I recently started back at doing some re-lettering and some custom paint ect ..and have collected many decal sets over the years and kept them in a freezer bag thinking it would preserve them.They look new ,but when they are put into the water to separate from the sheet they turn in a thousand little pieces .They are Micro Scale . Is there anything that could be put on them or in the water to save them??? :(. The project was using a Bachmann gp40 shell.
Johnny
I thought I had come across, at one time, over on the TYCO forum, someone spraying Dullcote or something like that on the decal sheet, letting it dry, they applying the decals in the usual fashion.
A shot of clearcote will sometimes save a decal sheet as long as the carrier film is still okay.
Like @jbrock27, I've heard of using Testors Dullcote to restore Microscale decals, but have not tried it so cannot comment on its effectiveness.
I've read of it suggested many times over the years, so perhaps it works for some and maybe a viable fix.
FWIW... I have used Testors Dullcote to "seal" homemade inkjet decals from my printer, before application... it works.
But it's not the same, I was trying to eliminate the ink from lifting off the paper when immersed in water, you are trying to eliminate the crumbling of an old decal sheet.
Apples to Oranges.
I have used this on Microscale decals:
http://www.microscale.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=MD&Product_Code=MI-12&Category_Code=FINPROD
And I can state it works as advertised.
The liquid is applied very thinly with a brush.
http://www.microscale.com/Merchant2/graphics/Instructions/MSISysteminstr.pdf
A new pack of decals is what? 7-8 bucks.
Unless the ones you want to use are no longer produced, save yourself the headache and buy new ones.
We spend more than that on trucks and couplers for one car.
Good luck
@Yardy, what manufacturers "clearcote" do you have firsthand experience with using that will "sometimessave" a decal sheet?
Any enamel clear coat will do. Using dullcote will cause "silvering" (the clear parts of the decal will be hazy) when the decal is applied. Normal sequence of decaling a model is paint , gloss clear coat (so the clear decal film blends into the clear to avoid silvering), finish coat of clear gloss or flat to seal the decal depending on the desired finish..
probably not the answer you were looking for, nut i'd stay away from microscale unless you intend to use them right away. they are not the only decals in town.
Quote from: Yardmaster on June 12, 2016, 09:28:28 PM
Any enamel clear coat will do. Using dullcote will cause "silvering" (the clear parts of the decal will be hazy) when the decal is applied. Normal sequence of decaling a model is paint , gloss clear coat (so the clear decal film blends into the clear to avoid silvering), finish coat of clear gloss or flat to seal the decal depending on the desired finish..
I have also found that the clea rcoat works best.
Here is the thread that has the information in it that I mentioned I had come across, for you or anyone else who might be interested. Go to the last page, which I believe is 4 at this stage and work backwards to see mention of a sealer:
http://www.tycoforums.com/tyco/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=16767&whichpage=4
This is my choice for a decal coating. I use it for ones I print as well as to restore old sheets.
http://www.testors.com/product-catalog/testors-brands/testors/tools/decals?skuUpc=9200 (http://www.testors.com/product-catalog/testors-brands/testors/tools/decals?skuUpc=9200)
Sid
Quote from: WoundedBear on June 13, 2016, 05:22:41 PM
This is my choice for a decal coating. I use it for ones I print as well as to restore old sheets.
http://www.testors.com/product-catalog/testors-brands/testors/tools/decals?skuUpc=9200 (http://www.testors.com/product-catalog/testors-brands/testors/tools/decals?skuUpc=9200)
Sid
Thanks Sid.
I've a few old decals, five plus years and older that your suggestion above looks like a good fix.
I also have some old dry print transfers, can't think of the correct name, that I'd like to use but convert them to water slide decals. Any suggestions?
Cheers
Roger T.
Rog.....
With dry transfers, you can apply them to a piece of clear decal paper first. Usually dry transfers DO NOT require a clear top coat as the inks are water resistant as it is. Once you have it applied to the decal film, just trim and use it as you would a normal waterslide decal.
Sid
QuoteI also have some old dry print transfers, can't think of the correct name, that I'd like to use but convert them to water slide decals. Any suggestions?
Scan your dry transfers and decal sheets at 100% and save at the highest resolution possible.
