Good Morning All,
Can anyone out there give me a comparison between the Bachmann Berkshire and the Proto 2000? Why would one make a better purchase over the other? DCC included is not a selling factor for me.
Good morning, Bob!
I just picked up the C&O #2724 version of the Berkshire. I can't give a comparison, but I can give you my observations of the Bachmann engine.
Tender
I run DC, so I opened the tender shell, removing four screws in the corners of the frame. Easy to do. Did not have to remove the trucks to do so. Unplugging the decoder and inserting the dummy plugs was also easy. I put a little tape on the decoder plug (to prevent shorts) and left the decoder in place. The speaker baffle appears easily accessible for the sound gurus.
The double brush pickups tap current from four of the twelve tender wheels; two left and two right. It could actually be picking up from two more wheels, but I couldn't see any brushes on the middle truck wheels.
I noticed a slight amount of overspray on the white wall tires. I may have to sand, or rub off the paint from the treads. Like I said, it's slight and may not affect current pick up.
There is a working reverse light.
The top of the ladder appears to be bent at a slight angle (from packaging). As it looks plastic, I'm not going to try to straighten it. It's only noticeable from close observation.
There doesn't seem to be any drag in the tender, and the brushes seem to be making good contact. Wiring seems to be secure, also.
The connector plugs are a little different than my Connies. I don't see any tabs that click in place when inserting to the locomotive. I think that's a good thing. Less danger of breaking a wire when storing back in it's box.
Storage
It's a blue box of course (not Spectrum). The inner mounting plastic folds over the whole engine and snaps to together. It hold the engine well. There's also an additional clear plastic sleeve to hold the inner case. Slips in and out of the box easily.
Locomotive
All eight drive wheels have current pick up. The brushes make good contact, even when moving the wheels side-to-side.
The valve gear and drive rods are not loose or wobbly, if you get my meaning. The color is a nice iron gray with a little sheen.
I did not see any overspray from the white wall tires. Lettering is sharp. Even the small print is readable.
Engine seems to have good weight. I also like all the little details. Surprised it's not a Spectrum (then neither is the Connie anymore).
Admittedly, I haven't run the engine, yet. It's brand spankin' new. I need to finish some trackwork and clean up the layout before its maiden voyage.
Not much to go on, I know, but so far, I really like my new baby.
Regards,
Jonathan
p.s. There are no crew members. Maybe that's why it's not a Spectrum :D
I have the Bachmann and run it regularly
I am well satisfied
And you can get it here
http://www.modeltrainstuff.com/category_s/1724.htm
Or here, you can also bid and could get it much cheaper. Great dealer and quick delivery.
http://cgi.ebay.com/BACHMANN-HO-DCC-EQUIPPED-2-8-4-TRAIN-UNLETTERED-50949-/370367945238?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item563ba65a16 (http://cgi.ebay.com/BACHMANN-HO-DCC-EQUIPPED-2-8-4-TRAIN-UNLETTERED-50949-/370367945238?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item563ba65a16)
I have the standard line Bachmann Berkshire and love it however the pilot wheels derail every other blue moon but not a big deal for my little engineer as he likes putting the engines back on and off and back on and off...well you get the idea
ebt-
uncbob found a great deal on the Bachmann Berk with DCC for under $100. I see the same place has MTH Berks with DCC and sound, but they're $450!!!. For that money, I'd buy three of the Bachmann engines and three sound bugs, install everything and sell two of the lokies on ebay to make the one I keep free. The MTH unit is a fine model but it's certainly not worth four (and a half) Bachmann engines. Just sayin'.
--D
Bob,
You got me curious, so I looked up the P2K version of the Berk. The MSRP is more than twice the Bachmann version. I wonder if the P2K version is a stronger puller, or made of sturdier stuff?
Also, I noticed the P2K version is not two toned. That is to say the smoke box is not a graphite color, neither is the ash pit area a different color.
Since the P2K version is no longer produced, are you considering a used one, or one that happens to be in a LHS?
I'm afraid my P2K engines are diesels. They run beautifully. I have never seen a P2K steamer running on a track. I saw some P2K Berk comments in this forum's history, but nothing of a comparison.
