Hi Everyone: I was just wondering what you guy's used on your layouts.... I am @ the point where I am ready to wire-up all my industry's all my sideing tracks are in... I decided to use Solid 12-Gauge wire over the Braded wire I feel it will be easer when soldering up my track lead's to the main track wire.. What do you guy's think....
Use braided wire, not solid wire. Braided wire is much more flexible and less prone to breakage.
Les
I use Romex 12-gauge (house) wire for my busses on layouts I have built. The big home improvement box stores sell this wire in 25', 50', and larger quantities. After carefully stripping off the outer casing, one is left with 3 wires: a bare copper aux. ground (which I keep for other purposes), a black wire and a white wire (which are used for the layout buss wires). Spaced along the bottom of the layout, I glue small blocks of 1" x 2" wood that is predrilled with two holes to slip the wires through (you have to support the buss wires). Using 3M wire (suitcase) connectors I connect the track feed wires to the appropriate buss wire (it helps to have a diagram drawn on the bottom of the layout board). My track feeds are 22-gauge solid core wire because that is what I can purchase from Lowe's easily. Never had a problem with solid core wire.
Ray
Brian-
CNE's suggestion about Romex is a good one. Wire is much cheaper assembled into the cable than as separate wires off of a spool at the hardware store. Buy yourself the cheapest cable stripper you can find and you'll be able to strip 50 feet in just a couple of minutes.
I do prefer stranded wire but the price differential pushes me to the Romex trick for busses. Depending on how careful and neat you are, you can solder track feeders to the busses without even insulating them after the fact. I do paint mine with liquid electrical tape but that's just because I have a couple of little grandchildren who would get spooked if they touched the wires under the layout when I'm not watching. When carefully laid out there really isn't a safety issue. PREDICTION: I will be severely chastised for this statement.
-- D
Quote from: CNE Runner on March 11, 2013, 01:15:56 PM
I use Romex 12-gauge (house) wire for my buss es on layouts I have built. The big home improvement box stores sell this wire in 25', 50', and larger quantities. After carefully stripping off the outer casing, one is left with 3 wires: a bare copper aux. ground (which I keep for other purposes), a black wire and a white wire (which are used for the layout buss wires). Spaced along the bottom of the layout, I glue small blocks of 1" x 2" wood that is predrilled with two holes to slip the wires through (you have to support the buss wires). Using 3M wire (suitcase) connectors I connect the track feed wires to the appropriate buss wire (it helps to have a diagram drawn on the bottom of the layout board). My track feeds are 22-gauge solid core wire because that is what I can purchase from Lowe's easily. Never had a problem with solid core wire.
Ray
Wow: Funny you guys should metion Romex "House Wire" I had my hole layout wired with Romex-12 Gauge I got 60FT of the Stuff from Lowe's... My Friend that has a Huge Layout in his basement "goes all the way around his wall's" he's wiring all my buss's in & soldering my track leads for me" I will do it next time myself but this time I am an observer... He came Sunday to Wire everything & said to me it's NOT the Right Wire... I needed to get 12-G Braided.. He said something about the romex solid wire is prone to breakage & something about it's more of a hassle to solder track leads to wire... I really didn't argue with him I though OK I'll get the right stuff after all his layout is all of his basement wall's & he said that's the wire he used on his layout....
i prefer to use 18 guage solid especially for feeders. 18 fits nicely against the side of code 83 rail, larger sizes such as 12 are too big to use as feeders. 18 is available in 2 conductor cables as doorbell wire.
for me the advantage of solid over stranded is that with solid, there are no stray wires to possibly short something out, or otherwise interfere with the smooth operation of my layout.
I think this is one of the things that have no "right way" to do them.
Some of my light feeder wires are solid core. I used what I had on hand.
Solid wires can be easier to solder to rail. They can be bent to push against the rail while being solid.
All major buss wiring is braided. The wires are not soldered together: they run to barrier strips, then to other barrier strips in the area of the tracks they serve. Feeders run from this second set of barrier strips to the tracks. Write on the underside of the layout what wires go where.
Common rail return wiring uses a buss that circles underneath the mains, with feeder attached by suitcase connectors.
This give me circuits that are easy to trace and troubleshoot.
Les
Our club has two rooms and we use #14 braided and #24 solid for feeders. We have the NCE 5 amp Power Pro.
The original layout was wired with #24 for DC blocks as the club president worked for the telephone company. When we changed to DCC, we used the original feeders with about a six to seven inch length.
