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Discussion Boards => HO => Topic started by: ta152h0 on April 13, 2008, 04:10:43 PM

Title: turn outs
Post by: ta152h0 on April 13, 2008, 04:10:43 PM
I was running a 2-10-2 on an oval ( dcc test track with turnouts 0 and it seems to catch something at the approach and subsequent travel thru the turnouts causing a magnificent major bloody rail road wreck. the carnage is immense requiring major closure if the track and reroute of the Amtrack Orient exxpress. Has anyone had trouble with the ATLAS code 100 turnots part number 861 ?  :'(
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Yampa Bob on April 13, 2008, 06:48:28 PM
With the old style turnout, yes there are problems.  For one, the flangeway open space is about .25 inch, which allows too much wheel drop and potential for derail. The points are stamped and don't recess well into the stock rails.

The udated ones only have a .13 space. The points are made from actual rail stock,  and the stock rails have deeper notches to recess the points.  There is virtually no wheel drop.

If your turnouts have exposed rivets you have the old style.  The new style uses a "rivetless" pivot, with a spring tension cup washer on the bottom. 

With the old style you can actually hear the "bam bam" as wheels hit the frog point, or the wing rail, depending on direction, and wheel flanges tend to catch on the points.  The new ones are very quiet and smooth.

Bob
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: ta152h0 on April 13, 2008, 07:59:17 PM
thank you. looks like I either have some work to do or spend money on new improved turnouts.
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Yampa Bob on April 13, 2008, 09:28:21 PM
Some hobby sources still have the old style in stock, and of course they want to get rid of them.

The updates were never publicized by Atlas, at least I didn't see any news about them.  I ordered one turnout last October for evaluation and noticed the changes from the ones pictured in their catalog.  I called service, and they confirmed that all the turnouts were being updated.

Bob
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: ta152h0 on April 16, 2008, 05:57:51 PM
it is a heart stopping experience watching the locomotive you really wanted to have, and bought, tip over on the track just inches away from falling off the table.
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Yampa Bob on April 17, 2008, 01:26:25 PM
That's why I have a 2 inch high rail around my layout. I cringe every time I see a layout with trains running along the edge.

Bob
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Redtail67 on April 18, 2008, 01:04:41 AM
ta152ho:

I have 3 of those old style Atlas switches on my grandsons layout. It took me about two weeks to figure out that the gap in the flangeway was the cause of "some" of my derailment problems. At slower speeds the bump is not bad enough to make the wheels jump over the rail and at higher speeds the wheels do not have the time to drop in and bounce out.

It seems that it will derail at a modest speeds when the bounce is more pronounced.

If I avoid the speed range that seems to have the most problems I can run for hours on end with no problem.

my 2 cents,

Redtail67
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: ta152h0 on April 18, 2008, 11:38:08 AM
i am going to turn this into an " engineering problen ' and see if i can fill the drop with some melted plastic and mitigate this " hole '. It does need to operate on all speeds ( DCC does make it realistic )  My friend here from the club told me to change it to code 83 DCC ready turnouts. 
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Yampa Bob on April 18, 2008, 04:48:12 PM
If your layout is Code 100 why would you change the turnouts to Code 83?  I was not aware of any "DCC Ready" turnouts.  All Atlas turnouts are "DCC Friendly" perhaps that's what your friend was referring to. 

The improved versions are about $12 each for remote, much less for manual.  I thought about various ways to fill the gap, but in the long run you'd be better off just replacing them, and chalk it up to experience.  You win some, you lose some. 

Bob
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: ta152h0 on April 19, 2008, 04:05:14 PM
sounds like a good solution. i will go out and buy new ones. My shoulders are very heavily laden  with " experience "  ;D
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Guilford Guy on April 19, 2008, 05:32:55 PM
Is the Cow-Catcher too low?
It ran fine for a few months, then on the club 1 day I noticed it would derail at a spot right before the tunnel at the corner every time. Upon observation, the cow-catcher was low enough, that it caught on the guard rails off the bridge, throwing the drivers off the track.
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Santa Fe buff on April 21, 2008, 07:03:43 PM
Yeah, well the switches are trouble because they have a gap for a train to go over, if your steam locomoitve has springs, then they might be shifting over the gap-
Thus derailing.
Don't buy atlas, unless you like it, I love their frieght cars on some engines, they have some metal wheel, I like it!
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Yampa Bob on April 21, 2008, 09:14:44 PM
All manufacturers have the right to upgrade their products in order to stay competitive.  The old turnouts can still be used to make ladders for a freight yard. The improved ones are well worth the replacement cost. 

Bob
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: ta152h0 on April 21, 2008, 09:42:41 PM
Yeah, I managed to buy old stock and not realising it. that is ok ,you can chalk it up to " supporting your local hobby shop " and having more stuff to build your RR yard with.  ;D
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Yampa Bob on April 23, 2008, 12:00:54 PM
TA
Don't feel too bad, I have a couple hundred dollars worth of "experience".  Model railroading is definitely a "non profit" venture, that's why they call it a hobby.  :D

Bob
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: ta152h0 on May 03, 2008, 01:43:22 PM
Replaced all the turnoputs and the beast runs better over the flangeways. Unmasked another problem, the lead coupler is too low so i snipped it off, which then unmasked a third problem, the drawbar is not flexible enough and the locomotive rocks the tender off the track. I am going to visit my hobby store and get a couple of ball socket hardware from the RC rack and fix this issue. I have seen films of tenders rocking like ducks on asphalt.
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Yampa Bob on May 03, 2008, 03:13:06 PM
Try reaming out the drawbar hole first.  Most stock tenders can benefit from extra weight, about another 1/2 oz. or so.  Make sure the drawbar is "floating" in the middle of the tender pin, and not lifting it up, by bending the drawbar. 

Bob
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: rocknblues on May 03, 2008, 03:53:46 PM
I adjusted my coupler housings(sorry dont know the real term) on the loco and front of B Unit, moved them far to the right so when the loco makes the LH turn it pulls the B Unit trucks to the turn sooner. Its been working pretty good, I have made a dozen trips through the turnout, still had a derail a couple of times, but its better than it was. I guess basically what I did was shorten the distance between loco and B unit, all other cars follow fine. - rock
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: Yampa Bob on May 04, 2008, 12:29:41 PM
Draft Gear Box......"draft"...a pull or traction of a load....the load pulled or drawn. "Gear" in the context of equipment required for a purpose, such as "Valve Gear".

Most just call it a coupler box, housing works for me. 

It's strange how a post can trigger my think "gear".  I've been working up a diagram on the vector forces on curves for various coupler lengths and placements, particularly related to long steam locomotives and underset carriages.  
Title: Re: turn outs
Post by: ta152h0 on May 04, 2008, 08:17:28 PM
Don't forget these forces can go in a  x-y-z direction which might mean a determinant solution. That is why i am going to the RC airplane side of things and get a ball-socket joint and make up some drawbars. I am convinced that will solve the bouncy tender dance. I am not good with reaming holes with almost no edge margin wiorth of material.