I have the Atlas 9" turntable. I also picked up the accompanying motor unit.
The instructions suggest a DPDT switch to control the motor with the power pack. I do not like this option.
I was thinking of this:
I have two wall warts: ones output is 9V at 150mA; the other is 9V at 300mA. Can I set up a momentary switch to operate the motor with one of these power sources? I believe it is a 12V motor. Will this be enough juice to turn the table? I understand I won't be able to control the speed.
I've mentioned before I'm challenged in the electronics department. It seems like a logical set up. Just don't want to burn the house down.
Thanks.
Regards,
Jonathan
You are better off with the DPDT co switch as holding a button until the train is at the right spot will end up as a pain. With the DPDT switch, you can leave it on until its at its position and then shut it off. Because the way the turntable is geared it stops at every position and waits a couple of seconds, goes to the next spot, stops for a couple of seconds, etc, etc, etc. You could use the wall wort for power, but you'll need a way to stop and reverse the turntable, that's what the DPDT switch is for.
jonathon-
The DPDT switch is the only way to go. You can end up holding your momentary switch for a looonng time while you wait for the table to index at every stall.
I'm not so sure your nine volt warts are up to the job, especially the 150ma one. Even the larger one is likely to be taxed to its limit. That's okay, I suppose, but you don't want a failure in the middle of an operating session. After all, stopping everything while you search (possibly fruitlessly) for the crank which came with the table and install it would be a real bummer.
--D
Thank you.
I was afraid someone would recommend keeping the DPDT switch. I may swoon from the answer, but could someone rescue me and tell me how to wire the switch so it changes the direction of the motor? I assume the answer will have a diagram like this:
- - -
- - -
Thanks again.
Jonathan
Lets number each post. 1 2 3
4 5 6
To start, run wires from 4-3 and 1-6, That's for reversing the circuit
second, use 1 and 4 to power the turn table
third, use 2 and 5 to hook to your power source.
If the switch is thrown to the left, its contacts will touch 2,3 and 5, 6
If the switch is thrown to the right, its contacts will touch 1,2 and 4,5
If the switch is thrown to the center, no contacts are made.
Got o the below Google search link I found. Scroll down to DC Power supples. The circuit is clearly shown.
http://www.trainweb.org/strrailroad/choirb08.html
Get a multimeter like the below one. I have three of those. Use the 200 ohms scale for continuity checks.
Sometimes this company has them on sale for $4.99.
Use the meter to check for motor current when installing DCC.
Check the layout for wiring shorts when wiring the layout.
http://www.harborfreight.com/7-function-digital-multimeter-90899.html
There are plenty of Google links for using a multimeter. No model railroader should be without one and the knowledge to use it.
You can also buy them off of ebay for $10.00 or less including shipping. I have done that before. You just have to be a careful shopper. They alll come from China and I hope they are Melamine free. ;)
Rich
jonathon-
You can also use an Atlas Twin which will come with instructions. It can also reverse the polarity on a turntable although the Atlas unit is designed to eliminate this issue if you are careful about wiring the stall tracks. You can probably find a used one at your LHS or pick one up on ebay for a few dollars. They aren't elegant but they work. However, I'd pick up a switch at Radio Shack or a home store for much less. Good luck with your project. Just think of the satisfaction you'll enjoy when it's all hooked up and working like a charm.
--D
Thanks, all.
I now understand how to wire the DPDT switch, which should fit well on the little panel I made for turntable control.
I tested the 9V 300mA wall wart this morning. It provides plenty of power for the motor. So I secured the motor in place and ran a couple of temporary wires. Lubed the motor assembly and tested the table operation. Works great. The motor is quite noisy, even with the structure covering it. I may experiment with some kind of sound deadening insulation in the dead space around the motor.
I stored the crank in the motor kit box, for safe keeping. I also discovered a spare drive belt in the motor kit box. Bonus!
Off to Radio Shack for a DPDT switch...
Thanks, again.
Regards,
Jonathan
Making progress on my turntable project, thanks to your help.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2475.jpg)
Here's the DPDT switch. It's a little big, but it was also the least expensive one, so I'll live with it. Plus, it works! Thanks for the wiring tip, PD.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2463.jpg)
The Atlas prototype was a rare design. It was engineered to share space with automobiles. Thus it was totally flat to accomodate cars and trucks. I'm building up the front to allow the same thing. Still have 1/8" to go. :)
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2474.jpg)
I used every kind of scrap track I had for the stall tracks; steel, NS, brass, 83, 100, etc. This piece of brass track reads 'Made in Austria' or 'Hungary', I can't remember which. Notice the wood grain looks like finger prints. It all works.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2467.jpg)
I made the wheel stops out of rail joiners from the really old brass track. Just flatten, file, and install. Thanks for the ideas on that, too.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2473.jpg)
Will build up around the structure, as well, to hide all the plastic pieces.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2469.jpg)
Here's the motor. It's loud as all get out, but it works.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2470.jpg)
Regards,
Jonathan
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2471.jpg)
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2468.jpg)
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2476.jpg)
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2466.jpg)
Jonathan is turning out to be very old-school--Varney and Bowser engines and cars, ancient Athearn cars, brass track in some places--may not always be the closest to scale fidelity, but I think it looks cool and he has fun! What more could you ask?
