I have two Williams GP-9's purchased sometime ago. My SP GP-9 always starts in the forward direction when power is applied. The SF GP-9 always starts in neutral when power is applied and then forward on the second power apllication. As a result-these units are always out of sync!
Dear Tom,
I am almost positive that all GP-9's were equipped with reverse boards that started in forward. Some earlier locos had some QSI boards that started in neutral. Sounds like someone swapped a board in one of those units.
There is a mod suggested by a user that allows you to start our current board design in neutral. We have posted that on our FAQ section http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,5568.0.html (http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,5568.0.html).
The other option is to replace the reverse board in the one that starts in neutral with our current board.
After you get them starting in the same direction, it is very important that you use the direction button and hold down the button for 1 second after the train comes to a complete stop. Continue to do this for every cycle to keep the units in sync.
Best Regards,
3rail
This may be true with the GP-9's as welll as the SD-45's by Williams from a few years back. The SD-45's I have are from differant years and they have differant circuit boards from the factory installed by Williams. From what I know about the SD-45's and what the Williams Service department has told me there are at least four differant circuit boards that could of been installed depending upon the year it was made.
The circuit boards all have a number on them or a letter sequence that will identify the approximate year it was made or sold, should be five to eight letters or numbers, and the size may be a little smaller than the print used here.
Lee F.
I have a Williams FP-45 loco (not by Bachman) I bought used recently. The reverse board operates Forward-Neutral-Reverse-Forward. Go figure???? ??? ???
Cheers,
GTBob
SD-45 diesels have been in our product line for many years and these had QSI boards in the early versions. GP-9's did not they should all start in forward.
Regards,
3rail
How much are the correct circuit boards for the GP-9.? My friend tried to "fix" the circuit board as suggested in your diagram and he said it was completely different than the board in my engine! Since the locomotive he has starts in forward, I guess I will have to change the board in the one that starts in neutral! How much?
Tomp.
I just went to the Williams products on the main site here and the circuit boards list for $43.95 plus shipping.
You may need to remove one of the ends, and use wire nuts or solder it, from the new circuit board leeds to make it work with your GP-9.
Just for info, the GP-9's have been around for a little while as well! I have three GP-9's, two powered and one unpowered. My newest GP-9 (it has the TB-2 sound unit)is from around 2003 and the other GP-9's (it just had a basic horn until I updated it to TB-2)are from earlier, not sure of what year.
Lee F.
Tomp.
Another option, but this is up to you! You will lose direction control and void any warrenty if one is left.
Remove the circuit board and install a 6 amp bridge rectifier from Radio Shack, you must have either a circuit board or a bridge rectifier as the motors are DC in the Williams engines. The output wire with the + (plus sign) goes to one motor wire and the output with the - (minus sign) goes to the other motor wire, the wires without any markings get the track power hooked up to them. Remember you won't have direction control if you do this!
Lee F.
Quote from: 3rail on August 21, 2010, 11:02:08 AM
SD-45 diesels have been in our product line for many years and these had QSI boards in the early versions. GP-9's did not they should all start in forward.
Regards,
3rail
While not trying to dispute the fact that some SD-45's may have the QSI circuit board, none of my SD-45's have that one.
My F-7's have the QSI circuit and sound board installed and act like it starts in reverse, the headlight forward should be the way it should take off but my F-7's seem to go in reverse from a standing start.
None of my Williams start in nuetral.
Lee F.
What can I say My FM, PA, and SF GP-9 all start in neutral!
Quote from: tomplatten on August 23, 2010, 07:24:18 PM
What can I say My FM, PA, and SF GP-9 all start in neutral!
Tom,
I don't know what to tell you except that all my Williams engines start in forward other than the F-7's I have, they start in reverse.
It is possible that you have some older Williams engines, made before 1994?
The only engine I have that starts in nuetral is an MTH 4-6-2 steam engine.
Lee F.
Random thoughts:
Did your (prototype) loco run "long hood forward" or "short hood or cab forward"?
In other words, "Which end is considered 'the front' ?"
How hard is it to flip around the Williams or WBB motor wire plugs to reverse the loco's initial direction?