The solid wire is easier to solder to the track but has to be stripped carefully with the correct size wire stripper so there is no nick. With solid wire, if you nick it and do a sharp bend, the nick point sometimes will fracture.
Rich
Like Ray I use what's available from my friend the electrician. #12 Romex is readily available from him. It takes a little more heat to solder to them as I prefer to solder.
For my feeders and turnout wiring I use cat 5 cable solid that I picked up from a building being refurbished and wound up with about 300 ft. :o More than I will ever use but keep it around for expansion or helping out others. Solders easily to rail joiners or track.
I have picked up a little trick on mt own when soldering to EZ track that I find is easy. First I slide one rail out far enough to clip a heat sink to solder my connection then slide it carefully back in and I do mean carefully. Believe it or not I have not broke a plastic spike yet.
Jerry
Quote from: richg on March 11, 2013, 07:31:59 PM
Our club has two rooms and we use #14 braided and #24 solid for feeders. We have the NCE 5 amp Power Pro.
The original layout was wired with #24 for DC blocks as the club president worked for the telephone company. When we changed to DCC, we used the original feeders with about a six to seven inch length.
The solid wire is easier to solder to the track but has to be stripped carefully with the correct size wire stripper so there is no nick. With solid wire, if you nick it and do a sharp bend, the nick point sometimes will fracture.
Rich
Lowe's had 16-G wire in stock too but I figured my friend who's doing the wiring for me said to get 12-gauge braided so that's what I got LOL... He is coming to wire up my layout Tuesday I intend to ask him the pro's & con's or the reason he used this type of wire on his layout... I will be happy when it's all wired-up LOL & at least when I expand my layout in the future I'll know how to do it...... I am glad to see from everyone.. To use ROMEX House Wire was not a shot in the dark & other's have used it.....
The advantage of stranded wire is that it is more flexible, and a break in any one conductor is not a big deal.
Stranded wire is absolutely required for anything that needs to flex, for example wiring going through a hinge area into a door.
Romex (solid wire) is used in houses because it is cheap, and works well in stationary applications.
Jeff, I recall you mentioning the doorbell wire in a post, many moons ago.
Question for everyone: if Romex is good to use, why not 14 gauge (14/3) over 12 gauge?
I did have some trouble with braided wire touching other wires at terminal screws. The problem was solved by fitting all wires at screw terminals with forked spade connectors from Radio Shack. When using these on Atlas electrical components, they need to be narrowed so they will fit. I did this with a sanding drum in a Dremel Tool.
It only took me two months and $60 worth of spade terminals.
Am I the guy who said to keep things simple?
Les
LOL!
The big difference between the two is fairly obvious in that with stranded (not "flexible" FYI) sytem, any movement, pulling, jarring, etc, will not neccessarily affect the perfornance. I use #12 THHN/THWN, MTW stranded for any bussing sytstem I have, and tap off ofr that with #18THHN stranded for track/buss connections. There are current-carrying differencees between solid and stranded, but for this discussion, it would be moot point.
Rich C.
I'd like to address a couple of statements made during the last few posts.
- Short of living in an earthquake-prone location (or war zone), the issue of solid core Romex wire breaking is not an issue. Buss wires do not flex. Buss wires (especially Romex) should be adequately supported to the layout as they are relatively heavy. I will go one step further and say that all wire (excepting those of a very short length) require support.
- The use of 12-gauge Romex (or whatever) wire is definitely overkill for a current load of <18 v.D.C. I like the robust nature of 12-gauge wire (for busses) and the easy availability of this material. If you have a source of smaller gauge wire, that is appropriate, use it. How thin? Take a look at the thin nichrome wire that connects to a Peco Electrofog turnout...that has to handle track voltage - just like a feeder. Do keep in mind, the smaller the gauge the greater the resistance. That thin frog feeder wire is only 'feeding' one frog...a buss wire may feed an entire layout (or a large block).
- I use bell wire for my track feeders; angling one end and soldering it against the side of the rail away from the 'audience'. On my test board (where ideas and track-related skills are developed), I have tried the technique wherein one end of the solid core wire is flattened and cut to roughly the same profile as a track spike. I then insert the wire (from the top) until the 'head' of the 'spike' rests against the rail. One then solders this to the web of the rail. After painting, I usually can't find the darn thing again without very careful searching. Just an idea.
