Hey Mr Bachmann how about something for us ICRR modelers?

[Stephen Warrington]

  Hey Mr. Bachmann how about something for us ICRR fans at least you could take the 2-8-0 and paint and letter it for the IC after all is based on a IC 900 class. Or a nice IC 2-8-2 in plastic. I mean it looks like you got the east coast covered and the West coast but like so many other companiies no Mid America.



Stephen
in Mid Mississippi

[Orsonroy]

You'll get no complaints from me Stephen! (heck, I might just buy up ten of the IC Mikes!)


It's odd: the Bachmann 2-8-0 IS an IC engine, but they've never released it in IC paint. It's not like it'd be a hard engine to decorate or anything...

[Stephen Warrington]

I agree Ray, Won't hear me complaining I can't really complain about the two old Hallmark gals I got in both run pretty good for their ages.

I was looking through some old pics last nighta saw a series of 2-8-0swith short vandy tenders where were these usedat on a all coal road?

Stephen

[lanny]

Me too! Me too!  (I know Gene, this makes about 425 times for me now  ).

In any case, Stephen and Ray, I'd sure be glad to buy some Spectrum ICRR #1512s and/or #2106s when Bachmann gets around to mfg. them .

And besides ICRR modelers, just think what NYC, UP, SP, etc. modelers could do with super detailing a Spectrum Harriman Mike!

BTW, I posted the most recent update photos of 'kit bash' progress on my Spectrum ICRR 2-8-0 #908 on a 'new thread'.

lanny nicolet

[joegideon]

I sent an almost-exact copy of this  a coupla yrs. ago!  The pattern-maker for Bachmann copied- no, USED- making only a few changes- the Hallmark brass I.C. 2-8-0 in the creation of the Spectrum 2-8-0s.  There are even file marks that are on both engines!!  The primary changes are a.) the tender and, b.) the air pump/s.  The Hallmark engine even came with a dome that was identical to the Bachmann dome. Not all I.C. steam engines had a "square" sand dome.   I have two- one that looks like a Bachmannn, one with the 'square' sand dome.  The I.C. (most of 'em, at least...) had the air pumps on the pilot deck.  The Hallmark "900 class" Consols. were just bad models; the drivers(white metal...)on most crumbled from age or fatigue- theywere NOT sprung and ran fine... in reverse.

I also would be thrilled to see an I.C. 2-8-2; I have three Alco  I.C. Mikes- They are terrible runners- or were- until they got the North West Short Line treatment.  But I would buy at LEAST three or four...  One thing for sure... we don't need another #$@%&## USRA Mike.  But, with the 2-8-2 traditionally being the most-popular steamer, the I.C. might just be a great choice; I.C. modelers would love it, of course- but the freelancers would, I suspect, be in heaven!

The Illinois Central has been largely ignored by everyone for - well, since model railroading began.  Hallmark did a 2-8-0 and a 4-8-2; Alco did a 2-8-2; PFM did two versions of the 2-8-4(pre- and post-war...)and Sunset did an "Illinois Centralized USRA Light 2-10-2.

Unfortunately, almost every loco the I.C. had was different.  There were "1200 class" 2-8-2s that looked almost identical to some "2000 class" 2-8-2s... And there are two of the same class that look nothing like each other- or the others of the same class!  There has never been a 4-6-2 that resembled one of the I.C.'s(...even though many were identical to S.P. P5s...) Modeling Illinois Central steam is a tough nut to crack- somewhat like those guys who built the F.E.C. "Keys" layout; Almost a dozen scratchbuilt engines later, they almost had a decent roster!  If someone would make an "I.C. Kit"- a selection of 'square' domes, a sheet metal "I.C. pilot", and an airpump kit- pilot deck mounts with N.Y. pumps- I'll bet hundreds would sell. 

But the original premise here is valid:  Spectrum 2-8-0 with the smaller Vandy, lettered I.C. #909 would probably be 'good enough' for many of us!

[SteamGene]

Stephen,
The Vanderbilt tender was used for both coal and oil.  C&O, B&O, and Southern all used Vandy tenders with coal bunkers.
BTW, I agree that Bachmann should bring out a Consolidation lettered for IC and the heavy USRA Mountain lettered for FEC - afterall, it had the most of them originally.  It would also be interesting to find out who bought them from FEC. 
Gene

[Orsonroy]

I was looking through some old pics last nighta saw a series of 2-8-0s with short vandy tenders where were these used at on a all coal road?

Hi Stephen,

When the IC bought these heavy 2-8-0s originally (941 through 993) they came equipped with those short Vanderbilt tenders. I have no idea WHY the IC got them, but I "suspect" that the engines were just Harriman-standard designs, and may have actually originally been built to an SP plan.

The engines survived into the 1940s with the Vandy tenders (they were delivered in 1909 and 1911), when most of the engines were scrapped or turned into 0-8-0s. The IC took the 12 best and turned them into the 900-911 series, which is what the Bachmann model really represents.

So for the money, Bachmann could release TWO different IC 2-8-0s: one with the Vanderbilt tender in the 941-993 series, and one with the conventional tender in the 900-911 series. Either would be fine with me!