(Pins could be pulled, swapped and re-inserted in the motor plug(s), or, wires cut, swapped, stripped and soldered to accomplish the polarity-direction change.)
If you wanted bypass the stock reverser board with a manual direction change plus a neutral, you could install these parts:
Radio Shack 276-1181 8A-400PIV bridge rectifier (formerly cataloged as 6A-250PIV) $2.59 :
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062583
Radio Shack 275-664 6A-125V DPDT center-off switch $4.99 :
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062517
The "center-off" adds the neutral setting.
Back of DPDT switch:
1 2
3 4
5 6
Unplug motor plug(s) from reversing board
Center roller pickup --> one of the bridge's ~ (ac) terminals
Wheel pickup (ground) --> the bridge's other ~ (ac) terminal
Bridge (+) --> DPDT switch 1 and 6
Bridge (-) --> DPDT switch 2 and 5
DPDT 3 --> one color motor wire(s)
DPDT 4 --> the other color motor wire(s)
I suppose that if you didn't want to cut the motor wires, you could buy connectors that mated with the motor plugs. Putting the loco back to the stock reverser board would be simple then. In that case the last two instruction lines would be:
DPDT 3 --> one side of the mating connector(s)
DPDT 4 --> the other side of the mating connnector(s)
Caution: Use heat shrink where needed to prevent shorts.
Use caution when soldering the back of the switch to prevent shorts between wires/posts.
Hope this helps.
Sincerely,
Joe Satnik
Hello Forum,
Newbie here and just wanted to know if anyone knew the last year or years that Williams offered the GP9 in B&M (black, white, and blue) roadname and if it was ever offered with anything other than just horn only. How difficult is it to upgrade from the horn only to TBII?
Thanks,
Bernard
Quote from: ChattChooChoo on September 23, 2010, 09:59:04 AM
Hello Forum,
Newbie here and just wanted to know if anyone knew the last year or years that Williams offered the GP9 in B&M (black, white, and blue) roadname and if it was ever offered with anything other than just horn only. How difficult is it to upgrade from the horn only to TBII?
Thanks,
Bernard
Hello and Welcome.
It's an EZ install. Remove old horn and board, then replace same w/TB2. Red wire to center roller (hot) and black wire to ground (frame). Make sure your trans has a bell button....
Good luck
GTBob
Bernard,
Williams offered the GP-9's about two years before selling to Bachmann with the True Blast 2 horn in them.
GP-9's that are from 2003 or earlier will probally have just the horn feature in it. There might be enough room to install the new T.B. 2 horn & bell unit, but I am not sure, however you must remove the old horn unit first because there is very little space inside a GP-9 shell.
Also your transformer must have a bell button in addition to a whistle or horn button.
Lee F.
Hello Lee,
Thanks for your response/info.
I remember reading somewhere that the paint on the older Williams engines was "different" (glossier) than the paint on the newer Williams and Bachmann engines. Would you know if older means 90's or early 2000's?
Thanks,
Bernard
I have no idea about the paint being glossier on differant engines, as I have just the Williams(before Bachmann) engines and no new Williams by Bachmann to compare with.
To upgrade to True Blast 2, remove the old horn unit completely from the shell or frame of the engine and install new True Blast 2 horn unit. It is best to either solder the wires or use wire nuts. Don't cut the wires off at the circuit board that controls the motors. One wire goes to the frame of the engine and the other goes to the center rail pick-up roller, in case you do a mistake.
Lee F.
I have 3 Williams GP7/9s made in the late 1900s and early 2000s.All have horns and bells.All start in forward.
Roger,
Do you know what year your GP-7/9 was made?
I have a pair of Williams GP-9's, Pennsylvania RR, and the unpowered unit has the horn inside it, no bell feature. I don't know the year as I bought these used from a friend a few years ago, who was an independant Williams dealer. Got some great deals on Williams trains from the guy.
All the Williams I have start in forward or reverse, no nuetral starting(nuetral first then forward) from any Williams that I have ever seen.
Lee F.
Lee,
Not sure when they were made but all start-up in forward and will re-start in forward if the power is off for at least 10 seconds.
They are all pre-Bachmann.
Mine were also bought from independent dealers.Those days are gone.