Regards,
Jonathan
p.s. Just found some comments from B&ORRF on comparison of the two engines.
http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,5546.0.html
The Walthers/Lifelike Berkshire is much more detailed (more seprately applied detaisl) and offers both boiler versions, C&O and Nickle Plate. The sand dome and some other details are changed between the two.
The Bachmann Berk is based on the C&O version and although less detailed, seems to be a great deal for the price. It really depends on how much you are worried about the correct details as to which you would want.
Bachmann made both NP and C&O
Quote from: skipgear on May 19, 2010, 09:02:34 AM
The Walthers/Lifelike Berkshire is much more detailed (more seprately applied detaisl) and offers both boiler versions, C&O and Nickle Plate. The sand dome and some other details are changed between the two.
The Bachmann Berk is based on the C&O version and although less detailed, seems to be a great deal for the price. It really depends on how much you are worried about the correct details as to which you would want.
The level of detail is slightly higher on the Proto Heritage model, but the price of the Proto is at least twice as high as the Bachmann.
If you were to check the product section of this web site, or if you were to veiw the catalogue you would find Bachmann made both the C&O and NKP versions.
Ok all, thankyou for your input. The Proto engine is hard to find as it has been a while since it was introduced. I will have to mull all this over and decide if I want either of the 2-8-4s. Thanks again.
Quote from: jonathan on May 19, 2010, 07:40:27 AM
I'm afraid my P2K engines are diesels. They run beautifully.
Meh. I can disagree with that with the one P2K engine I had. A Santa Fe GP30. Never ran. Could never get it to run, always ended up smoking. I have their Subway set, and its pretty good, other than the pantographs not being glued in and I lost one :P. I don't think I'll ever buy another Proto 2000/1000 engine unless its something I REALLY want.
By the way, the GP30 ended up being destroyed by "accidentally" falling off of my friends shelf layout. Note "accidentally" is in quotes.
Quote from: Blink_182_Fan on May 20, 2010, 07:12:53 PM
Meh. I can disagree with that with the one P2K engine I had. A Santa Fe GP30. Never ran. Could never get it to run, always ended up smoking. I have their Subway set, and its pretty good, other than the pantographs not being glued in and I lost one :P. I don't think I'll ever buy another Proto 2000/1000 engine unless its something I REALLY want.
By the way, the GP30 ended up being destroyed by "accidentally" falling off of my friends shelf layout. Note "accidentally" is in quotes.
The GP 20 & 30 series were the only Proto 2000 locos that ever had issues. And when you bought yours, everyone else knew that they had issues, so they did not buy them. And the Proto 1000 subway set wasn't Life-Like's/Walther's/orP1K's fault, all it takes is gentle handling and care. I still contend that from the sounds of it you are not using as much care as what is required for finely detailed HO scale representations (models). If you are having trouble handling locomotives I suggest you try purchasing less detailed model, which will save you money and you won't lose or break your detail parts. Another alternative may be moving to a larger scale where locomotives are less prone to damage from rough handling, and the detail parts are harder to lose or break.
unc-
You are right to ponder this decision as it's an important one. None of us has unlimited funds so we must be careful to buy only what we will use and enjoy. Also, you might decide another steamer is more in keeping with your layout. If it is small with tight curves something as large as a Berk might look a little silly. On the other hand, maybe you just want a NKP Berk. I can understand that.
As a kid growing up in Indiana in the 1950s, I saw them all of the time and they were very impressive. We had to cross the NKP mainline (and the Pennsy!) to get from our home in the country to town. The NKP mainline crossed our road, what was once US30, on a curve so the superelevated track made it seem like the speeding locos were not just going by, but overhead, too. I'll never forget it, although it was pretty scary when I was really little or if I was on my bike. Thanks for giving me a reason to drift around in some good old memories for a while.
--D
Here is a big pic of the Bachmann if it will help
http://bandb3536.com/npberk.jpg
Quote from: ABC on May 20, 2010, 07:32:40 PM
The GP 20 & 30 series were the only Proto 2000 locos that ever had issues. And when you bought yours, everyone else knew that they had issues, so they did not buy them. And the Proto 1000 subway set wasn't Life-Like's/Walther's/orP1K's fault, all it takes is gentle handling and care. I still contend that from the sounds of it you are not using as much care as what is required for finely detailed HO scale representations (models). If you are having trouble handling locomotives I suggest you try purchasing less detailed model, which will save you money and you won't lose or break your detail parts. Another alternative may be moving to a larger scale where locomotives are less prone to damage from rough handling, and the detail parts are harder to lose or break.
