i was wondering if anyone could recommend a starter set in ho scale for a beginner? i may be interested in one that i could add more track to and maybe pull more cars.by looking at specs.how do you know how many cars can be pulled within reason? or is the amount of cars in set all that can be pulled? my area for a train set is 4x8 ft. any help or suggestions are greatly appreciated thank-you.
just about any set bachmann makes that has standard sized locomotives and cars should fit the bill. they all use cars and track that are standardized. additional track can be purchased by the piece, and cars and locomotives pretty much meet a universal standard so that you can use most brands together.
some eceptions to this rule, in HO scale, are the early era trains like the john bull, and the thomas & friends line. they use non-standard couplings between cars. they will, however, run on standard track.
as for pulling power, that would depend on whether or not you have hills in your track plan. hills drastically cut pulling power of your locomotives, but i personally think they're worth the trouble. just make sure you keep them as gentle as possible, no more than 1/4" rise per section of track.
Bachmann EZ commander system. Hands down. The ease of running more than one engine is great. You can pull a lot more than what is inlcuded in the starter set be it no hills involved. I'll have to look at my vids on youtube or FB and see I think I got a 27 car pull with one engine and 4 engine consist stacked up. That is one powered engine, 3 dummy engines(with no motor) and 27 cars behind the powered engine, and it ran great!
I've seen some awesome 4x8 layouts though, but I just wanted a bigger layout. 1st and most important..do so2me heavy research...you will thank yourself later for it! Trust me. =)
I really don't know what kind of trains you will be running, but if you are going to add turnouts and such really do your homework this will play a very important role in which cars you use and how well they travel over the switches to avoid derailments. I won't go into too much detail here and bore everyone who already knows this stuff but if you want shoot me a message and I will make you a list to look out for and what to avoid if you are wanting to expand out from the basic set.
Ah, good ole inclines...gotta love em, but they can be murder if you dont' do your homework as well. If you want you can look in the Show Us your Layout thread and see where I started and where I am now and how it occured in a very short amount of time.
But seriously shoot me a message if you want, I want you to get the mostof your money and don't waste on 'certain' things in the beginning like I did. =)
Best,
Bal
How much is your budget?
I would highly recommend the Bachmann Digital Commander set. It comes with two locomotives in the set and gets you started in DCC right away and in my opinion will give you the best value for your money. This set is available for well under $200 at certain "Spots" on the web. This set will give you a nice empire in the space you mention and easy to expand when ready. But right from the start you can run two locomotives at the same time without complicated wiring and that is one of the greatest things about DCC. Just plug and play.
Athearn was mentioned and I agree they make some very fine kit, especially the Genesis line. I just would not personally choose their sets as a starter if the plan is to expand. You can always add their fine locos and cars as your time, space, and budget permit.
Might be because this is the BACHMANN (not Athearn) forum....... ::)
I get that YARDMASTER, but 2 things:
I sang the praises of Bachmann EZ nickel silver track being supplied in Athearn starter sets.
I see posts here all the time that direct people to buy some other product over Bachmann's. For example, buying Kadee knuckle couplers over Bachmann's version.
So what gives?
YM-
And why delete my post asking why my initial post of 6:13 AM on 2/9/13 disappeared?
I'd also like to add I did nothing in my original post that degraded Bachmann, just simply said my choice would be to buy an Athearn "starter set" over a Bachmann "starter set".
-jb
Okay. Let's say you go to work for a Chevrolet car dealership. As the customers come in the door you decide that a Ford Taurus would be a better car for someone than that Chevy Cruz that is sitting there and you proceed to tell customers that they should go buy the Ford ...... What do you think the dealership owner should do about this? We do indeed tolerate a certain amount of discussion of other manufcturer's products but suggesting that someone buy another manufacturer's starter set instead of the Bachmann starter set on the BACHMANN forum is unacceptable to the owner of this dealership. We are sorry if you feel slighted over this but this is a private (not public) forum that is maintained and subsidized by Bachmann and as such we reserve the right to monitor and edit it as we deem necessary.
