What is the best sound decoder/speaker combination for the Spectrum 45t switcher?
Based on the size of the 45 tonner, something from LokSound would probably be the best bet.
I tried to post the results of a search but it did not works. Search the General and HO forums for 45 ton. Someone gave an answer to this issue before.
Rich
Since you have not responded, I will assume you have not looked yet. The LokSound Micro will probably fit. Look up the diagram. Do some measuring, "before" you order the parts.
You can see where you can fit a round speaker. The speaker will pick up loose magnetic material which will affect the sound quality.
Also, look up the LokSound decoders. The Standard and Micro have 100 ohm speakers. The Select has 8 ohm, speakers.
Rich
Richg,
Thanks for your effort. I did look at the earlier postings and "lexon" mentioned a link to someone who had used a Loksound micro, but the link was not there. Are you suggesting using a Loksound rectangular speaker installed just under the shell?
Ted
Quote from: Cted1947 on March 12, 2010, 07:06:01 PM
Richg,
Thanks for your effort. I did look at the earlier postings and "lexon" mentioned a link to someone who had used a Loksound micro, but the link was not there. Are you suggesting using a Loksound rectangular speaker installed just under the shell?
Ted
Yeah, I find someone is removing some messages. No idea why. Someone else has said the same thing.
To the left is Product References. Look up the 45 ton.
You will see where you can put a round speaker in the fuel tank of this loco. The Micro comes with a 16mm x 25 mm speaker. You will have to order the proper speaker when you measure the speaker opening in the loco.
Rich
I've been interested in the 45 ton engine myself. One would think that Bachmann would have some recommendations. Gee, it's too bad they couldn't have included a couple of sentences in the manual about installing a recommended dcc sound module and speaker.
Quote from: Mike_AA9ZY on March 13, 2010, 08:44:52 AM
I've been interested in the 45 ton engine myself. One would think that Bachmann would have some recommendations. Gee, it's too bad they couldn't have included a couple of sentences in the manual about installing a recommended dcc sound module and speaker.
Bachmann expects you to have some experience with modifying locomotives. A lot of DCC/sound is not plug and play. Again, look at the diagram and you will see a location for the speaker which by definition means you can install sound.
When I bought one of the first Spectrum 4-4-0 DCC Ready, I noticed a speaker location for a one inch diameter speaker. That told me I can install sound and that Bachmann plans for future sound releases which they have done. I installed a Micro-Tsunami decoder.
If you take time to study various DCC articles in various DCC forums and links from Google searches, you will gain a lot of knowledge concerning DCC installations.
Rich
Hi Rich, that's certainly one way to do business.
I have been looking at Loksound decoders and haven't found anything that would be appropriate soundset for the 45 ton engine. The galloping goose might be close.
At the risk of sounding impertinent, may I ask what you used?
Mike
Quote from: Mike_AA9ZY on March 13, 2010, 02:04:06 PM
Hi Rich, that's certainly one way to do business.
I have been looking at Loksound decoders and haven't found anything that would be appropriate soundset for the 45 ton engine. The galloping goose might be close.
At the risk of sounding impertinent, may I ask what you used?
Mike
This use to be easy to find at Litchfield Station but Bruce has cut way back on operations and no longer supplies this decoder. I think I might have bougth the last a couple weeks ago
Bruce suggested this decoder to me for the 44 ton about a year ago.
This is from The ESU site for the LokSound Micro. They are primarily European/UK sound decoder sellers but also have many USA sounds. Not to easy to find. You need patience to look through their site. Yes, pricey.
The 45 ton like the 44 ton has two prime movers. You can hear both start but it is subtle.
The sound link is there also.
http://www.esu.eu/en/downloads/sounds/generation-3/loksound-micro-v35/us-sounds/
Just in case, the decoder is ESU #72843.
72843 CAT 44
Diesel-switcher, 44 tons weight, 2 × Caterpillar D17000 engines
Rich
Hi Rich, thanks for the info! I haven't found the decoder yet, but at least I know what to look for.
I think this little engine would be just the thing for my layout, which is a Milwaukee Road branchline. It's just too bad that Bachmann didn't offer this with sound, like my On30 engines.
Sound in diesels has been suggested here several times. But no one at Bachmann is taking the hint. ???
