Hi, i'm looking at getting into the hobby and i am looking at getting a RTR DCC Train Set but i am not sure what to get. Definately want a H.O. system , i am looking at the Bachman Digital Commander Deluxe Set with DCC. Any input on this set? Looked at Atlas Trainman sets as well as some waltham sets........any imput on a good set to start out with would be greatly appreciated!!
if i could foretell the future ....................... enjoy the hobby, buy what you want .I personally have an MRC Advance 2 system after buying two other lass capable MRC systems.
Newfie, you are asking a tough question. Do you have any plans for a future layout, or just want something to run and see if you like the hobby?
It you want to jump right into DCC, then the Digital Commander set is a good way to go for the money. For steam you have a choice of Great Northern, Union Pacific, or painted unlettered. If you don't know railroad line you want to model, then the unlettered might be best for you, it can be lettered later to suit your chosen line.
The locos are not Spectrum quality, and you will still need some cars. It you want a complete set, then consider the "Chatanooga" that has loco, cars and track. But the track is steel, not nickel and it is DC, not DCC. I think you need to do a little more planning on where you want to go with the hobby.
You will probably get 20 different options with your question. Good luck.
Yampa Bob
Right now i am just looking to set something up on 4x8 sheet and in all honestly that is probably as big as i will get. I want to take the time to build a nice scenic project . I dont know railroad line or what type of track is best which is why i would like to buy a expandable complete set and see and learn as i go.
I have only one question- why dcc? I had a terrible time getting it to do anything more that what basic DC could do 100 years ago, my 2 cents- a waste of money and nerves, bloodpressure. When you decide to expand well beyond your sheet of plywood, dcc is aways an option in future. A nice DC set with tracks and all can show up for peanuts. my friends near Edmunton bought their kids 2 Bachmann CPR sets- at Canadian tire, day after Christmas sale. Ain't gonna tell you how cheap that deal was....Going in too deep might get frustrating, just put an oval together, practice the scenery and buildings, then buy some switches and more track after you get to know the 1st lot, have a good time with the basics.... my nieghbor's kids didn't expand at all, got bored....but the hogwart still looks great going around their Christmas tree!
Well i figured i would go with the newest technology out there on the market , but i have really been debating between dc and dcc. Yampa bob had mentioned a system..."Chatanooga" which seems to be along the lines of what i may be looking for looking. Are there any ready to run systems you would recommend? I am leaning towards Bachmann just for the fact of the track they use.
if i may humbly opine here, the reason for DCC is greater than a 4X8 track. I probably would not have gone to DCC except the RR club I belong to, has It is more fun when you have locomotives/trains to participate with and go to train shows with. ;D you see, trains grow on you !
Thats what i am hoping......tried alot of other hobbies in the past but nothing has really held my interest for longer than a month...lol
Well, one thing about model railroading, there is really no limit to what you can achieve. It just depends on the size of your wallet.
I see nothing wrong with going to DCC locomotives right from the start. So let's turn the question around to "Why not DCC"? It is growing in popularity and with the EZ Command, it's no more complicated than DC. If you later expand, which you probably will, you don't need to upgrade the system.
The EZ Command sells for about $80, a good DC controller for about $45. A DCC equipped Bachmann 2-8-0 from $90 to $110. You can't go wrong with one of these, and you have more choices in road names. The "Connie" will run out of the box on a DC powered track. So you have a choice of a DC or DCC controller.
This is my suggestion for what it's worth. Get the DCC combo as mentioned earlier, or the 2-8-0 and separate EZ Command or Bachmann DC controller, then buy enough EZ track with gray roadbed and nickel rails, for a basic oval.
You will need 12 pieces 18" radius curve, 11 pieces of 9" straight, 1 piece 9" straight terminal section. That will give you about a 38" X 92" layout. Snap it together and plug the controller in, you're set to go. No soldering, in fact no tools whatsoever. Figure about $300 minimum to start.
Bachmann locomotives have a lifetime warranty, you can't beat that.
Bob
On a 4x8, I'd stay with DC unless you really want sound, then DCC is worth it.