When you need them, print to decal paper, using your "sealer" of choice.
You can use the "masters" before they crumble.
No worries if they go "out of production" or "discontinued".
As long as you're not selling them and making a profit, and using strictly for personal use only, no problems with copyright issues.
Quote from: James in FL on June 14, 2016, 04:36:53 PM
Scan your dry transfers and decal sheets at 100% and save at the highest resolution possible.
When you need them, print to decal paper, using your "sealer" of choice.
You can use the "masters" before they crumble.
No worries if they go "out of production" or "discontinued".
As long as you're not selling them and making a profit, and using strictly for personal use only, no problems with copyright issues.
So James.........how do you deal with white lettering or the white areas of the transfer? Alps printers are getting rarer and rarer.
Sid
As you well know, white ink is out of the question, White paper is an option when printing a negative such as Norfolk Southern.
You haven't really answered the question. How do you deal with the white areas? How would you trim around lettering? I'm not sure what your reference to Norfolk Southern means. Please explain further. I've tried printing on white decal paper with limited success, depending on the project.
Sid
Quote from: WoundedBear on June 14, 2016, 09:11:11 AM
Rog.....
With dry transfers, you can apply them to a piece of clear decal paper first. Usually dry transfers DO NOT require a clear top coat as the inks are water resistant as it is. Once you have it applied to the decal film, just trim and use it as you would a normal waterslide decal.
Sid
Thanks Sid.
Now off to buy decal paper. ;D
Cheers
Roger T.
QuoteSo James.........how do you deal with white lettering or the white areas of the transfer? Alps printers are getting rarer and rarer.
QuoteYou haven't really answered the question. How do you deal with the white areas? How would you trim around lettering? I'm not sure what your reference to Norfolk Southern means. Please explain further. I've tried printing on white decal paper with limited success, depending on the project.
I'm not sure I understand your question @WoundedBear.
When I need to have either a white area or white lettering in the decal, I use a white paper decal sheet for this.
The areas I want to stay white are simply not printed over, the whitepaper shows through those areas only the rest of the decal has ink over it.
The white background of the paper serves as the white color in your image (decal).
As for trimming around lettering, I have not found a need to do that.
I use a program called
paint.net this lets me lay my rail car directly on the scanner and I scan it and save (at 100%) as my first layer.
I then then capture my image of choice either from personal files or off the internet.
Next I superimpose the image on my car, sizing and positioning, until I'm satisfied with the look.
This becomes my second layer, again saved at the highest resolution.
This process is repeated until (one layer per each image/decal) I have all my artwork where I want it.
The first layer is then removed (car body).
This is then saved again as a final layer (highest resolution possible) and becomes my master.
With the program I'm using, I can click any area of the car body and copy that color to the decal sheet as necessary, this helps to blend in the finished product.Trimming the decal us usually done with a special pair if scissors dedicated to the task, or using an Exacto and a straight edge.
Colored pencils can be used to hide the white edge, I have also used black ink, and also used paint (dry brushing).
Generally I trim right on the edge of the image.
Reference to Norfolk Southern;
Was an instance I needed to make custom NS decals for a RPE4D slug I bashed.
Decals were printed as a negative in so much as only black ink was used, the white of the decal paper served as the white ink portions of the decals.
Decals were trimmed right at the image edges and dry brushed with black paint to hide the white edge.
I hope I have answered all your questions, if not feel free to PM, as I really hate to hijack this thread further.
http://www.getpaint.net/index.html
My apologies to the OP for the thread hijack.
I think what Bear is saying that you print the black portion of the NS on white decal paper to achieve the effect. But you are correct, since the disappearance of the ALPS printer system, I have seen no option available for printing white lettering from an inkjet or laser printer onto clear decal paper.
Thanks James. That explanation gives me a better understanding of your method. I had never considered scanning the car and using that as a layer when creating my decals. Great tip. That would work really well on a design that has both clear and white areas.
Sid
Quote from: James in FL on June 15, 2016, 02:41:49 PM
I really hate to hijack this thread further.
My apologies to the OP for the thread hijack.
Don't think this is a hijack at all; this is pertinent, relevant, great stuff! Thanks
James :)
QuoteI had never considered scanning the car and using that as a layer when creating my decals. Great tip. That would work really well on a design that has both clear and white areas.