Well, the pantograph falling off wasnt my fault. It derailed on a switch, and almost took a tumble to the floor, but in the process, the pantograph fell off. And, several of the pantographs were out of their holes when I bought the set. I had no clue that the GP20's and 30's were really the only ones that had problems. Any other of my engines aren't extremely detailed, the only other engines I have are from Athearn (non Genesis) and Bachmann Blue Box, as engines haven't been a real importance to me so far. I mainly focus on frieght cars now. And I don't have the money to move up to a larger scale, and then I wouldn't be able to run them on my friend's layout.
All in all, I do take good care of my trains. The only ones I really don't take care of are Life Like standard cars and engines, since you can get a GP-whatever for about 10 bucks.
unc-
B-E-A-Utiful!! Thanks. I'm using one to build a Polar Express for my grandson who is in love with the story, the train and the music.
--D
I've been reading this thread awhile. I cannot directly address the berks however, I can say from the products that I do have that most of my locomotives both steam and diesel that run on a regular basis are Bachmann. They seem to strike the right balance between not being too toy like for me in terms of operation or quality and on the other hand being too fragile (detail wise) that they fall apart from normal handling.
BTW I had the same problem with the pantographs falling off the subway set, so I glued them on.
Quote from: Blink_182_Fan on May 20, 2010, 09:29:59 PMWell, the pantograph falling off wasnt my fault. It derailed on a switch, and almost took a tumble to the floor, but in the process, the pantograph fell off. And, several of the pantographs were out of their holes when I bought the set. I had no clue that the GP20's and 30's were really the only ones that had problems. Any other of my engines aren't extremely detailed, the only other engines I have are from Athearn (non Genesis) and Bachmann Blue Box, as engines haven't been a real importance to me so far. I mainly focus on frieght cars now. And I don't have the money to move up to a larger scale, and then I wouldn't be able to run them on my friend's layout.
All in all, I do take good care of my trains. The only ones I really don't take care of are Life Like standard cars and engines, since you can get a GP-whatever for about 10 bucks.
So it's Proto 1000's fault the loco derailed is what your saying. For the record I did not say it was your fault, I just said it didn't seem to be the manufacturer's fault. And for the GP-30, you just happened to be unlucky to choose that loco I guess. Had you been a few years wiser, you would have been able to make a more informed decision and as a result have a better perspective on Proto 2000 products, which as a whole is really pretty solid aside from their two large blunders, one of which, unfortunately, you purchased.
I also really like Proto 1000's rolling stock for their fair amount of detail, nothing that'll get lost or broken and I just bought a three pack of 100-ton hoppers for $25 total. Not too shabby for three hoppers. They are great for the money considering that they have Proto-max metal knuckle couplers (the equivalent of Kadee #5s) and nice free-rolling metal wheel-sets.
Here they are, the Proto 100 hoppers I purchased:
(http://www.walthers.com/prodimage/0920/09200000037008.gif)
Quote from: ABC on May 21, 2010, 03:03:29 PM
So it's Proto 1000's fault the loco derailed is what your saying. For the record I did not say it was your fault, I just said it didn't seem to be. the manufacturer's fault. And for the GP-30, you just happened to be unlucky to choose that loco I guess. Had you been a few years wiser, you would have been able to make a more informed decision and as a result have a better perspective on Proto 2000 products, which as a whole is really pretty solid aside from their two large blunders, one of which, unfortunately, you purchased.
I also really like Proto 1000's rolling stock for their fair amount of detail, nothing that'll get lost or broken and I just bought three pack of 100-ton hoppers for $25. total. Not too shabby for three hoppers. They are great for the money considering that they have Proto-max metal knuckle couplers (the equivalent of Kadee #5s) and nice free-rolling metal wheel-sets.
I wasn't saying it was their fault, I know it was mine, I guess. I wasn't blaming them.
