Bachmann Online Forum

I've got a couple of questions that are probably really simple. I did a search and didn't find anything so I'm gonna ask. Bear with me, I'm new to this.
I was looking at the the layouts at this page

http://www.thortrains.net/marx/kdlayhoa.html

I was going to attempt one of these so my 5 yr old would have something besides an oval. Thinking that the second one down is the one we want to try. In the materials list they reference Atlas True Track but I want to use EZ Track since we already have several pieces. Is the 30 degree curve the same as the EZ 18" curve? Can I substitute for the 1.5" pc or do I need to plan on cutting a pc of EZ track for that piece? Lastly, this won't require any tricky wiring will it?

Don't know about the EZ-track but have couple of suggestions.
Change the RH turnout at top left to a Remote to match the LH turnouts at top center and top right.
Extend bottom siding to match the top one---Needs two less curves but more straights.

Eric UK

Check out this design that was submitted to Carl Arendt's excellent website. This English gentleman (aren't they all Eric?) designed it for his two 7-year old sons. It looks interesting and combines a couple of switching puzzles:


The design you show, in your post, only seems to allow one train at a time to operate. Any of us that have dealt with kids know that is a recipe for disaster!

Good luck,

Ray

this layout needs no special wiring, especially if your layout will have dcc.
if you are planning on using the conventional dc locomotives, you may want to gap the rails to create isolated sections or "blocks" where you can park a locomotive while another one runs. if you only intend on having one locomotive, you can omit this step.

there are severalcomponents marketed by atlas which simplify the block wiring. most of these contain several on-off switches in one housing, you run a wire from your power pack to the switch unit, then off the terminals above each switch you run a wire to the track in each seperate block. the other rail in the block is used as a common return, and wired directly to the power pack.


checque out this link for diagrams.
http://www.building-your-model-railroad.com/model-railroad-wiring.html#blockwiring

Just a side note, I notice that both sidings have a road intersecting both tracks? The towns inhabitance won't be very happy having to wait for parked trains on the siding to move all day long. Oops I guess I'm being over critical to a kids layout.

Thanks for the input and the links. That'll help a bunch. There's a lot of good info. May go with a more involved layout, not sure yet. Don't want the first one to be too confusing for my son.

Tyler...I hadn't paid too much attention to the scenery, was more concerned with finding a different layout that does something besides go in a circle. Maybe I could add a bridge, my son already found those at the shop and really wanted to get one. Any thoughts on the 1.5" track? Also are turnouts and switches the same thing?

Since I don't have much tied up in track (12 curves, 4 straights) would I be better to use a different type track?

Track?

Bachmann EZ, Code 100, N/S or Steel
Widely available,easy to find, any self respecting LHS will have some on hand.
Great variety of parts  to choose from like cross overs, #6 turnouts, diamonds, ect.
EZ to find online.
Good stuff for people just starting out.


Atlas True Track, Code 83
Good ol snap track on a road bed! Can be removed from roadbed if you wish.  Not as many different pieces to choose from, only basic turnouts
available at this time.
But there is enough to build youself a decent basic layout.
Rare find in LHS, but is easy to find on online sites, and is less expensive
than EZ track.
Try Trainsetsonly.com for example.
http://www.trainsetsonly.com/page/TSO/CTGY/TrueTrack
Good stuff,looks good,performs well and I use it myself.
Can be used with other Atlas code83 parts,if you do not mind mixing in
cork roadbed with the plastic roadbed.
All Atlas track is Nickel Silver.

Kato,,Looks good and many in this forum seem to like it. Never used it myself, so no comments,,,hit or miss in LHS,,can be found online.

Life Like Power Lock,,Never used it. I'm sure it works, may be good for Very
Simple track plans. Most LHS in my area do not even bother to carry it,
but will order if you ask.

None of the above can be mixed together, they are not interchangeable .

But which track to use? Your call there.

Switch and turnouts, loosely speaking, yes they are the same thing.
in a nutshell:
Switch is what makes it work, turnout is what is does.

the problem with most roadbed track is that it is too limiting in terms of pieces available. your inability to find a 1.5" straight section is an example of what i am talking about. if you are willing to live with those limitations then by all means use the roadbed track. if not you may wish to consider using regular track such as that made by atlas. you can buy cork roadbed to put under that track if you wish, and i believe but am not sure that the height of track and cork roadbed will match up with your ez track.

be aware also that if you use roadbed track you are pretty much stuck with one brand. atlas true track in particular has a different rail size (code 83) than ez track(code 100) and life like power lock track has a bizarre way of connecting the pieces together.

atlas makes their line of regular track in both code 83 and 100 so you can match the rail size used on your ez track.

switches and turnouts are the same thing. turnout is the model railroading term, railroad employees usually call them switches. these are not to be confused with the electrical switches used in block wiring.

as far as the elevated sections with bridges, there are trastle sets that will give you a nice over and under layout, and they are designed with beginners in mind. or, woodland scenics has a system of foam risers which provide a nice slope your trains will be able to climb to get up to the bridge. these can later be hidden as a mountainside or an embankment, which is hard to do with a trestle set.