Fair enough.
Don't feel sorry YM, I don't feel slighted. I was just curious about the reason for taking out my posts. Thanks to your explanation, I have now reached a level of understanding.
I would like to add, that I don't agree this approach is taken with a level of consistency. But, as you so well stated, these decisions are at the will of the Bachmann Overlords.
I would suspect I am not alone in coming to this sight for information, information about any train products or issues, not just about Bachmann. I don't come here to Toad Up to any one, or any one manufacturer-just looking for the best, honest information I can find. There is also opportunity here to express view points and sometimes I feel it is relevant to my ability to do so, so I do. Whether that includes praising Bachmann or not is a case by case basis.
Hi Raz,
I also recommend the Bachmann Digital Commander set.
It will allow you to dip your toe in the water with out a huge expense and give you a feeling of how much fun this hobby can be.
and if you decide it's not for you if you list the items individually on Ebay you will likely get your investment back . (I have experienced this on ebay)
As to the discussion over who's sets you should buy, you have to look at apples with apple and oranges with oranges, if you do this with price in mind you will see that for the most part you get what you PAY for, in my experience I have found that sets from different makers at around the same price contain items of around the same quality.
And remember some people are Ford people some people are Chevy people and some don't care as long as it gets them from point A to point B
In answer to the question in the OP, I think that on a 4x8 layout you would be limited by space long before you are limited by the ability of anybody's locomotive to pull a long train.
If you try to load up a 4x8 layout with a huge train, you will encounter derailments caused by stringlining before you exceed all but the smallest locomotive's ability to pull it.
This is not a result of which manufacturer built the loco and cars. All have to follow the same laws of physics.
Les
i would like to thank everyone for all their help and suggestions, i believe i am going to go with the digital commander set. this is something new and there is a lot to learn,i cant wait to get it i just may have to increase my budget(layout).
Good for you.
Enjoy !
-jb
hehe...the bug has already got him, I feel safe to say! =)
Google it forsale, I buy a lot from"Tthe Favorite spot". they are dependable and will accept returns for replacement.
http://www.thefavoritespot.com/p-556-bachmann-ho-scale-train-set-digital-commander-00501.aspx
NM-Jeff
I purchased a card of Bachmann center shank, knuckle couplers from there (of all ironies ;)).
I have to agree with NM...I buy tons of stuff from the Favoritespot..he's about the best price around when it comes to Bachmann. The owner is superb and is great to work with!
B
I 2nd (or 3rd) the endorsement for The Favorite Spot. I have bought probably 90% of my Bachmann roster from them. I have over 100 items in the roster and probably 30+ transactions with the Spot. Only once did I have a need for a return and they promptly exchanged the item for me even though they have no responsibility to do so. (Defective merchandise is supposed to be returned through Bachmann, regardless of where you buy it new) They are a class outfit in my opinion and experience.
Also a Favorite spot buyer. so put me on that endorsement also. i had 2 alaskan passenger cars that got smashed during shipment . he gave me a 50 % discount on those cars. great shipping cost when you combine. now im waiting on my silverton durango dcc 2-8-0 and some log cars for another loco and a spare RF loco. i may have bidded agaisnt some of you for those Bachmann products Dave
That we have bid against each other, would not surprise me at all Dave! ;)
I've always had good luck with Favorite Spot also.
I bought my DCC Digital Commander Set from Hobby Lobby . It was a great sale they wanted $199.00 for the set . I noticed one of the wheel sets off the caboose , I thought it was broke and I was disappointed . I wanted the set pretty bad . It was around Christmas time 2008 I think it was . My wife being the retail guru said to me don't say a word . she took the set up to the check out lane and asked if we could get a discount due to the wheels being off the caboose . So she got a manager to come up and looked at it . My wife did her magic and the manager said 65% off and we bought it $80.00 . I was still a little disappointed but to no avail when I open it up when we got the set home . There was a little sticker that said " wheel sets may come off during shipping " I put the wheel set back on and there was nothing wrong with this set . I love the Digital Commander its been great for me . I have grown to over 120 feet of EZ track and turnouts , 20 Bachman diesel locomotives 50 different pcs of rolling stock from a 4x8ft to a 5x9ft layout only due to space . But it works for me . And by the way my wife is a Manager at Target go figure .
