Current vs new product for On30

[foles1]

Someone mentioned today Bachmann is selling some stuff cheap, so the question from a business standpoint arises: " Is Bachmann getting out of the On30 business?"

Many, many of us have invested time,  dollars, and enthusiasm in this product line, enhanced it's reputation in the hobby, made a bunch of new friends along the way.  One of the biggest fans of On30 was Lee Riley himself, bur we haven't heard anything from him in a long time.

The comments about product in the warehouse is disturbing as to me, it means there is no emphasis about this scale.  How long can they push the old stuff that they built too much of.  How many articulated locomotives do we need?  Geared locos are great...., but the price is prohibitive to most.

Some folks have suggested going back to the early, simpler products that started the On30 frenzy.....2-6-0's, small 18 ft rolling stock, and a remake of the Davenports, and the Porter(both). a dependable, reasonable railtruck come to mind.

I wonder if we might get a reply to these comments. I fear for the future of On30

Bob Foley

[Royce Wilson]

Bob,I think you are correct. A lot of folks have begged for catalog type Porter locomotives like a small 2-6-0 and maybe a heaver 0-4-0 and I think one of those small Maine two foot tye Forneys would have done well.The 18ft freight cars are fantasic and I just hope they are not too little too late.
I just can't imagine that Bachmann sold very many articulated's and the 4-6-0 engines as they are just too large for many garage layouts.

Just my 5 cents worth
Royce Wilson

[foles1]

Thanks for the reply Royce.
I believe Bachmann started out with the right idea, and product, but lost sight and control of the program early on.  No quality control, designers had no concept of scale or  need for specific items.
I hope they can get back to basics and bring us the things we need.  Upside to that is that we would buy the right stuff. I think a lot of folks willl agree with that.

Enough for now.

Bob

[hminky]

The On30 bubble has deflated just like all narrow gauge model bubbles.

Harold

EDIT: Said that On30 was starting to wind down 5 years ago. Banned from the On30 Conspiracy for spreading that blasphemy.

[Royce Wilson]

Things I wished Bachmann had done:

1. Made the Bachmann Porter where the boiler could be removed as this would made sence for bashing projects.

2. Made a more American 4-4-0 instead of that OF 4-4-0 and the little 2 foot 4-4-0 or at least made a small Porter 2-6-0.

3.Made more generic freight cars or at least made them with more removable parts so the doors could be changed.

4. I think the Baldwin 2-8-0 C-16 would have made a better choice than the 4-6-0.

That's my complaints and Harold we love your work so keep it up.

Royce Wilson

[Chatham]

I think that some of the blame belongs with ourselves. As POGO once said, "We have met the enemy and he is us"

Who wanted bigger and bigger locomotives? (why build narrow gauge and want big?)
Who wanted everything to be DCC? Who asked for sound included?
 
Bachmann gave us all that and more and then we complain about the cost?

There have been some great suggestions for future locomotives and rolling stock. Lets hope it isn't too late and that we haven't shot ourselves in the foot already.

Go back to basics and make everything DCC and/or sound READY and see if that changes anything. Does anyone build anything themselves any longer?

Just an old man's thoughts is all, just sayin"

[foles1]

Interesting.

I concur with everything said here.  Harold, I remember the Conspiracy flap. but you hit it  on the head. Hope someone at B'mann comes to their senses.  Did their HOn30 stuff catch on?  Don't think so. I worked for a Japanese company that didn't listen, and they lost a big chunk of their US sales.

Guess we wait and see.

Bob

[Kevin Strong]

We're seeing a similar slowdown in 1:20.3. We haven't gotten anything "new" in two years or more, largely because Bachmann is still selling off their production runs before they commit to new inventory. We're due an updated 1880s vintage 2-6-0, which will certainly be welcome, but it's still old tooling with new paint (and updated mechanics, thankfully, here's hoping they're available separately to retrofit older models).

"Why?" is the $64,000 question. A few considerations as I see it, because I think there are many parallels between what's happening in 1:20.3 and On30. First and foremost, there's the kinds of railroads we're modeling. These are narrow gauge lines, typically more "backwoods" than if we were modeling the D&RGW or similar. We certainly don't need fleets of dozens of locos as we might if we were modeling the Pennsy or Santa Fe. Railroads of the ilk we're modling would likely have a dozen locos at most on their roster--perhaps that number would be an all-time roster, with only four or five locos active on the roster at any one given era.

Rolling stock, I think, also falls into a similar vein. If I put more than 16 freight cars on my railroad, I'm tripping over them when I try to operate. Most On30 pikes I've seen in the magazines are fairly parallel to mine. How much more rolling stock do you need once you've filled all your sidings to capacity? In my case, I've got cases of rolling stock that I bring to shows, and another set that runs on the railroad, but even then you can only have so much.

Cost, too, comes into play. Long-gone are the days of $40 - $50 locomotives. Heck, even $90 - $100 is a rarity these days for the small scales. When I price On30 stuff at my local shop, I'm looking at $150 - $300 per loco. Hard to justify buying two at those prices. (Think that's bad, large scale locos run $400 - $800 each!) If you're adding DCC sound decoders (to the ones that don't have them already) that's an added expense.

Speaking in parallel analysis between 1:20 and On30, I don't see things necessarily dying, but what I do see is folks have bought what they "need," which drove the rapid expansion we enjoyed in the "early years" of the scales. Now, they've simply slowed down and are now only buying what they "want." I don't think anyone's going away, but there's definitely a saturation factor in play.

Later,

K

[p51]

I don't see Bachmann products getting cheaper at all. In fact, I've watched them climb in price, so much so that I doubt I could justify the cost to re-create my rolling stock roster today if I'd had to start the project now instead of the days when you could easily find freight cars for less than $20 each.

I think the Baldwin 2-8-0 C-16 would have made a better choice than the 4-6-0.

I have talked with some Bachmann folks at a couple of shows and they've all told me that the ten-wheeler was actually a decent seller. If it wasn't for that locomotive, I never would have gotten back into model trains. A certain well-placed person at Bachmann is a big ET&WNC RR fan, and that's the ten-wheeler prototype. So that explains why they have it.
I'm thankful Bachmann made those as that's all I ever wanted in NG.
I've also seen a lot of great bash projects (in person and in magazines) done off of them.

[traingeek]

As a frequent business traveler to China, I have seen prices there climb quickly and steadily for some years.  The Chinese currency has appreciated against the dollar and wages have been going up at an extremely high rate.  No wonder the Bachmann has been forced to raise prices, especially as model making is very labor intensive.  That said, even though I have circled the globe to find the last of steam, the choice of obscure foreign locos for production has been misguided.  In my opinion, future releases  of  more basic domestic  locos of modest proportions would be more salable.

[p51]

That said, even though I have circled the globe to find the last of steam, the choice of obscure foreign locos for production has been misguided.  In my opinion, future releases  of  more basic domestic  locos of modest proportions would be more salable.

If you're talking about the stuff they make for other countries, I understand that Bachmann has a pretty large market in the UK and EU. As for the Chinese prototype HO stuff they make, I have no idea how those are selling...

[traingeek]

As Bachmann manufactures in China, the prices it must charge we consumers are dependent upon wages and costs in China.  I am a long time importer of Asian goods and am also feeling the pinch of these rising expenses as previously very poor developing countries move into middle income terrirtory.