My Forney is dead, for no apparent reason, when trying to run it with standard DC power. Was debating about pulling the DCC plug and putting a dummy in and see what that does.
Also, I picked up a deal on another one, but it's a wood cab. Any ideas where to look for someone who might want to trade even for a steel cab?
And by dead I mean just that. Nothing happens when you apply power, but if I put another loco on the same track it runs fine, like the Forney isn't even there. Well, until it gets to where the Forney is parked. I'm not even sure what to check, I could pull out a voltmeter and maybe probe and see if it's getting power at the circuit board in the tender, but I didn't want to probe blindly -
Did it run on DC before? If you never tried you likely need to change the cv to run on DC I beleive they come default "stop" on DC. Does the light come on?
NM
Zip, zero, nada, no light no matter how far I turn the dial.
The engine did get programmed to a different address using an early MRC Prodigy system, which now isn't working, but I had someone tell me that it should still run on regular DC. I had assumed that somewhere in running it on DCC I'd changed something that prevented it from running without the right signal going to it.
I would think if that's the case, that if I follow the directions for a dummy plug, it should run on DC like any other DCC-ready loco, and when I get the Prodigy repaired or replaced, I could just plug the decoder back in and go. But it's out of warranty so I don't want to mess it up -
I recently found a deal on a second Forney and it came today. Switching the decoder from it to the non-operational one, it worked fine. This tells me I apparently have the decoder programmed in a way that it won't run on standard DC.
CV 29 is the CV to try changing to allow DC ops. Give a value of 0
Thanks, but I currently have no functional DCC control. Sent it out for repair today -
Meanwhile, the warranty department was of zero help trying to get a couple pieces to repair the second Forney properly. Even though the locomotive is brand new, apparently unless you buy it from just the right eBay seller, they treat it as used and you have to pay to have it serviced. I began to think I was dealing with The Favorite Spot's (complete lack of) customer service. The person I dealt with had the gaul to say that if you buy your Bachmann product in a clearance sale, they won't honor the warranty then either. Says nothing about this in the paperwork, so it wouldn't hold up in court, but who's going to sue them over that?
What I learned is when I have a warranty issue with a Bachmann product, I would most likely need to lie about where and when I purchased the item if I want them to stand behind it.
So if anyone has an extra Type B headlight, I could use one, have several oil lights and Type A's I could swap. In fact it would be nice to get about three of them so I could put them on the tender also. I don't know what I'll do about the broken cylinder saddle, I guess live with it, since they aren't listed seperately.
It does not matter who you buy your bachmann trains from If you have the warranty card you can get service under warranty. The service department needs a receipt OR the warranty card. That is how the policy reads so they must stand by it.
NM
You would think that, but I emailed the service person a copy of the PayPal reciept, probably the mistake was in including a link to the auction listing too. They don't like my eBay seller, is what it boils down to. And someone goofed up at that seller too, somewhere along the line there must have been an inside frame and an outside frame side by side that got put away in each other's boxes - that's why I have no "B" headlight, it comes installed on the inside frame. But the engine had no wheel wear at all, and it's common to take something out of the box in a store so people can see it.
It seems hard to believe, but my guess is Bachmann was losing too much money on warranty stuff with the lifetime warranty, which is why they went to the one year warranty. Okay, fine, but is it so bad they have to be this tight and specific about it? :o We're talking like $5 cost worth of parts here and I'll fix it myself, it's not like I magically expected a complete new locomotive to show up in the mail, or even expected them to fix it for me.
Well I am glad I have been lucky I have 14 bachmann steam engines 8 on30 6 G scale all great, well except for some wobbly wheels... For the life of me I don't understand how they can't get the wheels on straight!
NM
Quote from: lvrr325 on May 29, 2010, 12:15:21 AM
Thanks, but I currently have no functional DCC control. Sent it out for repair today -
Sometimes, it's smarter or cheaper to fix it yourself, regardless of warranties. In this case, you could have installed a new decoder of your choice, some of which are available for as little as $16.00 (street price). Replacing the factory installed Bachmann decoder with a better quality decoder wouldn't be too hard to do, and by the time you figure the cost of shipping the loco to Bachmann, along with their "service charge", it probably would have been cheaper, too.
Still, having a problem getting service as described by the terms of the warranty paperwork, is pretty frustrating. It used to be that Bachmann had a reputation for poor quality control, but their warranty service was unbeatable. Apparently, while their products may now be somewhat better, their warranty support is not as good as it used to be. Sorry to hear of your problem.