I would highly recommend this set to anybody . The thing is you can run multiple trains on a medium sized layout on a small budget . One thing if you by the expander set with track and turnouts you need to get a separate accessory controller to control and operate you switches for your turnouts . You can pick one up pretty cheap . Have Fun
5117-
You are going great guns! Do you realize that you actually have about two scale miles of track? I'll bet your layout doesn't sound so small described that way. And, like all of the rest of us, you have way, way too much stuff on the rails. Just think about it. You have a locomotive every .1 mile and a piece of rolling stock about every 200 feet.
-- D
This is for Raz and the rest of you. I ran across this the other day while looking around for some SD40-2 IC's... this is one of the better 4x8's I've seen in action. It has a lot of stuff set out really nice and it looks great considering the 4x8 can be folded up for storage. So see, Raz, even with a 4x8 you can make one truly great looking model railroad and scenes!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BSENSNtW-8&feature=share&list=UUMQIFpJC5HfNB_x-U8RGeSw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BSENSNtW-8&feature=share&list=UUMQIFpJC5HfNB_x-U8RGeSw)
Best,
Bal
Thanks Bal! That is nice. And it shows a crossover in use (see other hot topic: "track").
Doneldon
I have a 5x9ft with and outter loop a semi dog bone , a yard, and a pulp wood yard on a 3 degree incline . I use 2 70 tonners to work those cars and an upper loop on the other end of the layout that runs an FTA FTB FTA unit with a 5 string passenger line . and usually a SD45-2 consist on the outter loop . I have to be careful as sometimes the SD's like to derail depending on how I run them . usually slow and easy . and some Jeeps on the inner dog bone . I got an MKT plymoth I converted to DCC had to put a N scale in her with a beacon light I really like to run . that was a challenge burned up a motor or 2 and a couple of TCS Decoders before I got it right. always alot going on . But like I said it works for me . when I get bored with them I go outside and run my large scale . But hey thanks for the info I never really thought of it that way . Some day I would really like to sit down and actually do some real modeling .
Quote from: mf5117 on February 13, 2013, 10:16:21 PM
Some day I would really like to sit down and actually do some real modeling .
5117-
You're running trains indoors and out. You have formed consists. You're using a variety of locomotives and rolling stock. Your trains have reasons to exist, like carrying the pulp and hauling passengers. You even have the occasional train wreck. Hey! Don't look now but you
are doing "some real modeling." It's not necessary that you have a huge coherent setup finished with museum-quality scenery and scratch-built models.
Keep track of where those SDs derail and what they are coupled to when they do. Pretty soon a pattern will reveal itself and you'll know the source of the problem. Nobody likes to clean up train wrecks, including the big boys (
especially the big boys) so diagnosing the problem and fixing it need to be a high priority. If you let it go you might find one of those locos doing a double back flip with a half gainer onto the concrete floor of death. That tends to be very hard on the nice paint job.
-- D
balrog21 I'm waiting for my dig commander set it should be here any day now. i checked out y.t. very cool also many others. i have also been reading all the questions and post on this site i am learning a lot and still have much to learn.i was wondering if you or anyone else could give me some advice on spending my money wisely! i know i didn't even get the set yet,but i am looking(planing) ahead. i was thinking about inclines, maybe two levels? if that is possible,any insight would be greatly appreciated. thanks for all the help raz
raz-
Buying model trains is like buying anything: Have a plan in mind, know what things sell for and make planful purchases. Be aware of special opportunities which show up but don't buy stuff on special if it doesn't fit with your plans. Attractive online prices or the heat of an eBay auction can get us excited so we purchase things we really don't need and that tends to be pretty much wasted money. The resale value is way low, even for new in the box items.
