I have a post war Lionel 2333 F3 I've custom painted. I want to replace the original "growler" motors with a WBB re-power kit. WBB makes an F3 and an F7 re-power kit.
What are the differences between the two (other than the obvious that, one is for F3's and the other for F7's)?
Which would work better in my application to the 2333?
Secondly, Are the side frames interchangeable between the two?
Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
Mark
Look at the way the postwar Lionel motor mounts to the frame, it might be totally differant than the Williams by Bachmann mounting.
I would go with a Lionel motor for the 2333.
Lee F.
Maybe retire the Lionels and go pure WBB! (But do keep the Big L's!)
Mark,
The flywheels on the F-3 kit are wider and thinner. I don't think that they will directly mount in your postwar engine without modifying the frame.
Regards,
3rail
So, the only difference is in the fly wheel. I was thinking the differences were in the way the power trucks mounted to the frames, as the F3 may be different than the F7. I can Live with modifying the frame, but was hpoing for an easier work around.
Can I assume the side frames are interchangeable?
Mark,
Our side frames are interchangeable with any of our current 4-wheel trucks. I don't know about using other manufacturer's side frames with our trucks.
Regards,
3rail
Thanks 3rail. Yes, I was wondering about a williams for williams swap of the side frames.
They will mount but you will have some fore and aft play in the truck that you will have to be taken up. I have done 3 kitbashes using WBB power conversions., use the F-3 kit! I still have to figure out a better way of securing the slop in the trucks but it's a pretty easy conversion to do. You will have to get with the parts Dept to order the bolsters, pilots, screws, cow catcher, couplers, etc. to complete it as the old Lionels parts will not work with WBB!
HEY 3RAIL- Can WBB get there heads together and maybe come up with a dummy conversion kit or whatever, that has all nesscessary parts to complete the trucks as I mentioned above for us that do this mod to complete the trucks? I've had a heck of a time with WBB to get what I have needed to do this when I have done mine. I explain what I'm doing and I all I need and they look at me as if I'm stupid and don't have a clue what I'm talking about. Just a thought for you.
Stubbs, Thanks for the input. I've come to the same conclusion, I'll have to use the F3 power kit. The sideframes will be donated by a Williams 44 tonner (another project), That is why I asked about the side frame interchangeability. I know I'll have to purchase a coupler for the rear truck. However, I modified the Lionel pilot (cow catcher).
(http://xdcxja.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pQHoK3iO34TWA_834rEcQal5JxLcV-N6QKxjph9tpzX24v5EdSZDfdzmLopDoDUB3dq0gSzufkRZVOXxwFxb3QH8ViHBDONwT/IMG_0567.JPG?psid=1)
As you can see from the photo, I've closed the pilot and removed the coupler. I think I can fabricate a conversion mounting bracket which I can mount the Lionel pilot to on one end and mount the other end onto the Williams front truck.
The only real problem will be to fabricate a mounting plate for the two trucks that replicates the williams design. I have a Williams F7, that I can use as a pattern. Then mount these plates onto the Lionel frame, attach the motors/reverse unit, add new LED headlight, ERR sound commander, etc...
This is gonna take a while.
Mark
Quote from: trainguy47 on August 07, 2010, 11:24:39 PM
Stubbs, Thanks for the input. I've come to the same conclusion, I'll have to use the F3 power kit. The sideframes will be donated by a Williams 44 tonner (another project), That is why I asked about the side frame interchangeability. I know I'll have to purchase a coupler for the rear truck. However, I modified the Lionel pilot (cow catcher).
(http://xdcxja.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pQHoK3iO34TWA_834rEcQal5JxLcV-N6QKxjph9tpzX24v5EdSZDfdzmLopDoDUB3dq0gSzufkRZVOXxwFxb3QH8ViHBDONwT/IMG_0567.JPG?psid=1)
As you can see from the photo, I've closed the pilot and removed the coupler. I think I can fabricate a conversion mounting bracket which I can mount the Lionel pilot to on one end and mount the other end onto the Williams front truck.
The only real problem will be to fabricate a mounting plate for the two trucks that replicates the williams design. I have a Williams F7, that I can use as a pattern. Then mount these plates onto the Lionel frame, attach the motors/reverse unit, add new LED headlight, ERR sound commander, etc...
This is gonna take a while.
Mark
That's the problem with kitbashing, you can't do it overnight. Fabbing can be a real PITA! Looks good though.
Frank Timco makes a can motor replacement kit for Lionel 2333's. THAT is the way to go. No cutting or modifying.