You say you are going with EZ-Track - with a 4x8 that does make sense. A couple of points worth considering:
The 18" radius recommended by Bob is going to give you room on your layout, but will limit your choice of both locomotives and cars. Either because of reality or aesthetics, big locos and big cars will not work on that tight a radius.
When you lay the track, make sure the track is inside the rail joiners. Rub your finger over the top of the rail, both ways for each piece of track. It MUST be smooth. If not, your roadbed is fastened together, but one rail rests ON a joiner, not IN it. This is VERY common. All rails must rest in joiners, not on them.
You may also want to consider a second feeder track or rail joiners half way around the layout. In addition, if you go with DC, consider separate electrical blocks for each siding.
Gene
I was thinking you could expand later with a 22" outside track, it will still fit on a 4 X 8. Or you could do the 22" now and add the 18" later, or just use the inside space for sidings and storage.
By starting with the smaller inside track, you could scenic that area, then you wouldn't be reaching across stuff to add the outer track. Either way, you can have a pretty nice layout on a 4 X 8.
If you only plan to have one track, then I would probably go with the 22" and a DC controller as Gene suggested.
My philosophy is start small and expand outward, but it's your choice.
Bob
Thank you guys for all your wisdom and insight.....its greatly appreciated. I am going to start looking at the Dc sets to see what there is to choose from and compare the price of $149.00 CAN which is what i can get the Digital Commander set for. At that price its almost worth going with the digital.......am i right?
I think you're right. For the minor increase in cost of a "starter" set, I would indeed go with the DCC setup and Bmann's EZC is a perfect way to get your feet wet.
If by chance you decide you don't want DCC, then your investment loss is minimal. If you wish to expand, and run more than one loco at a time, then you're already set to go.
It's hard to take a niggardly approach to model railroading. I have seen so many people fail at their early attempts because they under estimate the amount of money that can be involved, even for a simple layout. I have read articles that state a layout, even modestly done, but done well.....can run 30 dollars per square foot.
A simple 4 X 8 is 32 square feet......$30 X 32sqft works out to a figure of $960...let's call it a grand for arguments sake. Even at 20 bucks a sqft it runs $640.
And remember....this is for everything....rails and roster to scenery and structures. The layouts you see in the magazines are running in the 50-75 dollar/sqft range. (You do the math on that one ;))
You see a lot of talk on here about pricing and smart shopping. Combining a DCC into your starter set is a fine example of smart shopping. By shopping wisely and waiting for the right deal, you can do this on a tight budget, I just want you to keep the overall cost in mind as you make your purchases.
Always keep your "vision" in mind when shopping. If the item you are looking at "fits" your layout (theme/cost/quality etc), buy it. If you have to think of how to justify a piece of equipment on your layout, it's usually best to pass. Don't waste dollars. Count every penny and PLAN your layout.
Happy railroading....I wish you success.
Sid
newfiegod:
I am new to model railroads just as your are as a matter of fact my first order of track and supplies should arrive today. I have studied and have read every thing I could in an attempt to make a rational decision as to what I needed.
The people on this board have given you some solid advice. Listen to them and learn. They also have some excellent post on this board covering such things as coupler updates and other things you will surely need to know. Bookmark this page as it will be a great source of information for you as it has been for me.
You will be well served in my opinion to go with the Bachmann DCC controller right off the bat. If you decide to enlarge and really get into this you already have a controller that is capable. If not it will still do the DC.
I know what you are going through with the decisions I nearly drove myself crazy. However, the best advice was jump in to it with a basic setup 4x8 with a DCC capable controller and see what happens to your enthuisiasm.
I had absolutely no idea of the unlimited potiential available, then I got a Walthers reference catalog and a Bachmann catalog. I looked all over the internet at various layouts and as you were told earlier the sky is the limit (aka "size of wallet"...lol
I will never build on the scale as others on this board but I plan to have fun with my grandson. Thats is what is important, having fun on your budget, and dreaming of one heck of a fantastic layout.
One can always dream.
So best wishes to you and I hope you have fun.
Redtail67
lol.....i guess i am going with n scale now.....the wife informed me that i dont have the room now for a 4x8 layout...which i hate to admit .....after i measured i really dont have that much space to spare.....how big a table would make a good n scale layout?
