HELP with conversion to DCC

[ejseider]

I've got a small HO layout (4' x 11').  I'm thinking of converting from analog to DCC, mainly so that I can run two engines at a time, maybe run consists for pulling up a grade, and some decent sound.  I'm getting a bit confused by the information that I'm reading and would like some help.  I've got a BLI 4-8-4 that is DCC ready, , a Bachmann 4-8-4 and a Bachmann 0-6-0 both of which are currently analog only.  I've looked at Bachmann and Digitrax, and right now I'm leaning toward a Digitrax Zephyr Xtra set-up since it looks simple for a starter and has adequate capacity for my set-up. Any opinions or alternate recommendations?
I'm unsure of what to use for the decoders to convert my Bachmann engines to run on DCC. Digitrax installation manuals for their decoders seem to be very detailed and helpful, other brands not so much.  Any help here would be appreciated.
I'm confused about sound decoders.  I'd obviously want to install the decoder and speaker in the tender.  But how do I get power to it?From the engine?  If from the engine then I'd prefer to use connectors so that I can uncouple the tender from the engine when I need to perform maintenance, but where can I get the connectors?  Any recommendations on sound decoders and speakers?

[Trainman203]

You have to understand  that geeks really revel in DCC and can, and do, make it WAY MORE COMPLICATED than it really has to be.

Buy a sound equipped engine right now so you can enjoy right away the benefits of DCC operation without having to be a geek before you can do anything at all.  Then, pay a tech to fix a couple of your engines up with sound.  Unless you REALLY LIKE electronics and soldering, all that decoder  install work is not for you.  After you get train operation going , THEN you can geek all weekend without having to be done with it to operate at all.  You are not ready to make all those decoder and speaker choices yet.  After you operate a while, you will understand better.

I'm sure the entry level Bachmann DCC system is fine.  I used EZ command for a year and then moved on to wireless NCE, which only required a switch out of the main command station and nothing else.  NCE gave great advice in their set up instructions.  Hook your system up first to either a loop of track or a short piece of straight track to get used to the throttle and to operation before you redo the layout.  After a day of that I was ready to change over the whole layout.  "That" took about 10 minutes , see below.

With a 4x11 layout, don't let the geeks talk you into breaking the layout into blocks with individual circuit breakers, boosters, and on and on.  They do all of that because they like electronics, not because the railroad of your size needs it.   I have a more involved railroad than yours, 50' of mainline and 20 switches, and for more than 8 years I've run just fine with TWO wires to feed power to the track and nothing else...... with NO PROBLEMS.

Once you try DCC / sound, you will NEVER GO BACK to what feels like pushing a corpse around the track.

Good luck.  It's all really pretty easy.

[kewatin]

have you considered a NCE POWER CAB. for me the learning curve was easier than the digitrax.they also sell decoders for most any application you would want.for starters you can just hook up your dcc power source to power your layout&later you can add a main buss feed around your layout &add feeders every 3 ft.there is a well know train supplier in maryland that uses a single feed hookup to run their store layout using kato track &has been running for a few yrs now.regarding your dcc ready locos you will just need to add a decoder&some soldering might be involved.some other mfg's just drop in&some you just plug in.in regards to unhooking your tenders for servicing,why would you want to do that other than changing  or adding a decoder.you can clean your train wheels by placing unit  in a support foam cradle or place on track using  alcohol swab pads.if you want to see how easy it is to program a loco using the nce power cab,google arthur housten's web site.i am sure there will be a lot of comment about whose system to use,but again my preference is the power cab,i can run 6 locos at one time with dcc and or 3 safely with dcc&sound i switched from dc to dcc at age 69 and am 75 now it it was easier than anticipated.
good luck &goodday  regards&later KEWATIN

[Trainman203]

I should also have said ...... Wireless is simpler.  That is how I run with only two wires to power the track.  Unless you are wireless, you need to tun two more wires to the track to send the DCC signals to the engine.  They call that the "cab bus.".

[Trainman203]

I do also have a NCE power cab for a small portable layout.  It is very good too.  The only flaw is that it assumes you have a layout fascia to attach a bus plug into.  I don't have a fascia on that layout, so I figured a way to get it all into a plastic tackle box so I could carry it around with the layout.

