alex


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on December 28, 2015, 06:53:05 AM
I have to disagree on the topic of fitting knuckle couplings to them. If most of your stock has knuckle couplers (for example: a lot of American stock uses knuckle couplers) so I can see the appeal to it. I also disagree that it could harm resale value, I think it seems like there's enough of a market for Thomas stock fitted with knuckle couplings, so resale value wouldn't exactly be too badly damaged, and you save the next buyer a lot of work if they intended to fit their Thomas items with knuckle couplers.

At the very least, I'd say the term "sacrilege" is an exaggeration. I've seen a Bachmann Toby on eBay with sprung buffers fitted and screw-link couplings also fitted, as well as some detailing here and there added, it was slightly used and it still sold for around the same price as a normal Toby, because the detailing had been carried out nicely, and it looked in an as new condition. There is a market for trains that are, in some people's eyes "improved", if a knuckle coupling conversion were to be carried out correctly, I see no reason why the resale value should be drastically damaged. There is a market for that sort of modification after all.

~Alex

The problem is that must be remembered, is that what needs to be done to fit the knuckle coupilers is that you have to cut away the holders for the Hook-and-Loop Coupilers which means that you will ruin the models and will mean that they will never be able to be restored to back their original couplings.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: AJW98Productions on December 28, 2015, 07:24:22 AM
The problem is that must be remembered, is that what needs to be done to fit the knuckle coupilers is that you have to cut away the holders for the Hook-and-Loop Coupilers which means that you will ruin the models and will mean that they will never be able to be restored to back their original couplings.
Jacob, so long as the seller is honest about this, it should be a non-issue, as I said before there is a market for these modified models, if the buyer wanted to fit their Thomas or any other engine with knuckle couplings, they wouldn't care as they were going to do it anyway, there's enough of a market for knuckle coupling fitted Bachmann Thomas stock that second-hand sales should not be an issue, provided the seller is honest about what the buyer is getting. I don't know how I could make this clearer, there is a market for this, selling should not be an issue. For example: I know a person who bought a Bachmann Percy with knuckle couplings fitted to it for his mostly American layout, he soon also bought a Thomas fitted with them, he knew what he was buying, he wanted the product, so he didn't care that it was modified. It was no real issue to him.

Anyway, it would seem TrainMan2001 has made up their mind on what they want, I suggest that unless we could aid in instructing or help give advice to make the conversion go through, we leave the topic alone. I know as I am not being helpful, I shall soon leave this topic alone, and let the experts in conversion handle it.

~Alex


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on December 28, 2015, 07:54:01 AM
The problem is that must be remembered, is that what needs to be done to fit the knuckle coupilers is that you have to cut away the holders for the Hook-and-Loop Coupilers which means that you will ruin the models and will mean that they will never be able to be restored to back their original couplings.
Jacob, so long as the seller is honest about this, it should be a non-issue, as I said before there is a market for these modified models, if the buyer wanted to fit their Thomas or any other engine with knuckle couplings, they wouldn't care as they were going to do it anyway, there's enough of a market for knuckle coupling fitted Bachmann Thomas stock that second-hand sales should not be an issue, provided the seller is honest about what the buyer is getting. I don't know how I could make this clearer, there is a market for this, selling should not be an issue. For example: I know a person who bought a Bachmann Percy with knuckle couplings fitted to it for his mostly American layout, he soon also bought a Thomas fitted with them, he knew what he was buying, he wanted the product, so he didn't care that it was modified. It was no real issue to him.

Anyway, it would seem TrainMan2001 has made up their mind on what they want, I suggest that unless we could aid in instructing or help give advice to make the conversion go through, we leave the topic alone. I know as I am not being helpful, I shall soon leave this topic alone, and let the experts in conversion handle it.