- The use of stranded core wire is an absolute necessity in those conditions were movement occurs. Such places may be the wire running between the buss and the controller. I terminate my busses with terminal connectors at two bolts - screwed into a supporting member of the layout train board. These bolts have three flat washers and three nuts...sandwiching the buss wire and the controller feed wire together. This allows me to easily remove the controller wires...and, since I have a supply of nuts, washers and bolts is a cheap way of solving a problem. In the past, I have connected wires, in such an application, with: old computer wire connections (assuming you have the male and female ends), or a plug & socket.
I didn't mean to ramble on...there are lots of ways to solve a problem. You have to determine what works best for you.
Ray
Thank you Rich and Ray.
Thank's for that info Ray....
You are entirely welcome Brian. Good luck with your layout.
Ray
UPDATE : Removed all the ROMEX house wire from hole layout.. Ran NEW 12-Gauge Braided RED & Black & both wire's are separated 3 - 4 inches apart so I don't have a possibility of interference with my NCE DCC system.... My friend started wiring the leads in my Yard Area... I now see WHY Braided Wire is used & it shows it's a heck of allot more easier to work with.. I am glad I took everyones advice with the braided wire... My Friend said Friday he'll start wiring main layout & if he gets all that done he'll wire up my 2 - UTP Plug connector's... GUYS I REALLY DO APREACTATE THE TIPS IT REALLY HELPED ME OUT THANKS
Brian-
Your electrical friend is seriously mistaken. Solid wire is excellent for busses although it's a little more difficult to use for feeders unless it's quite small gauge, like 20 ga or smaller. I've never heard anything about Romex being breakable and I must say that I don't believe that at all. The National Electrical Code, and virtually all of the local codes I've heard of, approve of Romex for house wiring. Now the whole purpose of the codes is ensuring safety, meaning no shorts, no electrocutions and no fires. Breakable wires would directly violate this intent. Additionally, house wiring carries 110 volts or 120 volts at comparatively large amperages like 15 or 20 amps. Our model railroads, regardless of gauge or type of power (AC, DC, DCC) use much smaller voltages at much smaller amperages. So the idea that Romex is a bad choice is, frankly, ludicrous. The only thing wrong with 12 ga Romex is that it is much larger, stiffer and more expensive that it needs to be. Fourteen gauge Romex is more than adequate for anything less than a monster layout running high current levels like "O" or large scale.
I hope you didn't need much of the 12 ga stranded wire. One could easily wire a whole large layout with appropriate wires for a fraction of what a 12 ga stranded buss would cost. It was very nice of your friend to help you, but he did cost you some extra cash for the nonsensical materials.
-- D
My buddy says.............its your railroad do what you like!. What you feel is best for you. I use 14 gauge stranded for main buss and 18 gauge stranded for feeders. The feeders are twisted tight L shaped tined and soldered to side of rails..............i use code 100 no issues, I guess code of rail maybe part of the equation for size of feeders, I use suitcase connectors with feeders every leg of a switch and one to every section of flex track and all joiners soldered, I guess with a feeder on every section of flex really means you dont need to solder joiners but believe me they do move over time. Yards and industrial areas with many tracks i run a feeder from the Buss to terminal strips then wire from terminal strips to the tracks all in close proximity to each other................keeps it neat and its easy on the eye and orderly for trouble shooting if need be plus cuts down on a jungle of wires and connectors.A must for soldering and good flow especially sodering feeders is a bottle of Rosin Flux fluid...................electrical solder on its own in my mind does not flow or run quick enough. Soldering is fun ,easy and in terms of wire its rewarding with extra flux brushed on.When i use suitcase connectors i run the feeder about 1/2 inche through the connector at the dead end end of connector and use a meter to check for continuity to the rail making sure i have connection.So one leg of meter attached to rails using a length of wire to reach and the other leg touching the wire protruding the end of the suitcase connector.Jury is out on suitcase connectors but if you use correct size correct wire and crimp correctly you should have no issues. If you are DCC do the quarter test as you feeder and check your breaker on command is cutting out................if not add more feeders.In terms of stranded vs solid...........solid harder to work with, gets hard over time and if nicked will snap.............if removing insulation for feeders to attach to a solid buss wire and you nick the wire for sure it will break. If need be stranded wire is easier to twist and join.Stranded wire run nicer and easier to staple up or fasten up Iuse the nylon screw on clips that come in various sized wire, they slip over the wire.Obviously solid wire is fine in its right place but all in all stranded i think a better or wiser choice for what we use it for. In terms of cost its not a huge layout compared to everything else on the layout so get the right wire not whats on deal. Remember the wireing is the lifeline of your layout, take your time do it correctly.Steve
Good tips Steve! Thank you.
