Bachmann E-Z Track Switches/Turnouts and Derailments

[Rangerover]

While I agree track and wheel gauge is important, the NMRA gauge is not the "fix-all" for derailment problems. I do not have the gauge, frankly I'm not fond of "go-nogo" gauges, prefer to use a precision digital caliper.

Here's the problem. A modeler checks a wheelset and finds it .002" too narrow. Of course the modeler doesn't realize the error is insignificant, only that the wheels must be pulled and twisted to get it "exactly right" according to the gauge.

In almost 3 years of modeling, I have never had to adjust the gauge of any wheelset or track section.  My trains run smooth, even through turnouts, and I seldom have a derail except on a new car that is not properly tuned and adjusted.

The NMRA tool is handy, but should be used with discretion and common sense. What I am alluding to is, don't be so preoccupied with gauge that you overlook other causes of derails, of which there are many.

Bob absolutely correct, experience and patience, when all else fails step back and take a deep breath. Then check out all variables and possibility's thoroughly!

[BradKT]

I tried loosening the screws that hold the trucks on the cars in question and that seems to have solve many of the problems.  For one group of about 12 cars (mainly 50' boxcars), I simply replaced the trucks with Athearn trucks instead of the ones supplied and had only 1 car derail in 2 hours of running my trains...so that seems to have taken care of most of the problem.

Once again, Yampa Bob, you made an excellent suggestion.  Thank you.

[Yampa Bob]

You're welcome Brad.  You mentioned replacing trucks and wheels. I have had good success with the complete truck/wheelsets by Model Power.  I have used over 50 sets on car rebuilds, they are great rollers out of the package.

If you get the chance, pick up a couple packs and try them out, I think you will like them.

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXWN06&P=SM

[pdlethbridge]

I have a bunch of those as well and they are good runners.

[don1884]

I probably should have read this posting before I posted the same problem with a #6 crossover. The replies to your posting were excellent information, especially the reference to the 2003 article on derailments. I wish the both of us "Good Luck" in solving the problem.

[Yampa Bob]

Hi Don
Hope the suggestions help to resolve your crossover problems.

Regards

[don1884]

 Hey Brad, I was wondering how you made out with your derailments. I replied to your posting that I was having the same problem with the EZ track #6 crossover. After hours of trying to figure out what was causing the problem. I'll do my best to try and explain how I corrected the problem. I think your problem was identical. There was no problem if the train was switching from the inside track to the outside track. If the train was going straight through the crossover you could hear a bump and see a little jump as the engine hit the beginning of the turnout. The engine would make it through but all the subsequent cars would derail. There is a little black tab on the inside of the switch track ( I'm sure I'm not using the correct terminology ) but when it was set to go straight through the crossover that little black tab was catching the inside ( right side wheels ) wheels of the cars bumping them of the switch rail onto the regular track and causing them to try and go right when in fact they were suppose to go straight. Thus the derailment. I was initially going to try and sand off approx. 1/32 of an inch on that black tab, but I decided to just push it down with my thumb several times and just like a miracle the train went through without derailing. Not believing in such a simple solution I've run the train through the crossover about 25 times today at varying speeds and have not experienced a derailment since I pushed that silly black tab down with my thumb. I tried switching cars, adding weight to the cars etc. before this worked. Let me know how you make out. I know the other turnouts don't have the black tabs. I have had derailments with the other turnouts, but they seem to correct themselves after 2 or 3 derailments. I think Gremlins sneak down into the basement at night and try to sabotage the equipment. Good Luck.......... Don1884

[BradKT]

Don 1884:

Sorry to delay getting back to you...I was out of town.

I also went back and took a good hard look at how the track was mounted leading to the derailments...which led to me taking up and re-laying about 3' of track between the 2 problem switches.  That 3' length of track had a few small peaks and valleys in it...in areas, the track was secured too tightly.  That immediately solved the problem with the first of the two switches.  I could see the cars tilt and sway as they went through the sections just before and after the section with the second switch.  I am still working on that one and am going to make sure that the track is absolutely level before doing anything else.

I am also going to try your suggestion re: that black tab.  Good call!

[BradKT]

Once last thought...and this is important.  I have had excellent results with rehabilitating freight cars (particularly Athearn) and eliminating the derailment problem when I replaced the trucks and I also replaced the undercarriage!!!  Sometimes, the lip on the undercarriage that the truck is supposed to slip over (and then be secured by the screw that mounts the truck to the body) is all beat up, flattened or warped.  If you have a bad undercarriage, even if you put on brand new trucks, they won't swivel and sway correctly and the derailment problem will continue.  I have successfully rehabilitated several freight car this way and eliminated derailment problems on both curves and switches.

If you can't get the undercarriages for Athearn freight cars from your local hobby shop, you can get them (3 for $2.25 I think) from Athearn.  Athearn parts also fit Roundhouse freight cars (floors, undercarriages, weights and trucks).  Just go to Athearn.com and check their parts list for the stock number and you can order them over the internet.  I have discovered that it's more than worth it to keep a few spares on hand and recommend that you do so.

Now that I have relaid that section of track, adjusted some wheelsets and replaced some undercarriages and wheelsets, the derailment problem has been substantially reduced and almost completely eliminated.   It is limited now to only 2 or 3 cars that I am going to replace some parts on (it's always the same 2 or 3 cars)...not the switches.  The engines are staying on the track now, too.  It appears that the problem is pretty much solved.

OK, I think we have covered this topic.  The discussion was excellent...as usual.  Thanks everybody!

[WGL]

 On the terminology, "switches" or turnouts," I find in Walthers' sale catalog an HO scale "Modern Switchman" ("not turnout man), although they call their "switches" "turnouts."  Why "turnout," instead of "turnin" or "turninandout"?   

[Yampa Bob]

That's why a real switchman never refers to them as "turnouts".  For purpose of communication on the board, we usually refer to the assembly as a "turnout" to differentiate from the electrical control "switch" that powers the solenoid.

Of course, if a member says his train derails at the "switch", I can assume he did not run over the control switch so I never correct him.

Whether "turnout" or "turnin", the device does change direction "away from" the through track, and "away" to me means "out".  Does that make sense? 

Now I'm "away from here".....

[WGL]

 Bob, thanks for turning out another instructive comment.   

[Yampa Bob]

Since it's getting late (or is it early?) think I better "turn in".   

[CandO]

I am having a similar problem with my WBB on a Lionel O60 FasTrack remote switch. I have not yet fooled around to find the source of problem.

Mine happens this way:
  When my AA unit heads for the turnout, the lead unit starts to round the curve and then the back end of the Dummy A goes on the straight. This opens the switch so the next car runs straight and derails the train.

My Lionel switcher, and K-line switcher have no problem on this O60 switch.
After reading this post, it sounds like mine has to do with a wheel spacing being slightly off.  I need to check this out.

[Jim Banner]

If you refer to the catalogues of the companies making switches/turnouts, you will quickly find that the switch is part of a turnout.  The whole real world version of what we call a turnout is called a "turnout".  But the part of the turnout that a switch man throws, namely the point rails (the ones that move) and their linkages is called a "switch."

When you are building your railroad (scale or full size) you install "turnouts."  But when you are operating your railroad (scale or full size) you throw "switches."

On to the next important topic: are you building/operating a "railroad" or a "railway??"

Jim