My first foray into DCC, and it's not going well. Hoping and praying somebody can help.
I've got a new Bachmann EZ Command, running a new DZ125 on a Graham Farish (the UK Bachmann) Diesel loco. I've connected it all up, assigned to address 1 and it works, but the speed steps are terrible. Smooth while in a certain speed step, but big jumps in between.
Digitrax and Bachmann both advertise that the devices are good for 128, but my feeling is that it's 28 at best. How do I get smooth acceleration from this set up?
I'm pretty sure the EZ command will only do 28 speed steps. The problem is, you can't program anything but the address with the EZ command. If you have a friend with a better DCC system, you could program the decoder and set the accel (CV03) and decel (CV04) rate on the decoder to help smooth it out.
Hope that's not the case. Amazon states 28/128 speed step control for it, and actually the outside of the bachmann box says the same thing - "28/128 Speed Step Control". My decoder also says "128 Speed Step operation (14 or 28 steps can also be used)".
Bachmann E-Z Command Control Center has only 28 speed step control.
It can only program a limited number of addresses and the direction of travel.
If that's true, then it has to be the most blatant piece of false packaging I've ever seen, unless I'm totally missing something here.
The box says "28/128 Speed Step Control" no less than three times.
The manual states, in the very first paragraph: "Other features include 28/128 speed steps for smooth operation and plug-in wiring for simple set up".
Surely that would be rather blatant if it was a complete lie. But then, my loco is clearly only running at 28 speeds steps, so what gives????
I took photo's of the box and manual but this forum does not seem to be allowing me to upload. So I put them here:
www.tcpack746.com/images/P10003302.jpg
www.tcpack746.com/images/P1000331.JPG
That means it will control a loco set for 128 step speed control but that doesn't mean it is 128 step itself. If the decoder sees 28 step throttle, it will default to that.
From the instructions listed online, it only states 28 step.
Features include:
digital command control of multiple locomotives in N, HO and On30 Scale
plug and play compatibility with all DC and DCC systems
digitally controlled speed, direction, lighting, and sound
one-button address and direction on-track programming
ability to control up to 10 digitally equipped trains
convenient space to write down the identification of the locomotive
28 speed step control
1 amp AC wall pack power supply
simple plug-in wiring
DVD and printed instructions
built-in control for existing non decoder equipped locomotives
http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/ezcommand_2010.php?ezpage=1
We use one at the shop for demoing loco's and I'm not very fond of it's slow speed ability. The speed steps jump pretty quick.
Well, I called Bachmann tech support, and Rodney was pretty helpful. He says that to get 128 speed steps from the EZ Command you need to have the decoder programmed to that. Of course, the EZ can't do that, but the local store tells me they'll do it for $15 per loco. That sounds like pure profit to me, but hey - it's cheaper than returning it (for now) :(
All feels a bit suspicious to me to be honest. The DZ125 paperwork suggests it defaults to 128 anyway, so it seems a bit odd that it needs to be programmed as such. Why would the decorder be delivered as 28 steps and need to be reprogramed to it's listed spec...
I wanted to try DCC on my layout but don't have much budget. Spending $15 to at least correct the problem won't break that bank though. Here we go.
Notwithstanding what you understood Rodney was telling you... you will only get 28 speed step commands from the Bachmann E-Z Command Control Center.
If capable, a DCC command station can be programmed to send 14, 28 or 128 speed step commands to a decoder address.
Most decoders made today have two speed step modes programmable by CV 29. The two speed step modes are
1) 14 speed step
2) 28/128 speed step (either 28 or 128 speed step)
You can not program a decoder to use just 28 or use just 128 speed step.
When decoder is programmed to operate in the 14 speed step mode, the command station must send 14 speed step commands. If command station sends 28 or 128 speed step commands, the decoder will not work properly.
When decoder is programmed to operate in the 28/128 speed step mode, the command station can send either 28 or 128 speed step (but not both) commands to the decoder and the decoder will automatically use the speed step being sent. If command station sends 14 speed-step commands, the decoder will not work properly. Not all decoders are designed to operate in 128 speed step. Some Bachmann decoders will not use 128 speed step if set to it.
Thus depending on CV 29 a decoder can use 14, 28 or 128 speed step from the command station. Bachmann E-Z Command Control Center can not be programmed to change speed step commands it sends to a decoder address.
Reality -- While using Bachmann's E-Z Command Control Center, there is nothing you can do to use 128 speed steps in operating any of your decoder equipped locomotives.
Want to use 128 speed steps -- acquire another DCC system.
Cessna101
There is a long learning curve to model railroading.
Before I bought my first DCC system and first engines I spent close to six months researching the systems. Then about an other year planing the layout.
What you need to do for every N scale thing you now buy is ask questions on the forums, in books and read what others have experienced with the items.