I suggest that you have some concepts in mind as you plan and shop. What time in history do you want to model? What kinds of equipment do you prefer, long, streamlined passenger trains, unit trains, quirky older freight cars, steam engines, diesel locomotives, electrics? What kind of railroading do you hope to do? Freight only? Big time Class A railroads? Narrow gauge? Through trains running continuously? Peddler freights which need lots of switching? A major industrial plant with internal switching and shunting? How much room do you have and will large locomotives and rolling stock (80' passenger cars and long flats or container cars) handle tight curves if your space is limited? Do you want to go with maximum detail and authenticity or is good enough good enough? Here's a biggie: What's your budget? How much time do you have? Track with attached roadbed goes down pretty fast but at a higher cost than, say, flex track on cork. Or do you want to hand lay your track (eats up beaucoup time)? Will this be a truly permanent layout or do you expect to move in the foreseeable future? Would building modules to combine with other modelers' modules meet your interests or do you want a road of your own?
Spend a little time with questions like these. Write down your answers as you discover them. (I doubt if you can answer every one right now.) Look at how various parts of your interests enhance one another but other aspects seem to conflict. Serious mountain railroading in limited space can challenge long equipment. The same serious mountain railroading may double the fun of a struggling narrow gauge pike with funky equipment held together by chewing gum and scotch tape. You'll soon find that you have the answers to your questions, answers which will be better than any we can give you here because they will be your answers.
Good luck with your planning and future buying. Keep us up to date on your decisions and the progress on your railroad. Oh, and welcome
to the hobby. I can promise you that you'll learn lots of new skills, find an opportunity to satisfy some of the creative instincts we all seem
to have, and meet some great people.
-- D
I can also plug thefavoritespot, but I have all On30 from him. I ditched HO scale as my eyesite isnt as good as it once was and I like narrow gauge trains. On30 will run on HO scale track, highly recommend you check out Bachmann's sets. They match the xmas village buildings very nicely scale wise if your into that kind of stuff. Or you can go the whole backwoods logging or mining theme. Good luck on whatever you decide to purchase. Mike
Quote from: TimR on February 11, 2013, 05:26:12 PM
(Defective merchandise is supposed to be returned through Bachmann, regardless of where you buy it new)
Quote from: mf5117 on February 12, 2013, 12:30:07 PM
asked if we could get a discount due to the wheels being off the caboose..... .. My wife did her magic and the manager said 65% off and we bought it $80.00 . I was still a little disappointed but to no avail there was a little sticker that said " wheel sets may come off during shipping " .......my wife is a Manager .
Glad you caught a deal 5517, but I hope that does not keep the hobby store manager from ordering more. That is one of the reasons companies like Bachmann prefer you going to them for warranty repair. It helps keep some of the bigger suppliers out of the return loop, profitable, and ordering more product for US to see and buy on a shelf rather than an order and a wait.
We bought alot of supplies from Hobby Lobby , scenery , track , my MKT Plymoth , my accessory controller , Some of my HO and G scale buildings alot of my Bachmann rolling stock . They always had a good selection of sets N HO O gauge and some G scale . Always good sales either on rolling stock or the scenery or the sets . It was really sad when they removed the train section . and just had the sets . Not only the trains but the Estes rockets , Revell models the science section to almost nothing . I don't think it was due to lack of interest but a Walmart across the Highway
I don't look at this as a warranty issue .The fact was we got a nice discount on a great product . And if the note about the wheels sets coming off the trucks has been an issue in shipment to the stores. And has been a problem with these sets then the buyer should have known that and the lack of communication to the managers is their fault then I wouldn't have got the discount . It was a matter of the wheel sets off the trucks . If the controller was defective or one of the 2 locomotives , then I see your point . And there was no lack of Bachmann products in that store .
Hobby Lobby is where i got my frist dcc set got it on sale for around $200 then bought the overland steam engine set then found out i needed to change it to a dcc unit to run right. i did not like the the cars with plastic wheels and was not impressed there. but the outcome to come back to the hobby was the best thing for me to quit working all the time i need to relax and just play.