[Stephen Warrington]

After my latest chaos with two Hallmark 2-8-0s, I have decided to Dieselize the fleet and at least I did find some proper ICG cabeese like those used in the Mississippi Delta. The two Hallmarks, I dont know what I am going to do with them yet.



Stephen

[SteamGene]

So what's wrong with the Hallmarks?
Gene

[Stephen Warrington]

Well, where to begin, they were made in 1976 and not 1996 like I had thought. So the motors are open frame with a direct gear soldered to the motor shaft, according to alot of IC experts the sand and steam domes are wrong. They run like jack rabbits escaping a Texas wild fire other minor details are not correct.  I asked my steam expert friend out in Texas to rebuild them and he doesn't even want to touch them and he builds his own locomotives also the driver centers are off square and made of pot metal according to him..

The only thing correct about them do you ask? The Tenders which everyone one wants but not the engines themselves.

Note not my photo or layout but one showing a brass 2-8-0 from the person I got them off of. At least the lettering and numbering is correct color. I once could of worked on the minor details and such myself but Ino longer have proper nerve control in my hands or fingers to paint and decal small stuff. I had to get a friend to take my LS 45 tonner home with him to repair because I couldn't even get it dis assembled with my poor fingers and eye site is getting justas bad 20/25 in my left 20/40 in my right and the eye doctor said "sorry son, I can't do nothing for it. here's the $1,500 bill for all those tests." How manyP2k 2-10-2s would that have bought? Where's my Prozac model trains are getting more out of budget and about as worthless as my meds.

Stephen

Running GP9's and 18s in ICRR Green Diamond shoving retired steam to the scrap line  for now.

Note: I plan to keep the two brass spruce gooses in HO and do not intend to part them out, if sold they will be sold as a set.

[Stephen Warrington]

  Well my friend Robert told me not to give up on the two Hallmark 2-8-0s yet. So I don't know what is going to happen Steam or not steam dieselize or not. Decisions decisions.

Stephen

[Orsonroy]

Stephen!

Don't give up on IC steam just yet! Bachmann makes several different engines that can be used to replicate as-built IC engines, as does Proto 2000. There are also a few other older plastic engines out there that can be used as "stand-in" models for various IC steam.

A short list looks something like this:
B-S 0-6-0t: 2501
B-S 2-8-0 w/Vandy: 941-993
B-S 2-8-0 w/plain: 900-911
B-S 2-10-2: 2900-3025
B-S 4-4-0: 223, 1201, 2100, 2180
B-S 4-6-0 w/63": 2341-2345, 5060-5065
B-S 4-8-2 heavy: 2400-2459
P2K 0-8-0: 3500-3569
P2K 2-10-2 heavy: 2900-3025
Athearn 4-6-2: 1179-1203, 2030-2099
IHC 2-10-2 heavy: 2800-2819
IHC 4-6-2 semi-streamlined: 1146
IHC 4-8-2 heavy: 2600-2619

And if you can find it, the old AHM 4-6-0: 231-244, 371-400, 2001-2030, 5001-5030

Most of the engines will work for stand-ins. For a bit more accuracy most will at least need their domes moved or changed, and their cabs changed. Those are the two biggest things you can do to ANY steamer to drastically change their looks. But even with just a correct IC paint job and some Champ decals, you can have yourself a pretty decent IC steam roster in no time, and for a LOT less money than what brass will demand.

Now all we need is a decent IC Mike. They "only" had 605 of them.....

[lanny]

And just think, Ray, (and all), if the ICRR had 605 Mikes, how many more similar style Harriman mikes would there have been prototypically if we add in UP, SP and other roads that used the Harriman style.

Surely, among the number of HO model railroaders who are looking for a well detailed, smooth running 2-8-2 such as is produced by Bachmann, either to run 'as is' or to use the 'kit basher's torch' on, there would be a sizeable market for such a product! 

Hint, hint, hint ... to our good friends at Bachmann industries 

(Okay Gene, what's my 'count' now? About 450 ?

lanny nicolet

[Stephen Warrington]

  Thanks guys,

For the encouragement and thanks Ray for the list I got a B-S 4-8-2 in IC paint and it looks good. I guess in my steam world Paducah KY didn't exist pardon the bad spelling tonight  had a very rough day health wise and really feeeling it tonight.

HMM, Maybe I need to model the  Mississippi Central or Y&MV as  separate roads from the IC. but finding a  2-8-2 this small impossible



Stephen

[Orsonroy]

Thanks guys,

HMM, Maybe I need to model the  Mississippi Central or Y&MV as  separate roads from the IC. but finding a  2-8-2 this small impossible

Hi Stephen,

Your best bet would be to use one of Bachmann's SY 2-8-2s and de-Chinese it. Basically, strip off a lot of the non-American looking details, especially the cab, and paint everything that's red black. You'll likely have to change the tender too, but the end resuly would be a nice, completely un-USRA looking small 2-8-2, like those on the Mississippi Central.

One of these days I'll spring for one of the SYs and try my hand on a conversion. I know of one IC steam fan who's slowly working on one to turn it into IC 3969.