I'm not getting into pros and cons of various DCC systems.  I also have a digitrax throttle for the club layout.  I like NCE better.  Some folks feel differently.. 

[jward]

I should also have said ...... Wireless is simpler.  That is how I run with only two wires to power the track.  Unless you are wireless, you need to tun two more wires to the track to send the DCC signals to the engine.  They call that the "cab bus.".

??


what is a cab bus and why is it needed in addition to the track connections?

dcc sends the signals from the command station to the rails. only two wires are theoretically needed to do this, though adding parallel track connections greatly improves the reliability of dcc.

[Len]

You can find decoder installation infor on the B'mann 4-8-4 'Niagra' here:

http://www.tcsdcc.com/Customer_Content/Installation_Pictures/HO_Scale/Bachmann/Niagara%204-8-4/bachman_niagra_4-8-4.htm

Even if you use someone else's decoder, the install process is the same.

Is the 0-6-0 the 'Saddle Tank', or the "Smoke/Lights" version with a tender? The installation's are different.

Len

[Trainman203]

I'm a model railroader, not a DCC geek.  I saw "cab bus"somewhere in some over complicated bunch of stuff.  I'm a two wire guy, have great operation, and am perfectly satisfied. Look in all the encyclopedias people have written about DCC, "cab bus" will be there.

[Hunt]

Focus on NCE Power Cab* and the Digitrax Zephyr Xtra.  Connect the system of your choice to your layout per DCC systems manufacturer's instructions.  Run a DCC locomotive with sound around your layout and you will quickly find out if your present layout wiring meets the minimum requirements of DCC.



*NCE Power Cab, with good reasons, requires all locomotives it controls to be DCC decoder equipped.

[Hunt]

Search 'Cab Bus' on NCE Information Station webpage. Trainman203's recollection is faulty. 

[Trainman203]

At my age you all should be understanding, and gently helpful. 

[ejseider]

the 0-6-0 is the version with a tender.  It was a Christmas present.

[Jerrys HO]

With a 4x11 layout, don't let the geeks talk you into breaking the layout into blocks with individual circuit breakers, boosters, and on and on.  They do all of that because they like electronics, not because the railroad of your size needs it.   I have a more involved railroad than yours, 50' of mainline and 20 switches, and for more than 8 years I've run just fine with TWO wires to feed power to the track and nothing else...... with NO PROBLEMS.

Geeks are smarter than you give them credit for. The reason they use block control is for narrowing down problems whether it's track work, wiring or unforseen objects shorting the layout. I wish I had known or thought of this before doing my layout and I am not an electronics guru or geek as you refer to them.

@ejseider.... Think of getting a new DCC On Board 0-6-0 till you get more experience in converting, I hear this one will age you quickly  .

Jerry

[jward]

RIGHT ON JERRY, RIGHT ON....

[Trainman203]

 Until I understood the nature of model railroad  DCC geeking for geeking's sake, I couldn't  figure out DCC either, it was buried in a swirl of absurd insider techno talk wherever I looked.  NCE gave the best advice........ Hook it up simply to just a piece of track and when you are comfortable put it on your layout.  Once the static got cut through, DCC became easy.  I'm now one of the better steam engine DCC cv set guys on the Gulf Coast, I set up all the steam engines at the club.  I knew more about steam engine Cv's than an installer at a regional HS.  But all I do is get the engines running and sounding right... I don't  get into all of the overboard blocking and bussing track stuff.  And I've never found it necessary.

Model railroading has always had its share of frustrated electricians building model railroads when they ought to be building radios or computers instead.  They were around in the early 60s when I first subscribed to MR.  Except back then they were doing "transistor throttles", trying to get open frame motor engines to crawl.  They were also doing an alternative engine-crawl thing called "pulse-power."  They were doing "high-frequency lighting" to keep the headlights on all the time when the DC power was off, to stop the train.  They were doing hundreds of variations of signalling circuits.  They were doing slow motion switch machine circuits. And they were doing any number of convoluted electrical ways to individually  control  trains in those pre DCC days.  In short ..... they were doing everything except RUN TRAINS!!!!!!i they were dominating the magazines in those days.  I recall thinking that they ought to have a separate magazine.

I told the original poster  the same thing.  Get a DCC / sound engine before you try to figure out the geeking.   I let techs do that stuff for me.  Keeps me young