Regards,
Bill
Why would I replace the decoder when I have no means to control it? I sent that out to it's manufacturer (MRC) for repair this week. Swapping decoders between the old Forney and the new one revealed it works fine, the decoder is just programmed such that it won't run without a controller set to address it properly.
But to find that out I had to buy a second locomotive that I happened to find by coincedence on eBay, and that locomotive got some damage in transit to me. All I wanted was a new cylinder saddle assembly, and possibly a new headlight, one to repair a broken part and one since I simply have none.
The warranty department, in essence, told me to eat it - nothing but excuses because they want $30 out of me so they can fix something I can swap out in five or ten minutes myself.
Quote from: lvrr325 on May 31, 2010, 09:55:33 PM
Why would I replace the decoder when I have no means to control it? I sent that out to it's manufacturer (MRC) for repair this week. Swapping decoders between the old Forney and the new one revealed it works fine, the decoder is just programmed such that it won't run without a controller set to address it properly.
But to find that out I had to buy a second locomotive that I happened to find by coincidence on eBay, and that locomotive got some damage in transit to me. All I wanted was a new cylinder saddle assembly, and possibly a new headlight, one to repair a broken part and one since I simply have none.
The warranty department, in essence, told me to eat it - nothing but excuses because they want $30 out of me so they can fix something I can swap out in five or ten minutes myself.
From re-reading through your posts, it sounds like you purchased your loco from the Favorite Spot, and have all the paperwork supporting the sale, yet Bachmann is trying to treat the warranty issue like you purchased a used locomotive. Is this basically correct? If so, have you notified Ray Cozza at The Favorite Spot of this attitude at Bachmann regarding items purchased from him? Understand that at the prices he gets on eBay (sometimes well below dealer cost), he can't afford to handle returns or repairs, especially since that is what Bachmann's warranty department is there for. But, he is a very large wholesale customer for Bachmann, and I'm sure hearing news like this will not make him happy. Perhaps both you and he need to contact a higher-up at Bachmann, and see if this can't be worked out. Clearly, this sounds like a problem that Bachmann needs to look into.
The cylinder saddles breaking on these things during shipment were a known problem from the very beginning and Bachmann was replacing the locos, since the damage was thought to be caused by lack of proper support from the packaging. It's quite possible that the loco you got had been opened for the purpose of taking the photos for eBay, and that is how the boxes got mixed up. If so, that should not make it a used locomotive from Bachmann's perspective, especially when there was so much on the newsgroups about the broken cylinder problem.
One of our clubmembers got a Forney with a broken cylinder when they were first released by Bachmann a couple of years ago. He was going to return it to them, but ended up gluing back together himself (I think he used some CA, perhaps Dr. Mike's) rather than hassle with shipments back and forth. It seemed to work just fine.
I hope you receive some resolution to your problem.
Good luck,
Bill
Uh, no, I bought it from someone else as The Favorite Spot is apparently not interested in my business. I made the mistake of asking them a question some time back (I asked if they could run a particular catalog number in an auction format listing) and after a very rude response found myself blocked from bidding at all. Which makes me unsure I'd want to buy anything from these people - if they treat you like dirt for asking a question, they're going to be complete jerks when there's a real problem like a non-op loco or the wrong item gets shipped. Inquiries since asking about the block have been ignored. I would highly suggest avoiding doing business with those people. They apparently feel they sell enough they're above having customer service.
This is why I said apparently some eBay sellers are more equal than others, apparently they only warranty the stuff from the big money buyer. Then again they probably have to, because I'm sure TFS will tell you to pound sand anyways.
I guess I'll spell this out from the beginning again just to be clear:
The Forney I bought about three years ago did not operate; this would be Forney #1.
Last week I jumped on an eBay auction for Forney #2 simply because it was a good deal.
Using the decoder from Forney #2 installed in Forney #1 I determined that decoder #1 is programmed such that it won't operate on regular DC. Problem solved.
So I sent out my damaged DCC control for repair.
In the meantime, Forney #2 arrived in the wrong box and with the cylinder saddle broken. New Problem.
Since the engine was new in box with no signs of use, I contacted Bachmann to see if they could supply me with the repair part for it rather than send it in. I provided a copy of my reciept and a link to the eBay auction. I figured it would be cheaper for them to let me repair the engine, plus it wouldn't risk further damage to it sending it back. I never contacted my eBay seller about the problem.