Not true, no one at Bachmann has but the people at BLI and Athearn have, but I'd like to see sound equipped Bachmann diesels too.
I took Rich's suggestion and went to the ESU website. You can listen to various sound samples and the 72843 is as close as one can get for a loco with two small generators. Now I have to order one and decide whether to use the speaker that comes with or use a 13mm in the speaker chamber at the bottom of the engine.
I listened to the sound file too and now I wonder where to buy this decoder.
Quote from: Mike_AA9ZY on March 15, 2010, 02:29:23 PM
I listened to the sound file too and now I wonder where to buy this decoder.
Possible sources.
http://www.traintekllc.com/
I am using the dcc installs and sales site now that Litchfield has cut back online DCC sales. Rick also has a good DCC install group.
http://www.dccinstallsandsales.com/
http://www.ulrichmodels.biz/servlet/StoreFront
http://www.tonystrains.com/
Don't forget to save the sites. Remember, if they do not seem to have it online, check each site using email. Do some homework first.
Rich
I contacted Tony at Tony's Train Exchange and apparently he can download the sound file for the micro decoder and speaker.
I ordered one this morning from Eurolokshop in New York state. They had it in stock. I got the same reply as you from Tony's Trains.
Quote from: Cted1947 on March 15, 2010, 08:17:33 PM
I ordered one this morning from Eurolokshop in New York state. They had it in stock. I got the same reply as you from Tony's Trains.
Here is a direct link. Prices look pretty good.
http://www.eurolokshop.com/
Everyone, store the link for future use and to help others.
We are a community.
Rich
My next question is how well does this little engine pull? Can I pull 6 cars with it, or 10?
I am definitely getting one, now that I know where to get the sound package.
Thanks all for your help :)
Pull is subjective and depends on how you weight your rolling stock (ie. NMRA weighted as opposed to unweighted), if your rolling stock has free rolling wheels (metal wheels) and the grade on your layout.
I agree. I was just wondering in general what anyone's experience was. I just ordered a black unlettered engine from Model Railroad Post Office. I intend to paint it and letter it for the Milwaukee Road.
I can only pull 4 cars on my club's layout with it, the cars were NMRA weighted, but I don't know the grade.
I have pulled 6 NMRA weighted cars, all with new metal wheels. These were 20+ year old cars, and I switched out the plastics wheels and NMRA couplers for new wheel sets and couplers. THe loco didn't seem to be straining.
I called someone to ask about the next meeting and I asked what the grade is and they said about 4%.
Probably not needed for this loco, but I use lead shot that is used in shotgun bird shot shells for adding weight. You can find all kinds of spots to put this stuff. If paranoid about handling lead, use disposable gloves.
I just added a lot of this to the inside cover of the oil tender shell and on the frame of the tender used with the cab forward loco I recently built.
Rich
I am looking forward to using my new engine for switching the local patrol (Milwaukee Road parlance).
Hold on a bit, fellows.
I just received the Loksound Micro 72843 and the speaker (16mm X 25mm) is too big to fit under the shell of the 45 tonner. It's too wide. This decoder needs a 100 ohm speaker, and ESU doesn't offer anything smaller at 100 ohms. I am going to try to install the speaker in the ceiling of the cab, running the wires through the cab floor. From what I can see, the decoder installation is pretty straight-forward, and I'll post my success/failure with the speaker job.
Quote from: Cted1947 on March 18, 2010, 06:16:33 PM
Hold on a bit, fellows.
I just received the Loksound Micro 72843 and the speaker (16mm X 25mm) is too big to fit under the shell of the 45 tonner. It's too wide. This decoder needs a 100 ohm speaker, and ESU doesn't offer anything smaller at 100 ohms. I am going to try to install the speaker in the ceiling of the cab, running the wires through the cab floor. From what I can see, the decoder installation is pretty straight-forward, and I'll post my success/failure with the speaker job.
Hold on a bit fellows, below is a sample of 100 ohm speakers. Don't know the size of the speaker hole in the 45 ton.
http://www.litchfieldstation.com/xcart/product.php?productid=999002797&cat=239&page=1
Rich
Richg,
Thanks for hanging in with me on this project.
The 13mm would fit, but they are 50 ohm units and are sold by ESU as a pair to be wired in series. That's how they get the 100 ohm impedance. Does anyone know if a 50 ohm resistor could be tied in series and have the 13mm work??