I recall reading in one of my ancient magazines, in a review of the Atlas turntable when it was new, that the turntable, with its deck, is inspired by the covered table in the roundhouse at the B&O Museum in Baltimore!
Now, for some more "homework:" check out "How to Wire Your Model Railroad," by the late Lynn Wescott. Wescott was the editor of Model Railroader for many years, and in addition to a variety of articles and editorials, wrote a number of "how to" books. This one dates from the late 1950's or early 1960's, and was still in print until relatively recently (like the last 20 years or so). Given its age, it's about traditional block wiring, so for DCC users it's hopelessly out of date, but it also goes into the function of things like DPDT and SPST switches, motor construction, and a bit of electrical theory, all done in a sort of folksy style that is both easy to understand and, I think, enjoyable to read--and electricity is not one of my favorite subjects.
Enjoy.
I'm more like cheap school. ;)
Actually, I'm all about incorporating my inherited equipment as much as possible. I like the connection across generations. It also helps me afford the fancy engines (Spectrum, Genesis, Master Series, BLI, etc).
With DCC and a computer, one could set up a 'set it and forget it' layout. You could conceivably, program an operating session, and stand back and watch it all run. Instead, I have set up three operating stations, requiring me to operate throttles on/off switches, turnouts, and lighting eventually. Makes me feel like I'm part of the action in my fantasy universe.
And, yes, I'm having a great deal of fun! (except the homework)
Regards,
Jonathan
Jonathan, I think you may have some Rocco track on your hands.
Man, more homework. I had to look up Roco. Just found a couple of wiki paragraphs. It doesn't surprise me that my grandfather would have sought ought German/Austrian made equipment, since both sides of my family are either of German or Austrian heritage (going back a couple of centuries anyway).
This is why like playing with the old gear. The history is great.
Perhaps, just perhaps, this is also why I like Bachmann stuff, too.
Regards,
Jonathan
made in China
jonathan, were you made in china?????/
Jonathon-
I'm impressed by the fine work you did with the Atlas turntable. It looks great. And your wheel stops are terrific, too. There is one problem, however. Pick up trucks almost always have wheels that turn in response to the driver's actions inside the vehicle. So you don't need to use the turntable for them.
--D
Oh, sorry, I meant to explain. It's the same principal as the pizza wheel layouts where the tracks turn, and the train stays in one place. ;D
J
I took a different angle photo of my layout the other day. If you're interested read on. If not, that's ok, too. :)
This gives a different perspective to give you an idea of how the trains move around.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2477.jpg)
To the right is the back wall of my garage (see the vehicle to the left). The back wall is 21' long. I have set up my layout to be easily removable. The benchwork is in 2'X8' sections and the backdrops are 2'X4' panels. I'm used to moving alot, so I made the layout easy to break down. Think a semi-permanent modular layout.
On the left is the 3 percent grade coming down off the mining area (yet to be built). Next is a long siding that can be turned off, to hold an engine and long cut of cars, waiting for the ore to be coupled. You can see the turntable, in the background, just barely. This is for turning the engines from the mine. There will also be passenger service and some sort of industry (the two structures to the front).
Next is the double track mainline (cut of hoppers).
The CSX engines are parked on a 2 percent grade that goes to an industrial yard on the wall farthest away from the viewer. That has four tracks for parking engines and cars. It sits on a 12 inch wide shelf.
Finally, the last two tracks to the right are the mainline again. The mainline is a J shaped oval. The rear portion is normally hidden from the viewer, but you can see it from this angle.
You can also see there is still alot of construction going on. There are no details, lights, nor weathering, yet.
I held the camera out over the layout just to get a different view.
For what it's worth.
Regards,
Jonathan
Jonathan, trucks can turn but you're right about the turntable. My grandfather was a gardener on one of the estates in Prides Crossing, Massachusetts, and they had a driveway to a multi-car garage that had a turntable to turn the Dusenbergs. Those homes in Prides were 100+ rooms and set near the ocean like Newport, RI. They are all gone now.
:) Either you guys are having fun with me, or I'm not explaining myself well.
The turntable wouldn't actually turn an automobile around. Turntable just shares the same space... oh, like street running.
Sometimes I no have command of american. ;)
R,
J
Believe it or not, there was another vehicle turntable in real life, and it was for the B&O at that.
This was at Jersey City, N.J., in the stub-ended station that was CNJ-owned and shared with the B&O and the Reading. Ferry boats ran to New York on the other side of the terminal. B&O, attempting to get more direct service into Manhatten and not having the capital to tunnel under the Hudson, ran a bus service (with the buses in blue and grey, like the trains) from the station platforms. Space was tight for turning a bus around, so there was a bus turntable there. Photos of it appear in "Royal Blue Line" by Herb Harwood.