I will admit that their rolling stock does seem pretty nice, from what I've seen online and at hobby stores. I guess I was just unlucky with my GP30. I know it sounded like I'm not going to buy any Proto engine or rolling stock, but just probably not until they come out with something I need or want, and at a decent price. :)
I agree about the Life Like cars I have some and they really are not worth doing maintence on. I also have a few of those cheap Life Like Locos Same comment.
I gotta vote on Bachmanns 2-8-4. I have 3 of them, 2 in C&O and 1 in B&O and they out pull my LLP2K BErkshire
(http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac49/BaltoOhioRRFanCollection/Website/bo9788.jpg)
^Bachmann
(http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac49/BaltoOhioRRFanCollection/Website/bo504.jpg)
^Proto 2000
to me the Bachmann one looks better, while the Proto has a better low speed it lacks pulling power and very delicate detail parts. I had the Bachmann one pulling 24 hopper cars with out any slipping on a slight incline. the LLP2K one had hard time pulling 5 spectrum heavyweights.
ABC-
So it's Proto 1000's fault the loco derailed is what your saying.
Blink neither said explicitly nor implied that Proto 1000 had any responsibility for the derailment. All he said is that the pantograph fell off when the train almost made a swan dive to the floor. And he isn't attacking Proto/Life Like, or you either, for that matter. He's just telling us about his experience. I, for one, and I know I'm not alone in this, enjoy hearing about everyone else's experiences. I learn a lot from it and I enjoy the opportunity to kick ideas around. But I don't think anyone is getting personal or trying to put a bad rap on some product or manufacturer that doesn't deserve it.
I've said this before and I'll say it again: Let's all just be friends and stick to the topic at hand so we can all enjoy this thing.
--D
Has anyone taken the plunge and got one of the new Berkshires from MTH? or even seen one in person?
how do the MTH compare to the two already mentioned? the descriptions suggest lots of detail.
The pricetag reflects that too.
Features;
Die-Cast Boiler and Tender Body
Die-Cast Metal Chassis
Authentic Paint Scheme & Cab Numbers
RP-25 Metal Wheels Mounted On Metal Axles
Directionally Controlled Constant Voltage Headlight
Operating MARS Light
Prototypical Rule 17 Lighting
Detailed Truck Sides
Detailed Cab Interior
Opening Cab Roof Hatch
Powerful 5-Pole Precision Flywheel Equipped Motor
(2) Scale Kadee Compatible Couplers
Metal Handrails and Decorative Bell
Decorative Metal Whistle
Sprung Drive Wheels
Synchronized Puffing ProtoSmoker System
Locomotive Speed Control In Scale MPH Increments
Detailed Tender Undercarriage
Interchangeable Traction Tire-Equipped Drive Wheels
On-Board DCC Receiver
Operates On Code 70, 83, & 100 Rail Curves
Wireless Drawbar
Engineer and Fireman Figures
Operating Marker Lights
Lighted Number Boards
Operating Tender Back-up Light
the thing has TRACTION tires? ok so i have an aversion to traction tires.
Prototypical Rule 17 lighting? I have no idea what that is or means but by golly this thing has it!
After seeing some MTH engines up close, they are pretty. But I don't know if they are double or triple price pretty. An engine can only run so well (diminishing returns compared to tracklaying quality). Perhaps it has something to do with them being made in the USA (DC area?)
Again, not trying to saying anything disparaging (the Code), they are really nice, just beyond my needs or means.
Regards,
Jonathan
Those MTH Berks are outstanding but the price is truly daunting. As I said earlier, buy three Bachmann Berks and three Sound Bugs. Install the bugs, sell two locos on ebay and keep the third for free!
--D
The Proto Kanawha's can barely pull their own tender. Go Bachmann. (OTOH, there are errors for C&O)
Gene
Quote from: SteamGene on May 23, 2010, 07:11:34 PM
The Proto Kanawha's can barely pull their own tender. Go Bachmann. (OTOH, there are errors for C&O)
Gene
True for their first run production locomotives. The subsequent runs include an additional driver with traction tires. Pull much better. However, I would not buy a locomotive with traction tires.
Also the Proto Street prices are two to three times that of the Bachmann offering. The Bachmann has slightly less detail but is not as fragile as the Walthers Proto Heritage model.