The marx layouts are fun and will work with bachmann EZ trac . I've built a few of them . your better off building a 5x9 foot layout to modify the turnouts , to get away from the S curves and put at least a 4" straight in the middle of the "s" to keep the derailments down . just a word of caution on these MARX layouts on thortrains . on the turnouts and switches ,there are so many small pieces of track you get humps and valleys if you don't secure the track down . I probably changed my layout up 10 times before , I finally enlarged it from a 4x8 to a 5x9 to get true radiouses and  a good geometrical   and flat layout . A well layed track gives you a life time of fun and less problems

And one more thing . on the 4 ft width the track is very close to the edge's . If your layout is elevated and you have a derailment on one of the S curves on the turnout . it's like going over a cliff . I damaged a couple of cars and loco's due to this .    please excuse my spelling and gramme I got medicine head now .peace to all .

Jason,

If you still think of using the Marx plan,omit the curved section of track across the middle which gets rid of the need for the 1 1/2" section. Use the turnouts to provide two more sidings(more switching options), with the top turnout changed to a RH .

Eric UK

 Another thought. If you have access to both sides of layout, all turnouts can be manual type.

Eric UK

Turnout - the whole kit and caboodle - the moving point rails, the frog where the rails cross, the guard rails, the running rails through the turnout and the rails leading up to the points and frog.  Plus of course the ties and spikes used to hold the whole mess together.

Switch - just the moving rails (point rails) and by implication the parts needed to move them.

This is true both on model railroads and real world turnouts and switches.

These days railroad track, particularly when used for temporary repairs, is in the form of pre-built "panel track."  This is the full size equivalent of Snap Track.  The turnouts are also pre-built and are conceptually the equivalent of Snap Switches.  The panel track is transported stacked up on flat cars while the turnouts are shipped on edge in gondolas.  The crews that install them refer to the complete appliances in the gondolas as "turnouts" as do the manufacturers.  It is just that we rarely meet these guys.

The guys (and gals) we do meet are usually engine crew.  They "throw the switches," when the need arises, by operating a switch stand.  This is most common in yards.  Alternately the switches are thrown by a switch motor, which in turn is controlled by a dispatcher working in an office, often hundreds of miles away.  Note that none of these guys is "throwing a turnout" - that is a job that requires a crane and other heavy equipment.  All they are throwing is the "switch," that is, the movable parts of a turnout.

The confusion arises in model railroads when we want to be able to choose different routes.  For that, we need a switch that we can throw.  But without the rest of the turnout, a switch is useless.  So we install a complete turnout.

Bottom line, as civil engineers building the track, we install turnouts.  As train engineers using the track, we throw switches.  As navies pounding in the spikes, we sweat and swear a lot no matter what you call them.

Jim

please, please, please provide aspirin  :'( :'( :'(

Jason

The link to the Train layouts look great!  I have a 6 yr old and it is all about spending time with the family. We love going the whole experience.

Robert

After re-reading this post and looking at the layout you are interested in . it calls for 6" straight you will have to use 2 3" straights in it's place .i believe bachmann has 2.25 " 3" 4.5" and 9" to get the 2" straights we need at times you can buy a 90 degree crossover at which they come with 4 2" straights and the 90 cross . as for the 1.5" piece . you could cut one down ,but would be altering 3 pcs actually . On the thortrain sites there is a couple of web pages were the MARX layouts due use bachmann EZ track some similar to what you were looking at . I believe if you search 4x8 HO layouts you will find them . Then you can utilize the track you have ,and save some money .  No special wiring good for d/c or dcc use . I used a few of the layouts as i said before . But as i got into this hobby ,after awhile I just wasn't satisfied and wanted more . And now i don't have the House to go with the Hobby .

A plan i am considering has your original plan worked into it but with an extra part, look, at the left side.

(http://i723.photobucket.com/albums/ww238/irbricksceo/Layout01.jpg)

I think Bachmann is coming out with small fitter pieces.