Thanks Sid, That's the only way I know to do it (layering) where as the "clear" part is not clear at all, but rather the actual color of the car body, and I can still have white.
I've been doing it this way since '04, my first foray into custom decal making.
I'm sure it's probably not the only way, but I have success with it so I have stopped searching for an alternate way.
It would be very interesting to hear how other decal makers achieve this same effect.
But that's for another thread.
Quotethis is pertinent, relevant, great stuff! Thanks James Smiley
Thanks Jim
Hope somebody can find it useful.
Quote from: James in FL on June 17, 2016, 03:09:56 PM
Hope somebody can find it useful.
I think people already have :)
Great Info..Could not ask for a better response here.Have to try that clear coat.Have some wating to be used.Question ? Enamel or Laquer ? ??? ???
Johnny
Quote from: jward on June 12, 2016, 09:40:02 PM
probably not the answer you were looking for, nut i'd stay away from micro-scale unless you intend to use them right away. they are not the only decals in town.
No this is all great info. Like many cooks in the kitchen.Sometimes it does not work ,but in this case it does very much for anybody else looking for decal info the back shop manual is right here.Refreshing
Johnny
For clear (gloss) my weapon of choice is Krylon Crystal Clear Acrylic coating 1303A.
I buy at the Michaels craft store.
http://www.michaels.com/krylon-acrylic-crystal-clear/10520106.html
For dull coat I prefer Testors brand Dullcote from Walmat.
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Testors-Spray-Paint-Dullcote-Clear-3-oz/22056097
Remember there is alot more to it (painting/decaling) than has been discussed so far.
QuoteQuestion ? Enamel or Laquer ?
I doesn't matter which type you choose, lacquer or enamel, just stick with one type, both with your paints and topcoats.
Lacquer over enamel can sometimes cause problems.
If you're using lacquer top coat over enamel base coat expect this.
Personally I prefer lacquers.
Lacquers dry faster.
Most lacquers are fully cured (outgassed) in less than 24 hours, Enamels can take months to fully outgas (primary cause of silvering).
The outgassing of the solvents in the paint have nowhere to go, and are trapped under the decal and the clear or dull coat, this is where silvering comes from.
Whenever I paint, I wait at least a full week for my paint to completely dry and fully outgas, before applying the decals.
I have never found Dullcote in itself to cause silvering.
Tried the clear coat method and no luck .It took a wile for the film to separate from the paper backing ,but when it did the image just started to disintegrate in many small pieces. Hard to see why since the decal sheet looks to be in new condition with a good sheen to it and no cracks ,bends before I sprayed a coat of clear lak on it. I did not waste the whole sheet .Just one strip I cut out.Wondering if I used microscale set solution on the film before I dunk it in the water to soften up the film . Anybody try this?
Johnny
Quote from: brokenrail on July 01, 2016, 12:46:34 PM
microscale set solution on the film before I dunk it in the water to soften up the film .
That's not what the solution is designed for and is pretty much guaranteed to be unsuccessful.
Thing to use is Microscale's liquid decal film, which comes in same size bottle as Micro Set and Micro Sol setting solutions. It is designed with salvaging old decals as one of its purposes.
This is instructions for their various solvents, liquid decal film is toward bottom of page, http://www.microscale.com/Merchant2/graphics/Instructions/MSISysteminstr.pdf
QuoteThing to use is Microscale's liquid decal film, which comes in same size bottle as Micro Set and Micro Sol setting solutions. It is designed with salvaging old decals as one of its purposes.
This is instructions for their various solvents, liquid decal film is toward bottom of page, http://www.microscale.com/Merchant2/graphics/Instructions/MSISysteminstr.pdf
I said the same thing in reply #3
Maybe the OP missed it. ::)
Perhaps "Yardy" will comment on the
specific manufacturer brand he uses to restore old decals.
Did miss it ,but found the second. Need to go take a ride to support one of the last
LHS in my area and give it a go with the restorer from Microscale.Hope it works .Too many good ones to watch turn to dust in the water
:(
Johnny
Any enamel clear coat will work - Testors, Scalecoat, Humbrol, etc....