After multiple emails with Bachmann's warranty department I was told that because they didn't like the seller I purchased from, the only way to get it repaired would be for me to send it in with the $30 fee, they refused to send me the replacement part to repair it or to send the headlight I didn't get because the loco was boxed incorrectly.
In the course of the emails the woman from the warranty department stated that Bachmann won't warranty items sold via a clearance sale. (yet they'll honor it on The Favorite Spot's fire sale auctions??) This isn't stated in the paperwork and it's unlikely it would hold up in court, but of course it's unlikely anyone would sue them since it would cost more to go to court than it's worth. My response was to point out that it's not my problem they wholesale to someone (The Favorite Spot) who retails from that price, so that other hobby sellers can't compete and eventually take the items collecting dust on their shelves, eBay them to recover some of their investment, and write off the loss.
So what I've learned from this experience is if I wish Bachmann to honor their warranty, I need to lie about where and when I purchase Bachmann products such that it will convince them the item is covered by their standards. I used to have my own store; I have a cash register left; a phony receipt is not a big deal, but it disgusts me that I should have to go to such a length particularly now that I find out this is a known problem at Bachmann.
It's tempting me to put all this stuff up for sale on eBay and dump the On30 idea entirely, between the jerks selling it and the company that won't stand behind it, it's not very much fun. Which is why most of it has been put up for about two years in the first place.
Quote from: lvrr325 on June 02, 2010, 07:15:06 AM
>>>snip<<<
It's tempting me to put all this stuff up for sale on eBay and dump the On30 idea entirely, between the jerks selling it and the company that won't stand behind it, it's not very much fun. Which is why most of it has been put up for about two years in the first place.
lvrr325,
Thanks for the clarification. Personally, I have had many dealings with the Spot over the past couple of years, all of which have been very positive. It is unfortunate that you had the problem with them that you did.
I agree that Bachmann's pricing structure is very inequitable and punishes the small dealers just for being small. I also feel that Bachmann's warranty policies are misleading and do not really support the product as well as Bachmann implies it does. Even in the days of their "Lifetime Warranty", if you actually read the fine print, the handling/service charge was usually about what the wholesale import value of any of their items was worth, so basically what they were doing was selling you a new item at their wholesale cost, and calling it a warranty replacement. Back then, they were fairly lenient and tended to support the customer much better, but their products were so cheap it didn't much matter. Once the Spectrum On30 stuff came out at a much higher price, their "Lifetime Warranty" policy was dropped. This was done quietly, with many customers and dealers who didn't always read the fine print, thinking that all Bachmann products still were covered by a "Lifetime Warranty". Some still believe it.
Unfortunately, if you want to model in On30, you must either scratch build, kit-bash, or simply accept Bachmann as they are, since there are so few players in the game. The other few major manufacturers who make locomotives for On30 are no better than Bachmann when it comes to their pricing policies or their warranties, and for this reason, very few dealers will stock their products. The only reason most stores carry Bachmann is because they are well established through all the major hobby distribution channels, and it's easy. Still, very few stores will stock any On30.
After my own disappointment with Bachmann's on-going gear splitting problems, both in HO and On30, I'm also beginning to think On30 is more frustrating than fun, due to available steam locomotives (and rail-trucks) being so unreliable when it comes to operation. I am reluctant to buy any new Bachmann On30 releases as a result of my own bad experiences with their HO and On30 Shays, On30 Climax, and rail-trucks. In fact, I would have already given up On30 altogether, if I had not had a good experience with my Forney's, O.F. 2-8-0's, 4-4-0's and Davenport switchers (yet others have complained of gear problems with their Davenports).
