i have a Williams 2-6-4 pink girls train set. it looks awesome & runs great but i have a couple issues with the engine. first off is the flywheel action. you would think with the big flywheel on the motor, it would have some flywheel action, but it doesn't. when the power is cut off, the engine stops. it's bad enough that it will derail cars.
the second issue is the smoke unit. i mean why even bother putting those smoke units in them? they don't produce any smoke. I've got an old tyco that will out smoke it. is there any upgrade smoke unit that will work?
i use an old Lionel zw275 R transformer. it runs great with this transformer, but it starts pulling just as soon as it gets power. the transformer doesn't start out at a low enough voltage & the engine will take off. the same about stopping it. the voltage is to high for it to make a nice stop. it acts like it slamming on the breaks because of the lack of flywheel action. is there anything i could do about this like maybe adding a resister on the motor to take some of the power?
it might sound like I'm not happy with it, but believe me i love this little engine. it just has a couple issues.
Have you tried using a differant transformer, like the Z-1000 by MTH or the 80 watt transformer that Bachmann lists on the Williams website?
This way you won't lose your warrenty by messing with the electrical system inside your engine.
The old 275 watt ZW was designed for use with post war trains and has a very high starting voltage. Newer transformers have a lower starting voltage, also stay away from Lionel's CW-80(aka can't work 80) when using Williams trains, some work with the CW-80 and most don't work with the CW-80.
Lee F.
i tried running it with a mth z750 & it seemed to slow down the longer it ran. not sure why, but with the lionel zw it trucks right along.
http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,14649.0.html
hey Joe, I'm not sure what you was trying to show me? do you care to elaborate? with this being a steam engine with one motor, I'm not sure what the connection would be to the link you posted.
Quote from: the nitro man on December 28, 2010, 12:40:44 PM
i tried running it with a mth z750 & it seemed to slow down the longer it ran. not sure why, but with the lionel zw it trucks right along.
Try using the Z-1000, it is a 100 watt transformer. The Z-750 may not be strong enough for long runnning.
Lee F.
Dear Nitro,
Sorry 'bout that. I read too fast and thought pink "GG1" instead of pink "steam".
If you want a slower, more controllable loco and don't mind dimmer lights, put back to back 6 Amp diode pairs between the transformer and the lock-on. (Advantage....no mods to loco.)
If you want a slower, more controllable loco but brighter lights, put back to back 6 amp diode pairs between the reverser board and the motor.
http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,13633.0.html
Hope this helps.
Sincerely,
Joe Satnik
Joe, i'm going to be honest. i seen where you showed how to wire the diodes inside the engine, but i have no idea of what that meant. i can wire & solder, & i'm very comfortable doing it. it just i'm not able to figure out what i'm looking at in a diagram. how many diodes are needed all together? do you know a part number i could get at radio shack? i would rather put it in the engine so i can run it on any line without having to move the diodes around.
thanks for your help & patients.
Dear Nitro,
Here is a radio shack 4-pack 6 Amp diode:
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062591
Digi-Key or other electronic warehouses have them much cheaper, but you pay for S&H.
2 diodes connect to make one pair:
Connect the stripe end of the first to the non-stripe end of the second.
Connect the non-stripe end of the first to the stripe end of the second.
Kinda looks like this on a schematic, the vertical line at the tip of the arrow represents the diode's stripe. C1=connection point 1, etc.
c1-------->l-----------c2
l l
l l or, simplified: c1----Pair----c2 or, simplified even further: ---P---
l l
----l<-----
Diodes drop about 0.6 Volts each in forward bias. That's the effect we are looking for. The turned around diode allows the loco to travel in reverse.
Cut one of the motor leads (actually, either one will do) and add pairs between:
Reverser Board + motor output --------------------------------P----P----etc.---------------------------l
(+)
motor
(-)
Reverser Board - motor output--------------------------------------------------------------------------l
You get 2 pair from a package of 4, which gives about 1.2 Volts drop. 2 packages = 2.4 Volts, etc.
Important !
Take care to electrically insulate the diode leads to avoid touching anything metal inside the loco.
Heat shrink tubing works well for that.
Don't mount the diode pairs too close to a plastic shell, as they can get warm.
Hope this helps.
Sincerely,
Joe Satnik
Joe, is there a bigger diode that could be used so it wouldn't take as many?
i was looking at these.
http://cgi.ebay.com/10-x-R-6-1000V-10A-Axial-Rectifier-Diode-R6-1KV-/190484105834?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c59bcca6a
Again,
"Diodes drop about 0.6 Volts each in forward bias. That's the effect we are looking for."
If you reduce the number of diodes stacked in series, you reduce the voltage dropping effect.
I chose 6 amp diodes because that matches the rated output of the reverser board.
I suppose you could use smaller diodes, but you'd have to avoid heavy loads, high speeds and gradients..
Hope this helps.
Sincerely,
Joe Satnik
so the diodes i posted a link to are smaller than the ones you showed in the posted link? that shows what i know. lol
how can you tell what voltage drop a given diode will give? i really need to learn this stuff.
The diodes in the link you showed are bigger.
Sorry for the confusion.
I thought since you wanted to reduce the number of diodes, you might settle for a reduction in space (same number but smaller diodes).
Hope this helps.
Sincerely,
Joe Satnik
would the ones in the link be safe to use & would they reduce more power than the ones you suggested, or should i just use what you showed me? also, would this setup work on a/c motors as well?
Joe, thanks you very much for helping me.
i put in four pairs of the diodes that you suggested. it starts & stops great now with my zw transformer.
i also ran the smoke unit from the center rail hot wire & a frame ground & it smokes like crazy. if i hadn't redused the voltage to the motor with the diodes it wouldn't have helped much if any.
thanks Joe for your help.
Dear Nitro,
Hey, you're welcome.
Fantastic.
Have you tested it in reverse? (This will tell you if you have a bad solder joint in any of the diode pairs.)
To answer previous questions, (sorry about the delay),
Yes, the 10 Amp diodes would be safe, but you would still need the same number of them as the 6 Amp diodes for the same voltage drop effect.
The downside is that you would need more room for the larger diodes.
This setup should work with Lionel postwar universal (will run on AC or DC, hence "universal") motors as well, however,
I don't know what the stall current is for the old motors, which are much less efficient.
You would want diodes with at least as much forward current as the motor's stall current.
Since the universal motors are less efficient, you will not need as many diode pairs in series.
There is a possibility that the diodes on a universal motor might increase radio frequency interference (RFI),
and small capacitors might have to be added somewhere if your radio is noisy or your TV starts acting up while you are running your trains.
Hope this helps.
Sincerely,
Joe Satnik
Dear Nitro,
How warm are the diodes getting?
Run the loco with a bunch of cars behind for a few minutes and see how warm the diodes get.
Thanks.
Sincerely,
Joe Satnik
i ran it last night with 10 cars behind it for about 5-10 minutes & they just got warm. reverse works fine.
Dear Nitro,
I kind of expected a little warm. Good.
Is your top speed under load still fast enough?
Joe
yes, top speed it still very good. it will still run off the tracks if i opened it all the way up. now pulling ten cars, i can turn it up to 12 on the zw & it's flying. it runs good on 8-9.
the diodes do get a little warm, but not hot. i had to put two pair on each of the wires. four pairs was to long to fit anywhere without smooshing wires.
i did put the smoke unit back the way it was, because it spit a little bit of smoke fluid out & i just don't like that oil getting on the purty pink paint. i would rather it not smoke than to make a mess. I've heard this is normal for this kind of smoke unit.