If it's going to move on a regular basis, even a little bit, use stranded conductor. If it's going to be installed and stay in place under the table, solid conductor is fine.
The problem with solid conductor is using it in places where it has to bend, e.g., inside a control panel with a hinged lid. Solid wire has a nasty habit of breaking inside the insulator after being bent one too many times. Like a paper clip that's bent back and forth.
And strictly speaking, braided wire is the stuff used for 'Solder Wick', ground straps, and the shield around coax cable.
Len
Doneldon;
I personally do not care if you use bobby pins and guitar strings for conductors; you use whatever grabs you. The writer (Brian) tossed out for an opinion, and he got some, so what is your problem here? I use #12THHN stranded wire. Big Deal! It is my choice. Ten guys will use twn different methods and all manner of material. You want to shoot stuff down? Go to the skeet range. I will probably get tossed off this forum for this, but that is my say. Ciao.
Rich C.
Hi everyone.. I asked my Friend WHY we can't use the ROMEX wire he said ROMEX is just harder to work with " NOT that it couldn't be used " he just perfur es the wire we just ran for "reasons that Brad ed it's more flexible & the fact if SOLID WIRE BREAKS you have more of a problem to fix it " I can see his point there.. & he said he's always used braided on his 2 layout's between 2 houses & has never had a problem with the Braided Wire...
Think about it house wire is put into place and left.................even in a electrical box a novice has a hard time working with it. Ever notice how hard the wire has become over time when you have to change a plug or switch. Whats easier to nick and break a single strand or multiple strands?. Would you rather work with stiff wire or plyable wire?Big question is how you tie into your buss..............chances are out of all the feeders your going to splice into your solid wire buss you are going to nick the wire sometime when removing the insulation. A nick in solid wire results in it breaking...................note when stripping solid house wire when attaching to plugin or switch if the strippers nick the wire and you bend the wire or twist on a connector the wire will snap.I have a small layout 17 by 13 wired with spools of automotive 14 gauge wire main buss and 18 gauge feeders.This wire is some of the softest cased wire i have seen ,very plyable and a joy to work with.I use 3m IDC or suitcase connectors with feeders every length of track and every leg of Peco insul frog switches. The room is a ground level room same as any other room in house................no temperature or humidity issues and rock solid bench work.It works great.If you like solid wire thats great but if starting out consider the fact that the benefits of stranded wire far outway solid wire. Nothing wrong with solid wire if used as intended but note even wall thermostats and most electrical items all have stranded wire for ease of use and less chance of breaking............i dont know how they compare on electrical carrying current.Like many aspects of the hobby we all have our own way of doing things......whatever works for you and your comfortable with.That being said please consider stranded wire on your layout if starting out.The spools of automotive wire are easy to work with and as i say very plyable and there is an aray of colors for you to keep things oprganised and seperated. Talking house wire i did run a loop around fasia of layout of 120 volt plugins attaching to legs..................this loop has a master switch with light.Everything layout is plugged into this loop of plug ins................when the lighted switch is off everything on layout is off.................nothing left on and peace of mind all is off and safe.The lighted switch really helps as a reminder. Steve
Steve, if the thermostat is for a typical gas or oil heat system, the wires are carrying low voltage. If we are talking about a thermostat for an electric heating system, like electric baseboards, heavy duty, 220 volts that kill.
Do you find the stranded wire cheaper at an automotive place than at Radio Shack?