I hear ya, brother. Just do what I am doing, buy all the equipment and wait until you get a bigger house. LOL.
But seriously, there is always the temporary carpet layout option, depending on your circumstance. Every couple of weeks at my house the 4 year old and I bust out the ez-track, set up a route that goes across the room, under chairs and round the ironing board, run our two (soon to be three) loco's and then close up shop 3 or 4 days later.
A permanent layout is literally 2 to 3 years away.
If you are really tight for space, you could have a HO layout on a piece of plywood 42 inches X 86 inches. By fastening the track down, you could stand it against a wall when not in use. My first layout was that size, and we sat it on the coffee table for awhile.
The choice is yours, but I think you would be much happier with HO scale. The N scale is small, and at least for me, hard to work with.
Have a look at my thread "Yampa Valley Railroad" for an idea using a folding picnic table. I'll bump it up so you can look at it.
Bob
Newfie:
I showed your last post to my wife, and she had a comment about your "lack of space", as first noted by your wife. Remember, this is from a woman's point of view, and her exact words.
Is your name on the house title?
When you've been married as long as we have, you learn to share everything, including "space". We have a 1200 square foot garage. From a man's point of view, my wife could park her car outside so I could have a 12X30 layout. So we negotiated, and she preferred the layout in the house, so she could watch me enjoy it. She also wants to share in the hobby and agreed to do some scenics for the ranch theme.
We had 3 huge couches in a living room that hardly ever was used. Exit one couch, enter one 4x8 layout.
Yampa Bob
First to Bob. Tel your wife couches and sofas are loaded with BTU's, and it is best to burn them all in the stove before springtime... hey, worth a try! To Newfie.... tell your sweet loving wife that by some freak co-incedence of nature, N scale requires a 4X8 sheet too... and if that doesn't fly... well, not so poular not because of the On30 and larger scales nowadays, but HOn2 1/2, which is N-guage track but the easier to work with HO scale equipment and buildings, might be the way to go. There was an awesome little "Maine two footer" called the Elk River, back in the early seventies, when this guage was catching on, a nice oval of mainline track, siding, tunnel, trestle, switchback spur to a mine, it was an inspiration to a kid just playing with trains before that. 2X3 feet. I had 4x6 to work with back then, so I did the same thing only standard guage...And alot of nice stuff fit in there without crowding the scenes. Best part? When you do get more room to build in, this can be an addition to the big one, just extending one line off the old layout to run along the full HO track as an interchange, or guage transfer.. like 'Port o Basque' was in the good ol' days.... I collect more moldy old magazines than websites, but you should be able to 'google' something along this idea..... It was in the 1970? into 72? Model Railroad Craftsmen mags....Frary and Hayden? Don't know how to spell their names. In the late 70's or 80's they did a maritime waterfront layout, forgot the name, which the old one could become an addition to. Check it out, might just keep peace- and trains- in the family... ;)
Ahoy skipper. Being known as 'Newfie', I assume you are in the great white north! I thought of something last night- I can't seem to bring it up except from a maill file, but look for <www.miniaturesbyeric.ca< or something like that. He is north of ED, makes resin parts for detailing generic models into Canadian prototype. AND as I had a hunch, I checked, yes, he still makes HOn30 resin models, some are cool looking Hawaiian- (I don't know how to spell) prototypes.... If you can't find his site, email me off line, I will forward it to you.....
Hey Tony d its funny that you mentioned Port Aux Basques......thats my home town.....lol....i do remember the trains we use to have years ago.....faintly...lol. I went and bought a n scale set and put it in the part of my basement that is not developed......bought the Bacmann explorer set .....i think it will be the sons set because i was a little dissappointed with the actual size when you take it out of the box and mostly hobby stores dont stock half as much n scale stuff as n scale.....i think i am going to get rid of my poker table for now and get something ho scale.
Tony;
Dave Frary and Bob Hayden have been in this hobby since the year two. The two have more credentials in it and other things than I could count. Dave is really well-known in the "North Boston" area; Bob I don't know much about. I have had the priviledge of meeting and talking with Dave at length several times, and he is quite knowledgeable with regard to the Maine two-footers.