Regards,
Bill
Bill, Sorry to here about all of the problems you have had with Bachmann locomotives,I cannot say I have had that trouble. Ijust got into On30 last year with the ten wheelers and mine have been run alot with no problems at all!!(ET&WNC) I switched from H.O. when they came out. I have two of these and am getting ready to buy another one with sound. I hope Bachmann is addressing these issues because I really like this scale and think it has great promise. Will let you know if I have any problems with my engines. Dwayne Calloway
Hi Dwayne,
Thanks for responding. Splitting plastic gears on model locos is not a new problem, it has been going on for many years, and can affect all types of locos, even very expensive brass ones. This is not caused by normal wear and tear, or customer abuse of any kind, but can occur on locos that have never been run, even ones that are still sealed in the factory shrink-wrap. Frequently, by the time the defect is discovered, the manufacturer or importer has gone out of business, and you are then stuck with a display model that cannot operate. If replacement gears are available, then at least the problem is more of an annoyance than a serious problem. The frustration begins when a manufacturer or importer denies that there is a problem and fails or refuses to do anything to rectify the situation, or expects the customer to foot the bill for a problem that is clearly a factory defect. It's not so easy to shrug your shoulders and write it off when a locomotive costs several hundred dollars instead of twenty or thirty dollars like the old days.
In the case of Bachmann On30 locos, the big culprits seem to be the geared logging locos like the Shay, Climax, and the little rail-truck. There have been many reports of this on the various groups since these models were introduced, and the numbers seem to be increasing as time goes on. There also have been spotty reports of similar problems in the Porters (presently out of production), and the little Davenport side-rod gas-mechanical switcher. From the time they were first released, the Forneys had a widely publicized problem with their cylinder sets being broken due to inadequate packaging protection, and up to now, the reports were that Bachmann had been making good on these. Subsequent shipments had modifications made to the packaging that supposedly corrected the problem. I guess now that the Forneys have been on the dealers shelves for a couple of years Bachmann has decided that they no longer need to stand behind their product, using the excuse that these must now all be used locomotives (I have a local dealer that has several Forneys on his shelves, still sealed in the factory shrink-wrap, along with a couple that have been opened to be put in the display case. Apparently, the only way to demonstrate that the loco is new and not used, is if the shrink-wrap is still intact, but the only way to detect the cracked cylinder saddle defect is to open the box, effectively making it a used locomotive as far as Bachmann is concerned, and therefore eligible for a not insignificant "service charge".
Hopefully, if you don't have any of these models in your collection, you won't see this problem.
Regards,
Bill
Incredibly, the engine just about caught on fire, for real, tonight. I've run it around a 10x14 loop about 4 or 5 times; I start it out tonight it gets about 8 feet and quits. Will go in reverse but not forward. I noticed a burned smell, so I pull the coal load and take the decoder out. It's melted the shrink wrap over one of the chips. Applying power again trying to see the problem, the chip glows bright orange-white and smokes!
Further playing with the dummy pins I'm guessing one of the components on the tender PC board has failed, as with one side installed it creates a dead short and one resistor gets hot.
But had I left it to run and break in and it did this, or it quit inside a tunnel where I couldn't see the problem as fast as I did, there's a good shot it would have caught fire before the circuit breaker tripped.
I'm just about beyond words at this one. I have portable transistor radios from the 60s that have been beat around and work just fine - even if this thing is old stock, the PC board has a June 2006 date on it, it's four years old tops, and stuff is dead on it already?
My only suggestion at this point is that you might consider removing the problematic DCC system altogether and converting the loco to DC only. I once bought a 2-8-0 from a seller on Ebay, only to discover that a DCC system had been poorly installed. I uninstalled it, wired the motor to pull power directly from the rails, and it runs perfectly, and silently.
Either that, or install an entirely new DCC system.
manager
Dear LV,
Please send the loco back to the service department right away.
thanks!
the Bach-man
Bill, I have a problem with everything being made in China these days. I know it is a cost issue, but the quality suffers. I used to drive a semi-truck for Broyhill furniture and watch them close almost every plant down (over seven thousand peoplelaid off) mostly in my home county, And now the quality is awlful!!!!!! I am very glad we have so many options in modeling now, but I would like to see it made here and would pay a little more as long as quality was good. D. Calloway
Of course to remove the DCC means you can't use the headlight, since the short is in the loco elsewhere meaning the PC board would need to be amputated as well and the LED in the headlight won't last long on 12-16V.
In any case, after many many emails, explaining the decoder issue several times, the woman who was the most help taking a few days off, I finally was assured if I sent it in they'd replace it, so I sent it in last Friday and checked in today to find out they've already sent a new replacement. Hopefully the new one arrives in good shape and I can move on to the next thing.
Warranty replacement arrived today, sealed NIB. Ran it a couple laps around the layout; these things really should have a coupler on the back with the shank offset to the bottom of the knuckle, but that's a production issue. (they're low compared to Bachmann rolling stock and come uncoupled at the end of grades and the like).