Sorry about that i was thinking 220 volt baseboard heaters as i just changed mine.We only have source in Canada no Radio Shack. Limited selection and i like the larger spools of Automotive and color choices. Not sure on pricing in a small town i was just happy to find what i was needing.I think the brand was PICO. Seems to me if one thinks 18 gauge for feeders is a bit big nothing wrong with 20 gauge stranded. The key is to twist it tight shape it trim the... L ... if necessary tin the wire shove down the hole beside tie and solder to rail. Scrape side of rail with file to clean and give bite and brush on a dab of rosin flux. I only use a 25 watt pencil soldering iron others use the big guns!Hold wire tight to rail with whatever you find handy.You will find wire as heated will mold to the rail...............you get the feel after a couple of goes. Sure you may melt a tie or deface them once in a while but once painted and ballasted it fades away. So dont get your wires mixed up.Use old box car and mark R for red one side and b for black on the other.............follow it around and you wll not get your reds and blacks mixed up. For a neat power tester take aligator clip wire pair and cut in 1/2 or so, shorten them to say 6 to 8 inches add an LED and a resistor to one leg wrap with tape or shrink tubing and use that as a handy do i have power by cliping to rails. Use a 1k resistor. For DCC i i use a bi polar LED i think for straight Dc you could use regular LED. Such a handy tool to have and a trouble shooting tool for sure.I actually just had 3 days under the layout............stiff neck and a sore but!I tested as i went along especially the quarter test for instant shorting to the command.Remember dont loop the main buss back on itself.If your command is center of layout break the run into two like T..............the shortest route to your destination maybe a T type Buss...........so if a circle dont go al the way around in one direction split it down the middle and go left and right of the command.No looping back...........two dead ends.Steve
Thanks for all those tips. Sadly, I can't take advantage of the DCC related ones since I run DC. I do have a continuity tester specifically for that purpose so that will serve me well. I have not yet had a chance to lay out new track and ballast. But I have to say, I have to solder very few of my rail joiners. I don't seem to have continuity issues like many cite. I know it will be wise to do so before ballasting and painting. I also use a 25Watt (Weller) soldering pencil.
Quote from: jbrock27 on March 14, 2013, 01:38:46 PM
Steve, if the thermostat is for a typical gas or oil heat system, the wires are carrying low voltage. If we are talking about a thermostat for an electric heating system, like electric baseboards, heavy duty, 220 volts that kill.
Do you find the stranded wire cheaper at an automotive place than at Radio Shack?
jb-
Actually, the thermostat wires in an electric heating system is low voltage. Only the conductors
for the power to the heating wires is 220 volts. (Small ones may use 110 volts.) That's why the
stat wires are small gauge and run through the walls without physical protection.
-- D
Not in my house Doc, which was built with electric baseboard heat (later converted to hot water). The electric thermostats have 12 gauge Romex running to and from them and on any of the electric thermostats I still have left (as time has moved on I have taken them out and patched the hole in the sheetrock) it clearly states on the thermostat "CAUTION High Voltage".
I do not think it is referring to the 24 volts that operate the traditional style "mercury switch" or now programable/digital switches that run hot water or steam heating systems.
The 220 volt line voltage baseboard heaters have high voltage themostats with heavy stranded wire. I just changed mine all out to digital and the same . i dare say a 110 volt heater will also have heavy wire. Heavy wire as your basically breaking one wire to heater to inplant thermostat................the other straight through to heater. Of course the wire has tobe same or higher gauge as the 14 or 12 gauge 220 volt wire. Not an electrician dont know the criterior for 12 or 14 gauge,We are getting off track hear but the point is stranded wire more common in home and around home than solid,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,its more serviceable lets say for many applications.Steve....................if you are a solid guy thats great.............if you are stranded you are more than solid HA! :D ;D ;) :)
I agree with you Steve, this is definitely off the topic.
But, I have to disagree with your statement on stranded wire being more prevalent for home use wiring. At least from my perspective of my state within the U.S. , it is the other way around, solid copper wire is used almost exclusively. There was a time during the 1960s aluminum wire was permitted in the States but then the code changed to copper wiring. Builders liked the aluminum bc it was cheaper than copper. I lived in house with aluminum wiring-never a problem. They changed the code bc it was found the aluminum can work it's way loose from the screws that hold it down on switches, outlets, etc. I am laughing at all these posts that express concern of "nicking" solid wire and running the risk it breaks-you know how much a 12 or 14 gauge solid copper wire can get dinged and nicked and not break? It gets stomped and crushed when screwing it down onto a switch or outlet and doesn't break, one reason why it is used for this purpose.
What i meant by stranded wire use in home was not the mains use of solid but the use of stranded used in everything else in the home. Yes you can screw down and stomp on solid but i tell you if its nicked or cut with strippers or a knife it will break off with little stress. It stands to reason a small gauge of pretty much any thing solid when nicked will snap at the nick point. A nick in solid copper wire is its weakest link. No nick no cut you bend it which ever way you like...............its even worse with smaller gauge cppoer wire. Time to move on. Steve........BC
Thanks for clarifying Steve. I am sorry for any confusion on my part.
I agree with you 100% that nicking small gauge solid wire leads to break offs and they should be avoided. I successfully use both stranded and solid small gauge wire on my layout. I find that solid telephone wire works great for switches. I have not had the need to use as heavy a gauge as 14 or 12. I think part of preventing "nicks" from occurring, is using the right tool for the right job to strip the insulation off the wires; either with a wire stripper that is preset for many gauges or the kind that is adjustable to wire you want to strip by moving the screw in the middle of the tool. I don't consider a knife to be the right tool to strip wire.