Quote from: Cted1947 on March 19, 2010, 05:45:18 PM
Richg,
Thanks for hanging in with me on this project.
The 13mm would fit, but they are 50 ohm units and are sold by ESU as a pair to be wired in series. That's how they get the 100 ohm impedance. Does anyone know if a 50 ohm resistor could be tied in series and have the 13mm work??
I plan to use a 50 ohm resistor in the 45 ton if I do one. Have not looked into this too much so far.
Another option, go to the SoundTraxx site and look up the specs on the Tsunami Micro and see if it is much different from the specs of the LokSound Micro decoder. If they are about the same size, then you can use a 8 ohm speaker. One site shows a 10mm and 15mm round speaker.
What is the actual diameter of the hole, i, e, maximum size speaker you could install?
Cheers
Rich
As close as I can measure, the speaker port is 13mm, stepping down to 9mm. I figured the speaker would replace the weight which fills that space now. The closeness to the ground could let the speaker pick up any Fe materials from the tracks, but I was thinking of placing a piece of sheer cloth between the speaker and the cover grill. That's another reason I am considering the cab ceiling installation.
Quote from: Cted1947 on March 19, 2010, 07:47:45 PM
As close as I can measure, the speaker port is 13mm, stepping down to 9mm. I figured the speaker would replace the weight which fills that space now. The closeness to the ground could let the speaker pick up any Fe materials from the tracks, but I was thinking of placing a piece of sheer cloth between the speaker and the cover grill. That's another reason I am considering the cab ceiling installation.
That should work. Here are some photos of a sound installation in a MDC Climax shell that is about the size of the 44 ton cab. I used a 3/4 inch speaker with a small baffle.
(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l267/richg1998/Climax%20Locomotive/Speakercrew.jpg)
(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l267/richg1998/Climax%20Locomotive/Speaker1.jpg)
(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l267/richg1998/Climax%20Locomotive/Speaker2.jpg)
(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l267/richg1998/Climax%20Locomotive/Speaker3.jpg)
(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l267/richg1998/Climax%20Locomotive/Speaker4.jpg)
I had to fine tune the sound CV's in the Tsunami Micro and it worked out quite well.
Rich
Richg,
Did you spray paint the speaker and area? Does that affect the sound?
Quote from: hotrainlover on March 20, 2010, 03:29:02 AM
Richg,
Did you spray paint the speaker and area? Does that affect the sound?
I did not spray the paint. It was applied by brush and Not to the speaker face. I painted the speaker metal frame to prevent light reflection. I used flat black paint.
I have a top side photo of the 45 ton and it is almost the size of the Climax cab so possibly a ¾ inch speaker will fit.
To make it easier to fine tune the decoder, I used a device from Micro Mark that allowed me to fine tune on the work bench. These rollers fit on the track and power is transferred up to the wheels.
By enhancing certain frequencies in the decoder, you can get a fairly good sound. It is mostly trial and error. Certainly quite a bit of error.
(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l267/richg1998/Climax%20Locomotive/IMG_0455.jpg)
Rich
Well, I got the decoder in and working with the speaker in the cab ceiling. I had to use a Dremel tool to remove some of the inside of the cab to accommodate the decoder. There's not enough room for the main board and the new decoder to lie flat as did the originals. Perhaps a Tsunami is small enough, but I don't know about sound packages. Now I plan to tweak the CV settings to get the sound where I like it. The 72843 Micro does have two generator sounds. It's neat when it starts up.
The wiring of the new decoder was very straight-forward; the diagram that came with the loco was right on the money.
Any suggestions for a good sound for the Bachman 70 ton switcher?
I've been reading this thread with great interest and I think I will leave mine w/o sound. It's a neat little engine and I will enjoy it.
FWIW, I stand by my original comments that Bachmann should offer this engine with sound.
Mike,
Can't argue with the obvious!
I doubt that will ever happen. Too small a diesel and not very popular. Bachmann is out to make a profit.
Rich
It wouldn't surprise me if Bachmann did come up with a compact sound dcc package that could be used in N, HO, and On30. It all depends upon demand of the consumer.
Except for this 45 ton engine, I'm buying engines with dcc and sound whenever possible.
IMHO, dcc without sound is like dial-up internet access.