The Proto 2000 Berks are usually selling for $100 including shipping on ebay as seen in this link.http://cgi.ebay.com/HO-SCALE-PROTO-2000-C-O-2-8-4-STEAM-LOCO-1755-/250630973520?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item3a5ac52850 (http://cgi.ebay.com/HO-SCALE-PROTO-2000-C-O-2-8-4-STEAM-LOCO-1755-/250630973520?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item3a5ac52850)
The Bachmann 2-8-4's are going for roughly $85 to $90 including shipping as seen here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/BACHMANN-HO-DCC-EQUIPPED-2-8-4-TRAIN-UNLETTERED-50949-/200471952485?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item2ead0f3c65 (http://cgi.ebay.com/BACHMANN-HO-DCC-EQUIPPED-2-8-4-TRAIN-UNLETTERED-50949-/200471952485?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item2ead0f3c65)
So, there really is not much of a price difference. I'd pay the extra $10 for a loco that has finer details. The only thing the Bachmann loco has that the P2K one doesn't is DCC however, the P2K version with DCC and sound is going for about $160 including shipping.
Quote from: ABC on May 23, 2010, 08:58:40 PM
The Proto 2000 Berks are usually selling for $100 including shipping on ebay as seen in this link.http://cgi.ebay.com/HO-SCALE-PROTO-2000-C-O-2-8-4-STEAM-LOCO-1755-/250630973520?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item3a5ac52850 (http://cgi.ebay.com/HO-SCALE-PROTO-2000-C-O-2-8-4-STEAM-LOCO-1755-/250630973520?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item3a5ac52850)
The Bachmann 2-8-4's are going for roughly $85 to $90 including shipping as seen here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/BACHMANN-HO-DCC-EQUIPPED-2-8-4-TRAIN-UNLETTERED-50949-/200471952485?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item2ead0f3c65 (http://cgi.ebay.com/BACHMANN-HO-DCC-EQUIPPED-2-8-4-TRAIN-UNLETTERED-50949-/200471952485?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item2ead0f3c65)
So, there really is not much of a price difference. I'd pay the extra $10 for a loco that has finer details. The only thing the Bachmann loco has that the P2K one doesn't is DCC however, the P2K version with DCC and sound is going for about $160 including shipping.
ABC
Why am I not surprised you came up with an e-bay listing of a used item?
The market is not controlled by e-bay.
Quote from: Pacific Northern on May 24, 2010, 12:26:43 AMWhy am I not surprised you came up with an e-bay listing of a used item? The market is not controlled by e-bay.
True, the item is "used", but from the picture I couldn't see any problems or issues. I was just saying if you wanted a P2K 2-8-4, the cheapest avenue seems to be ebay at this stage. The Walthers price was $365 for DC and $410 for DCC w/ sound. From other online retailers it was formerly available for around $300 DC.
On Walthers, the Bachmann 2-8-4 is $175 and from other online retailers they are about $130.
Just tried a #5 kadee coupler in the Berk tender. It's a tight fit. The coupler will not center in one direction (probably mangled the spring a bit). At the next opportunity, I will try a #148 (whisker spring). Bet I'll have better luck with that.
Regards,
Jonathan
I just got the MTH unit Sunday and it is a great locomotive. I am not sure I like all the talkingit does but it's cute when children visit the layout. Here is my question I have 2 of the Bauchman 2-8-4's and would like to instakll sound in them has anyone done that? Also will they run better on DCC if the decoder was changed. From different things I have read the decoders in them are very cheeply made.
Joe
Yea, I'd go with a decoder with bemf, it should run considerably better. And the tender has holes drilled for a speaker and a 8-pin plug, so it is nearly plug and play.
I started putting my Berk through its paces.
Locomotive is quiet and smooth. Only sound is the wheels on rails. That's normal. No binding nor jerkiness. No headlight flicker. Operated well in forward and reverse during break in (no derailments). #148 coupler in the tender works OK, although I may have to file just a bit to be able to close the draft gear box completely (coupler is a touch thicker than the EZMate).
There's seems to be a tiny bit of drag in the rear most wheelset on the tender. Not bad, but I could ream out the journal, if it starts to bother me. Could be the pick up brush is a little tight.