For an experiment, I took some 12 gauge solid copper wire I have and nicked it up and then tried to bend it into a question mark like you would to mount it under a screw or bolt. It did not break at the nick. This tells me the heavier gauge copper solid wire is more tolerant of nicking than smaller gauge.
Moving forward, do me the favor and refrain from telling me it is "Time to move on"; it comes across to me as being dismissive and if it was intended that way, I don't appreciate it. Have a good weekend!
Quote from: jbrock27 on March 15, 2013, 08:00:32 AM
Not in my house Doc, which was built with electric baseboard heat (later converted to hot water). The electric thermostats have 12 gauge Romex running to and from them and on any of the electric thermostats I still have left (as time has moved on I have taken them out and patched the hole in the sheetrock) it clearly states on the thermostat "CAUTION High Voltage".
I do not think it is referring to the 24 volts that operate the traditional style "mercury switch" or now programable/digital switches that run hot water or steam heating systems.
jb-
I'm sure you are correct that the warning doesn't refer to 24 v service. But I wonder if the 220 v stats are from years gone by. I put a 220 v baseboard heater in a three-season porch to keep it useful through the winter and it had a conventional stat running on low voltage bell wire.
-- D
Steve and jb-
I've never seen any house wiring with stranded wire except some very old knob-and-tube stuff in a very old house I rented while I was a poor graduate student. I've lived in and worked on the three houses I've owned since then, and the one my wife owned when we got married, and I've never seen any stranded wire in any of them. Well, except for the wiring in things like chandeliers and bath fans and the like, but they aren't really part of the house wiring.
I've also never seen a piece of solid wire break, despite having done new work, rewiring and repairs over the years. I've used some pretty good force on the wires at times, too, like when stuffing them back in a box.
I also have never worked with aluminum house wiring. I do know that code where I live requires either that new copper ends be put on the aluminum or that special receptacles and switches with toothed connectors be used. It's really too bad that the aluminum wire didn't work out; it would be considerably cheaper than copper at today's prices as well as lighter and easier to work with. That's as long as you don't have to solder it, of course.
-- D
You are correct Doc, these electric thermostats I am referring to at my current house are not the newest kind. They are from 1985.
I hear you on the aluminum wiring. Like I said, in the 15 years or so that I lived in my folks house that had it, it was never a problem or safety issue. Of course when ever something needing to be added or worked on, it was copper wiring that we used.
Quote from: Brian1975 on March 11, 2013, 11:00:16 AM
Hi Everyone: I was just wondering what you guy's used on your layouts.... I am @ the point where I am ready to wire-up all my industry's all my sideing tracks are in... I decided to use Solid 12-Gauge wire over the Braded wire I feel it will be easer when soldering up my track lead's to the main track wire.. What do you guy's think....
12 gauge will work but is more than overkill. 12 gauge will carry 20 amps at 120 volts...so unless you have 600 locos running at stall current it's TOO much.
jerryl-
Twelve gauge will arry 220 at 20 v!
-- D
Quote from: Doneldon on March 16, 2013, 11:03:56 PM
jerryl-
Twelve gauge will arry 220 at 20 v!
-- D
????????????????????
Do you mean "12 gauge will carry 220 at 20 Amps" or what because your sentence above makes no sense?
If you do mean "12 gauge will carry 220 at 20 amps" then that is incorrect. You need 10 gauge to carry 220 at 20 Amps.
Correct me if I am wrong. In the U.S. we don't really have 220 volts. we use two 110 volt lines added together to get 220 volts. What I am thinking is lower voltage and higher amp mean larger wire. I know over seas they have real 220 volts and use smaller wire.
Quote from: RAM on March 17, 2013, 04:29:00 PM
Correct me if I am wrong. In the U.S. we don't really have 220 volts. we use two 110 volt lines added together to get 220 volts. What I am thinking is lower voltage and higher amp mean larger wire. I know over seas they have real 220 volts and use smaller wire.
Based on the above, I would suggest that you do not tamper with your house wiring. :-)
Call an electrician.
roger-
Pardon my stiky "c" key but the code in my ommunity doesn't require 10 ga wire for 220
volts. Is it just me, and possibly RAM, or are you feeling especially antagonistic today?
-- D