Don't be in a rush and don't buy the least expensive item unless you know it will work as you want it to. I waited a long time and saved up money to get what I needed.
Not to say that there are not inexpensive stuff that is good, as there are many.
Be it engines, rolling stock, or control system items.
Good luck and have fun.
Ken / Hunt,
It's true - I went cheap thinking that all I need is train control and nothing else. The next solution is getting on for double the price, but I'm seeing that the benefits are maybe there.
So I'm going to return the EZ. I might try DCC again next winter, but for now I'll stick to DC. My layout is pretty mature, 1980's British Rail, with two intersecting loops, combination of Atlas track and Peco points (which short out the DCC on the frog, but I understand why and the fix). All the loco's are UK outline Graham Farish (although I live in the US).
I did want to control more than one loco at the same time, so I dipped my toe in the water with the Bachmann. I think Bachmanns statement "28/128 speed steps for smooth operation" is a bit misleading considering it's being aimed new users of DCC, but hey. When I try DCC next time round it won't be a Bachmann for that reason.
Thanks all for your help and advice.
/Andy
Hi Andy!
When I was planning to switch from DC to DCC and told people with digital knowledge about my plan to buy a Bachmann EZ Cont. everybody shaked his head and provided me with a bunch of informations why I would shortly be in need of more programming capabilities than just the adress and less than a few more CV.
I decided to stay away from EZ and bought a better system..................and I'm still happs with this decision.
So if you can give it back and fetch some dollars more you will be happier with a Zephyr or something like that or the bigger Bachmann device.
Thats the point when DCCing is real fun. I ca claim this for sure after more than 40 years on DC.
Regards
Mathi
Quote from: Hunt on March 16, 2011, 10:30:29 PM
Bachmann E-Z Command Control Center has only 28 speed step control.
It can only program a limited number of addresses and the direction of travel.
Actually not quite so simple.
True the E-Z command uses the 28 speed step commands but actually it has 56 speed steps.
It was learned early on in DCC that command stations could effectively double the number of speed steps by dithering between two speed steps. Not all decoders support this (I do not believe the DZ supports this) but for those that do it is hard to tell the difference between using 28 speed steps and 128 speed steps.
For an entry level system, I believe the E-Z Comand provides great value.
Stan Ames
Stan,
There have been opportunities to tell me about this over the years. Nevertheless, I have not read or heard anything about dithering and 56 speed steps by the E-Z Command Control Center. I was not made aware of it seven years ago, or at any time since, when I questioned Bachmann's continued promotion of the E-Z Command Control Center as having "28/128 speed step control" feature.
Besides, dithering between two speed steps is irrelevant to the main points in my replies in this thread.
We do in a sense concur the Bachmann E-Z command Control Center is a great value; but, I see it only for the people who up front know what they are getting for their money.
Cessna101
I have no idea whether the E-Z Command is limited to 28 step or can do 56 steps. However, to answer your question on how to get smooth acceleration, set CV03 (acceleration rate) for whatever acceleration rate looks good to you. Then, when you start your train, simply set the speed dial to the speed you want and then let the decoder handle the acceleration. Even if it receives a 28 step command telling it to go to a certain speed, it will get there using its own 128 speed step mode.
You will not be able to program CV03 with your E-Z Command, but there is a good chance you can find someone in your area who will do it for you - local hobby shop, train club or other DCC user. Once set, this CV can be left set.
Jim
???OK everyone. I have read the discussion on the ability or inability of the Bachmann EZ Command's speed control. BUT does this all apply to the Dachmann EZ Command Dynamis Wireless DCC Controller also? Please inform me. Thanks.
The Bachmann E-Z Command Control Center sends 28 speed step commands to the decoder for it to use. You can not change the E-Z Command Control Center to send another speed step command.
The E-Z Command Dynamis can be programmed to send 14, 28 or 128 speed step commands to a decoder.
Click Here (http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/ez_content/dynamis_manual.pdf) for PDF of the Dynamis User Guide. Read 4. Changing locomotive decoder speed steps on page 12
Now reread my reply Click Here (http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,16582.msg133757.html#msg133757)
Dynamis can program CVs using their number, The E-Z Command Control Center is limited to programming indirectly just CVs that control some decoder addresses and direction of travel. Also with the E-Z Command Control Center you are limited to using a few decoder addresses. There are more differences between the capabilities of the two Bachmann DCC systems.
For me, this has been a very interesting thread. I did some tests tonight on the subject of the E-Z Command working with a Digitrax DZ123 decoder (similar to the DZ125 except no BEMF control.) The tests gave some surprising results. You may like to read about them on the General Discussion Board at this link:
http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,16698.msg134599.html#msg134599 (http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,16698.msg134599.html#msg134599)
Jim