~Alex

That's true. Seller's need to be truthful in the condition of the product they are selling, and any major change like to the couplings need to be told to the customer or potential customer in the description of the product.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Griffin on December 28, 2015, 10:51:54 AM
To install the knuckle couplers properly you must remove the post that holds the hook and loop coupler.Once you have cut off that post,there is no turning back.                                     
UPTODAY
Oops, sorry I didn't realize that.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: clan line 35028 on January 11, 2016, 05:52:41 PM
I have converted all my British and Bachmann Thomas to kadee. I have seen a vast improvement to them. 1 they look better without such a big really crummy looking loop and hook coupler on either end. 2. cars and locomotives look better together and at prototype distance. 3 they are SOOOO much easier to decoupler now. 4 they operate better. the loop and hook usually snagged or tangled around sharper curves or tight switching. The kadee coupler does not have that problem. the only disadvantage as all of you point out is the resale value can be slightly damaged.   


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: sodor express on January 16, 2016, 07:38:44 PM
You do realize that Bachmann makes thousands of these a year. There really is no collectability in them. Limited edition I could see and understand. If some are discontinued yes ,like Gordon's coaches .But their are other makers of coaches out there, and with a little paint, done. Watching my 4 year old grandson struggle with those crappy hooks trying to take them apart and the whole train lifts together and bends the hooks, or come apart in the air and drop to the floor. With Kadee's he simply lifts the car straight up to disconnect , or he uses the under track magnets and then shunts the trucks. Yes he knows how to use them at 4 years old. If Bachmann would at least use NEM style couplers they would be easier to convert. I picked up 2 Thomas with coaches with James as well,grungy dirty but in perfect shape for $30 bucks CAD. Where is the collectability? Even in the UK and Australia they are converting to Kadee's as a whole because they find out their cars run better. I'll continue to change over any Thomas line he gets, and if I see some already converted at a train show, I'll snap them up right away.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on January 16, 2016, 07:50:29 PM
You do realize that Bachmann makes thousands of these a year. There really is no collectability in them. Limited edition I could see and understand. If some are discontinued yes ,like Gordon's coaches .But their are other makers of coaches out there, and with a little paint, done. Watching my 4 year old grandson struggle with those crappy hooks trying to take them apart and the whole train lifts together and bends the hooks, or come apart in the air and drop to the floor. With Kadee's he simply lifts the car straight up to disconnect , or he uses the under track magnets and then shunts the trucks. Yes he knows how to use them at 4 years old. If Bachmann would at least use NEM style couplers they would be easier to convert. I picked up 2 Thomas with coaches with James as well,grungy dirty but in perfect shape for $30 bucks CAD. Where is the collectability? Even in the UK and Australia they are converting to Kadee's as a whole because they find out their cars run better. I'll continue to change over any Thomas line he gets, and if I see some already converted at a train show, I'll snap them up right away.

Collectability is in the product itself as it from the Thomas & Friends range. Generally, I find collectors of this range are older than 4 years old. I am 19 years old. I can see why you changing them, is because it is easier for your 4 year old grandson to uncouple his Locomotives and Rolling Stock, but changing to knuckle couplings does cost more, as you have to buy the products and loads of packs of knuckle couplings. Personally, the hook-and-loop couplings you get on the products out of the blister packs are alright too me.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on January 16, 2016, 08:22:14 PM
OK,heres the latest story.Took the hook and loop couplers off of SALTY,installed kadee #158s in the cuopler boxes,went right in with no mods,but the coupler is too low,so I cut off the trip pin.Looks good to me .did the same thing to the 6ton wagon,went forward and backwards real fast no derailments.NO mods to the product.
ARE WE GETTING SOMEWHERE NOW?????
UPTODAY
STEVE
HAPPY IN PORTLAND


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on January 16, 2016, 08:42:22 PM
OK,heres the latest story.Took the hook and loop couplers off of SALTY,installed kadee #158s in the cuopler boxes,went right in with no mods,but the coupler is too low,so I cut off the trip pin.Looks good to me .did the same thing to the 6ton wagon,went forward and backwards real fast no derailments.NO mods to the product.
ARE WE GETTING SOMEWHERE NOW?????
UPTODAY
STEVE
HAPPY IN PORTLAND

Are you able to post picture of what you have done too Salty, or have you not learnt to post pictures yet?