On my layout, the Berk looks much larger than I imagined. I'm glad I didn't choose a larger locomotive. Even with 24" radius curves, I'm maxed out on appearance. It handles my 22" radius loop well, but looks a little too big around the curves. Opinions will vary on that aspect.
I was able to pull 23 cars before wheel slippage. That was on a little steeper than 1% grade on the mainline. The locomotive has to deal with a grade and curves with a train that long. I tried bullfrog snot on my old metal engines, and that tripled the pulling capacity on those engines. Don't want to overtax the motor, but I think an application to one drive wheel will get the locomotive over 30 cars quite easily. The grade area is short. On level track, I'm sure the Berk could pull twice what I was able to pull.
I still need to check the speed against my Connies to see if double-heading is a possibility. Lord knows I don't want to consider a second Berk. ;D
Overall, a great locomotive. With just a little tweaking, this could be the flagship for my layout. She'll get an engineer and fireman shortly.
I know ebtbob is through studying for now, but someone else out there may be considering this locomotive. So, here's a little more input for the record.
Regards,
Jonathan
jlg759,
If you want to put sound in one of your other Berks then get the Tsunami heavy steam decoder. The chuff on that decoder is a staccato type bark that many of the Berks had, especially the NKP Berks.
Good Morning All,
First of all, thankyou all for your input even if the thread did get a bit off track, pardon the expression. I guess my final analsys is that you cannot go wrong with either Berk, supposing you can find the Proto version anymore.
Interestingly enough, my search for a Berk can be put on hold now that I have my Precision Craft Reading T-1 back and running. I had a problem with the engine shorting out every time it tried to negotiate a right hand turn. After spending many months with my repair man, I took the engine home, reassembled it, and the thing runs great! My only regret is I have no idea why.
One thing I did learn from a friend about the T-1. Inside the smoke box front is a small PC board that has some exposed lands that can touch metal. By unscrewing and removing the board and covering the lands with Kapton tape, the problem of shorting can be resolved.
So, with the 2118 up and running the Berk is on hold. Gotta go, steam pressure is up and I have a coal train to get on down the main.
jonathon -
It sounds like you got a great Berk. Good for you. Isn't it a real pleasure to watch a quality model like that pulling trains on track? That's what it's all about if you ask me.
--D
Bob,
Glad you got your T-1 running. Wish I could run a monster like that on my layout.
D,
A pleasure indeed.
Sometimes I feel like I'm leading a charmed life. After reading so many posts from folks who have had issues with their Bachmann locos, I keep wondering when I'm going to get one that has issues. Hasn't happened, yet--just a little hiccup here and there that was easily adjusted. My Standard and Spectrum locos are all awesome. Perhaps it's the extensive pre-inspection I do before a loco ever makes it to the rails.
It's a wonder more things don't go wrong. I started counting all the little parts in my Berk... had to stop at 239 (got bored). For the price, I feel like we get a real bargain. Does anybody pay retail anymore?
I understand I could spend a few hundred extra dollars and get some amazing detail with all kinds of bangs and whistles. I would be afraid to run those trains for fear of breaking something. They'd end up on display. I have a feeling, once the kids are gone, the attraction for brass will be too strong to resist. Until then, I will run my trains with some pretty reliable stuff.
Must be getting past my bed time, I'm starting to ramble.
Regards,
Jonathan
I've been busy lately, but took a look at this thread, and thought these links would be of interest, especially after reading Donaldon's comments about 2-8-4s that were front and top on that curve!
These are from photo charters, with steam-era cars at the head end for the photos and a fill-out of modern cars to give the engine something to work against--which is a way of getting the locomotive to make more noise!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d550S68EpBw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3L0I6sJ_cU&feature=related
Excursion action on the C&O, starring the 765 as itself and in disguise as a C&O K-4, and a couple of friends, too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIS3DM-5Usk&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pV_57c1vA_g&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-8xMA7JjjA&feature=related
Wouldn't it be wonderful to really duplicate that sound? To properly duplicate the smoke would be a challenge--it has such an animated, lively effect that doesn't scale down. Of course, running something like this would soon make the air in the typical basement unbreathable!
I'd like to contact Mr. Peabody about the use of his Way Back Machine to check out the railroad action Hollywood missed in "Pleasantville."