Wow...I was gone for the weekend and missed all the replies.

Not sure what the Marx layouts are? After looking at the thor site a little more I've decided to build one from this page:

http://www.thortrains.net/marx/funlayez1.html

Probably just start with the one on the upper left. Nevermind about the Marx thing, figured it out when I pasted the link. I had noticed that these were really close to the edge, may try to do a larger table for it. I had visions of engines and cars diving off the table. 

I'm using dc control now, do I need to do any special wiring on this layout? What is a good reference book for me to use to learn about wiring?

Jim...Thanks for the info about switches and turnouts.

Jason
I like the one that is second one down on the right as you can run 2 trains simultaneously and never have to worry about the bumping into each other.

As for the books I am not sure about DC. But Your local Hobby shop would have some good options. 

This recommendation always sparks good conversation.  But I would still rec comend Running DCC. Personally I have found it easier.  I have seat up many DC systems in the past and I was excited to make the switch.  To me it was an easy decision.  But many people love running Trains in DC. Jim always has great advice on this.

The one DCC book I like is the DCC Projects & Applications by Model Railroader. When we bought our 1st DCC Bachmann starter set it came with a great DVD. And actually I see that most of the scenes are available on youtube.  I can find the links and email them to you after I get home from work if you like.

You son will take to the DCC operation quickly I bet.

Enjoy

Robert

If you are going DC only, it would be wise to separate each section or block with plastic rail joiners thus insulating each section from another. I used to use DPDT center off switches so I could control the layout with two power packs. The DPDT switch has 6 contacts, 2 rows of 3. The left 2 would control the right power pack, the center 2 go to the track, and the right 2 would be for the left power pack. Each block or section would have its own DPDT switch, so if there are 12 blocks, there would be 12 switches.( and 72 wires)
If you control the layout with DCC, there would be no switches and on a layout as small as you suggest, only a few wires that connect to a Bus system that connects to your DCC system. As each locomotive has its own address, it could be turned on and off and sped up or slowed down by the DCC system independent from other locos even if they were on the same track. With DCC, you could even have your own corn field meet if you wanted. Turnouts can be controlled by DCC as well. I use the NCE power cab system and everything can be controlled by my hand held unit, locos, turn table, turnouts, etc.

Robert...I looked on youtube and wasn't sure which videos. Overload as usual. If you could send me the links that would be great. Thanks.

This is a little far afield of my original question, but I was wondering whether you guys thought I should buy my stuff from the local guy (who'll have to order everything in) or buy it online and save the money? Looks like I can save at least 25% ordering online. Best I can tell the local guy is putting the SRP on everything.

It depends on a few things...but from what you said, I would buy them online and save money, but be sure to buy fro m a legitimate Bachmann dealer-in case you have to send anything in for repairs...
Personally, I  buy most of my things from my LHS because I am good friends with the owner...he will usually give me a discount or even something for free, but if there is a big price difference, or if isn't otherwise available in my area, I will buy it on ebay or some other discount retailer, but I make sure they're legit first...just in case

where it says 2 bachmann EZ track inch straight ,and doesn't give a size you will need a 2" straight . you can get them from a 90 degree crossing .

if you go dcc control you will have to do special wiring and can run multiple trains .

as for the MARX that is who designed the layouts . i built a couple of these layouts and they do work well .i just did some different things with the layout but was a good starting point for me

You do not require special wiring for DCC. In fact you do not need the block wiring and switches required in DC to run multiple trains under individual control.

Eric UK

checkque out any of the atlas layout books. they should be in stock at any decent hobby shop. most are layout books but they also include basic wiring instructions, and basic scenery instructions as well. there is also a book dedicated to wiring in the series. even though i've been in model railroading for almost 40 years now, i still like to look at those books.

the latest editions include both dc and dcc wiring for each layout.

wiring for dc is not complicated, it consists of the same circuits replicated over and over. the 3 basic circuits are:

1. basic block wiring, whereby you can control a section of track.
2. reverse loop wiring, which is block wiring with a direction switch added.
3. switch motor wiring.

master those 3, and know when to use each, and you can wire the largest layout you can imagine.

You will find as you shop around that Atlas makes the least expensive and most varied track and turnouts in their regular line of code 83 or 100. If you use track that has the roadbed on it the price is much higher. Regular track can be used if you put cork roadbed under it to match the height of the Bachmann track. Cork roadbed is cheap and when combined with the regular Atlas track, much cheaper than track with the roadbed preinstalled.