Personally though Steve (UPTODAY), I like to keep my collection in 'factory and out of the box condition' and think making these changes to the product spoils the value of it.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on January 16, 2016, 09:10:12 PM
No pictures yet,the best part of this system is I can change back to the original couplers with no damage to the models.
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on January 17, 2016, 04:42:54 AM
No pictures yet,the best part of this system is I can change back to the original couplers with no damage to the models.
UPTODAY

Well change back to the original couplings if you wanted too.


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on January 17, 2016, 03:52:41 PM
Hi,everyone,switching to knuckle couplers makes it real easy to switch wagons just like the real trains.I LOVE IT!!!!
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on January 17, 2016, 04:44:03 PM
Hi,everyone,switching to knuckle couplers makes it real easy to switch wagons just like the real trains.I LOVE IT!!!!
UPTODAY

How much do these knuckle couplers cost, Steve (UPTODAY)?


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on January 17, 2016, 05:29:22 PM
The knuckle couplers,kadee #158,cost $4.27 for two pair,enough for two wagons.I can pick up a wagon in the middle of a train without anything else moving!!!
HAVE FUN RUN TRAINS(NO PURPLE WAGONS!!!)
STEVE
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on January 17, 2016, 05:48:10 PM
The knuckle couplers,kadee #158,cost $4.27 for two pair,enough for two wagons.I can pick up a wagon in the middle of a train without anything else moving!!!
HAVE FUN RUN TRAINS(NO PURPLE WAGONS!!!)
STEVE
UPTODAY

So, too fit the knuckle couplers too every Locomotive and piece of Rolling Stock is going to be a costly project! I am very happy with the Hook-and-Loop Couplers myself, but we are all different.

Very funny Steve (UPTODAY)! I do not own any Purple Wagon's, especially Purple Brake Van's! I was going to invite you to the Circus and a ski down Hornby Mountain, but I think I have changed my mind now! I do not have your so called 'Hornby Mountain' anymore, anyway!


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on January 17, 2016, 06:56:00 PM
Hi,everyone,my problem with the hook and loop couplers is backing up they derail,making switching wagons difficult!!!!!
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on January 17, 2016, 07:22:08 PM
Hi,everyone,my problem with the hook and loop couplers is backing up they derail,making switching wagons difficult!!!!!
UPTODAY

They will derail if you not careful. You just need to work how to uncouple Rolling Stock with out pulling others off the track. It takes time too learn Steve (UPTODAY), but trust me you will get it. I find the more slowly you do it works a treat and you will not end up derailing the whole of your train!


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on January 17, 2016, 09:57:06 PM
Hi everyone, Now I am thinking about putting a front coupler on THOMAS so he will be a more useful engine!!!!
comments????
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on January 18, 2016, 03:43:07 AM
Hi everyone, Now I am thinking about putting a front coupler on THOMAS so he will be a more useful engine!!!!
comments????
UPTODAY

Thomas the Tank Engine is already a useful engine, Steve (UPTODAY)!


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: UPTODAY on January 18, 2016, 02:33:09 PM
Hi,everyone,those hook and loop couplers look their very best in a pile on the work bench.I am going to save mine incase I wish to part with some of my collection.
STILL CRAZY!!!!!
UPTODAY


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: Jacob Wilson on January 18, 2016, 02:44:43 PM
Hi,everyone,those hook and loop couplers look their very best in a pile on the work bench.I am going to save mine incase I wish to part with some of my collection.
STILL CRAZY!!!!!
UPTODAY

Very funny! I liked it when you say the best place for the Hook-and-Loop Couplers is on your workbench!


Title: Re: Changing to Knuckle Couplers Question
Post by: sodor express on November 18, 2017, 11:09:22 PM
I' save the ones that I remove and sell them to Jacob so he can install them on every train he has. Even at train shows I see more hornby and bachmann  rolling stock with kadees sold by old english blokes than the hook and loop. When I ask , they reply they just work better.   Have you ever thought some people want to use there trains and not spend countless hours trying to learn how to reverse their rakes without derailments or uncoupler with a big hump of plastic in the centre of the track. Besides how do you shunt the trucks with those damn hook and loops?