Without looking in past issues (which I may not have anyway), The waterfront scene you may be referring to is an area of Rangeley Lake that was called "Marble's" in the days of "Rustication". It seems that one could board a B&M passenger train in Boston, ride up to Waterville or Farmington that night, and find himself deboarding a two-foot parlour car-the Rangleley-in front of marble's Hotel. T'was the day, I guess.
Rich, I know the articles you are talking about, the ones I remember are ..even earlier. Carrabesset and Deadwood? Driftwood? It had the flat bottom Chessapeake sloops-skipjacks? and a probably testor's tug, 'cause that's all there was in HO scale boats back then!... sadly, because of Newfie here, I am going to put a oval of n-scale track like the Elk river one I remember in an empty 2X3 1/2' corner, but I do have an HO main down the middle of it, won't be easy.
NEWFIE! don't go to far with that N scale set- that could be the start of the narrow guage I've been on about. The track is fine as is, the cars and engine can be converted as you get the knack. Check out that Eric website, and get some ideas from the On30 page, just remember you will be half the size.... i've had no luck with search engines lately....wish I had a scanner again.... Well, an HOn30 (used to be HOn2 1/2, or HOn9? HOe9? in Europe) anyway a layout could fit ON the poker table....hey! the black diamond route? Queen of spades southern? hummmm.
Hmm... I'd recommend not going with N scale, but that's just my opinion. Some reasons why not...:
- It can be more expensive than HO
- It's really tiny. I wouldn't be able to stand it!
- Last, I know your not supposed to give into peer-pressure, but HO scale is the majority, and N is kind if the minority. As I write this the current post stats are:
N-2025
HO-13089
Thomas & Friends-4126
On30-3049
It would be hard to find information on N-scale, so I suggest you go with HO scale.
~Justin
So your saying there are more Thomas Fans than N scalers...
HO is easier to handle, there is more readily available equipment, and scale wheelsetss and couplers can be pruchased (N scale wheelsets SUCK, not in their mechanics, but in appearance!)
:)
Quote from: Guilford Guy on March 31, 2008, 06:01:46 PM
So your saying there are more Thomas Fans than N scalers...
HO is easier to handle, there is more readily available equipment, and scale wheelsetss and couplers can be pruchased (N scale wheelsets SUCK, not in their mechanics, but in appearance!)
:)
That's what I was trying to point out. I think it's kind of sad...
~Justin
This is a small forum compared to other websites. It is also the only one I know of to include a Thomas section. AFAIK There are wayyyyyy more N scalers than Thomas Fans.
"close to scale" HOn2.5 wheelsets are available-I had seen them this past W.Springfield show. Do not ask me where-I wasn't looking for them but ran across them anyway. I wish I had that kind of luck with great women.
Many years ago, Joueff had marketed HOn2.5 stuff, but I don't think the market was there for fine scale 2' gauge. Search the "Information Superhighway!"
Quote from: Chessie Sys. 3022 on March 31, 2008, 06:16:05 PM
Quote from: Guilford Guy on March 31, 2008, 06:01:46 PM
So your saying there are more Thomas Fans than N scalers...
HO is easier to handle, there is more readily available equipment, and scale wheelsetss and couplers can be pruchased (N scale wheelsets SUCK, not in their mechanics, but in appearance!)
:)
That's what I was trying to point out. I think it's kind of sad...
~Justin
That's not neccesarily an accurate representation of N-scalers. Bachmann has a bad reputation in N-scale right now due to the whole rapido/knuckle coupler fiasco(plus memories of the Junque Bachmann released in N-scale way back when). By contrast, Atlas, which is revered among N-scalers (the Atlas/Kato RS-3 is often considered the first N-scale locomotive that really ran well), has an N-scale board that is actually more active than their HO scale one. Clearly, quite a few N scalers are avoiding this site altogether.
I don't know why everyone here is so against N-scale. N has it's downsides, yes, but it alows much larger and more detailed layouts than an average person can do in HO. Indeed, I'm seriously considering switching to N scale myself for that very reason.
Oh, and "scale" couplers can be purchased in N scale. One just uses Z-scale couplers, which do work very well. No, it's not exactly to scale, but neither are the Kadee #58's.
Timothy
But there isn't "Proto 160." Proto 87 is where its at! :)