Reminds me, that no matter what you imagine or create, there's probably a prototype out there if you look hard enough... or if you know someone who has done more homework than you. :D
Regards,
Jonathan
here are ones from Paris and wikipedia
http://blog.modernmechanix.com/mags/qf/c/ModernMechanix/8-1930/med_auto_turntable.jpg (http://blog.modernmechanix.com/mags/qf/c/ModernMechanix/8-1930/med_auto_turntable.jpg)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_turntable (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_turntable)
jonathon-
Thanks for another super shot of what is clearly an fine bit of work. I like your railroading!
--D
Hey Jonathon,
I have installed a couple of the Atlas turntables over the years, and the noisy operation that you speak of seems to be inherent in the Geneva movement that is used to drive them. It works well for the indexing, but the sound level is distracting.
It can be dampened quite effectively though, by using a couple of tricks.
Firstly, I found that the gear mechanism 'chatters' quite unacceptably - more so in one direction that the other, so I set about discarding the mounting screws that are used to secure the drive unit to the base. Once I relieved the pressure there, the whole thing quietened down considerably. Just let it find its own position.
It is then a matter of attaching the drive unit to the base with your favourite adhesive......carefully though!! You don't want the stuff getting into the mechanism and gumming things up!
The next trick, is simply to run the drive unit from a 6 volt power supply. Certainly, this slows the thing down a bit, but it also reduces the noise level by about half. (Turntables don't normally spin around like a merry-go-round anyway...)
One of the 6 volt wall warts (never heard them called that before) will supply enough current, as long as it is rated at 500mA or over.
Lots of luck!
Fascinating! Didn't realize automotive turntables were that common (although still very unusual).
Found this material on the B&O bus service.
http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=76&t=62554
The B&O was one unusual railroad, and yet in many ways an American classic.
Doneldon, thanks. I have fun.
Anubis,
Appreciate the tips. I like the 6V power source idea. Will start rifling through junk drawers looking for one. Will also experiment with the mounting screws.
The B&O bus service sounds intriguing. Will keep that little nugget tucked away for future reference.
Regards,
Jonathan
Interesting discussion.
Any ideas extending the turntable to swing a 15 inch loco with tender?
Quote from: Edo on May 23, 2010, 12:57:05 PM
Interesting discussion.
Any ideas extending the turntable to swing a 15 inch loco with tender?
I have been thinking along the same lines. This is my concept (so far untried)
(1) cut the outside ring off the turntable, track stubs and all.
(2) extend the bridge and its track by 3" each end.
(3)cover the whole thing with a plank apron, just like in the photos above.
(4) drop the motor down instead of up so that the bridge passes over it.
(5) support the approach tracks on 1/4" plywood or use half lengths of E-Z track. Shim track or turntable base as required.
I am looking at doing this in 0n30 and will probably use a gallows bridge. This will allow extending the bridge with all the supports above the pit, leaving things open underneath to clear the inverted motor. If you wanted something a bit more modern, I think a through plate girder bridge would work well too.
Jim
Thanks Jim
I had a feeling that there may be thoughts out there :)
Jim-
I think you would want to put the whole dohickey in a ring which is the height of the bottom of the existing turntable. That way the track extensions will be supported as the table turns.
--D
A gallows turntable is normally supported at the middle. A nice example of a model one is at this link:
http://www.bigriverlines.com/Modelmaker/Big_River_Lines_site/BRRR/BRR_Concept/Turntable/Turntable.html (http://www.bigriverlines.com/Modelmaker/Big_River_Lines_site/BRRR/BRR_Concept/Turntable/Turntable.html)
Jim
Jim and Edo,
I really like your idea. It's way past my skills. I researched some layout photos for ideas, and I found a lot of folks like the gallows bridge. It seems to require a lot of precise kit bashing and scratch building. Plus, wouldn't it be very era specific? Just asking. I don't know.
I'm just happy to cover up the wood and plastic:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2491.jpg)
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2489.jpg)
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2493.jpg)
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN2492.jpg)
Jonathan - I like what you have done to the Atlas turntable...really looks great. It is difficult to believe that the 'motor shack' is the same, gray chunk of plastic that comes with the motor assembly.
You could fill in the siding and use some Paper Creek overlays to completely change the era, and look, of the building. Unfortunately there is little room, on a micro layout, to have a turntable like yours. We can construct one out of an old CD or use the Kibri 4-position unit.
Your layout is really looking sharp.
Ray
I suspect the gallows bridge was contemporary with wooden bridges like the Howe truss etc., built at a time when wood was cheap and steel was expensive. As locomotives became longer and heavier, wooden bridges out on the line were replaced by steel to carry more weight at higher speeds and turntables were enlarged and their bridges replaced to handle the longer, heavier locomotives.
Jim