Dave
Dave brings up a very good point about the wheelsets on most all cars that come in sets (and sometimes otherwise). One of the first upgrades I would recommend is upgrading to metal wheels. Bachmann carries two sizes for HO, part numbers 42903 and 42904 that will fit many if not all of the Bachmann cars. Metal wheels will help keep your trains running smoothly as the plastic wheels can contribute to dirty track sooner than metal. (In my opinion)
No, you are right Tim, plastic wheels get the track dirtier, faster. I have them and can attest to it.
Dave, I would luv to quit working and play all day. How does one get to do that before age 70 these days??
IM in my mid fifties and not married yes i have to make time to play. i have 4 rental homes a full time job 2 old tractors 2 horses 5 cats and over a acre of land with old barn and one child still living with me. i make a evening with my grandson i try once a week to just be young again with him. he loves my hot wheels track , my erthyl tractors which i have a large selection of and of course my trians my oldest hobby and my newest one. i think i never grew up. i do whish i had more time to clean out the hay loft of all my junk and remoldel it for my train layout thats like others on here someday yes. for now i just keep my upstairs full of track on the old oak flooring.
i have changed out wheelsets on many boxcars even cleaned out the trucks with a cleanning tool that reams them for my old tycos /bachmanns. the most type of cars i own now are Bachmann silver series cost is right and they look good and the run good. i found that there passanger cars one of the best stay on track easy to pull tighter corners and even go through switches nice. thanks to that favoritespot place glad a bought alot of F7s before and now they dont have much of them. now they come out with F7s with sound hope the same road names i allready have so i can just add a b unit with sound and use the old ones for just parts or ready to change shells if needed. i worked most of my life a full time hotel engineering job and started 25 years ago and to this day remodeling homes to lease out just a few more years and they will be payed off. when that happens i do retire my full time job and have even more knowledge of trains and might even start a repair shop for them.
Dave
I just saw the incline questions Raz...woodland scenics makes some awesome almost easy as eating cake, BUT there are some things to take into consideration before purchasing them....first I don't know how tall you want the final incline to be...woodland scenics makes two different types for a 4inch incline...one is 8 feet and one is 16...also depending on the amount of cars you're pulling as well...and remember what goes up must come down so if you choose the 8 you need 8 leading up and then 8 coming down...
this is just me personally after watching and observing my own layout...I prefere the 16 feet ones...it's not a strain on the engine unless you run the train at a very low and moderate speed....and coming down on a 8 feet incline the engine does gain momentum. so be wary of that...on my new layout I'm going to be doing a 16 lead in into a 4 inch rise and coming down on a 8 feet incline. But then again that's just me and I like to run long trains...if you remember watching my vids on youtube you can see the momentum the train gets coming down the slope. I need 4 inches as I'm doing an over under type thing on my layout...I haven't seen it done before so I'm treading into new water very soon!
But you my not want your inclines that tall at all. Just remember what you use to go up you must use to come down or problems will occur. Hope this helps!
Bal
Rz I am using the Ez-Track on a 4 x 8 table.I currently have 2 ovals with two crossovers and getting ready to add some turnoffs. you can view my layout on youtube if your interested...
http://youtu.be/VuXigR_QGVk
regarding the use of grades and inclines, it is not absolutely necessary to use the same gradient on either side of a hill. my own layout has a 4% up one side, and a 3% down the other.
two rules of thumb: since the steepness of the incline drastically affects the pulling power of your locomotives, try to keep the percantage down. 4% is about the practical upper limit of steepness, or about 3/8" rise per standard section of track. at this grade, your locomotives will pull about 1/6 what they will pull on level track.
the second rule of thumb, in HO scale, is that you need at least 3" of vertical clearance anywhere a track bridges another. 3" rise at 4% equals 75" of run, on either side of the bridge point. 3% needs 100", and 2% needs 150"......those 3 gradients are the ones woodland scenicns makes as risers. plan for the length of run you have and use the appropriate inclines.
btw, if you use the layout planning software, anyrail, you can have the program set the gradient for you, and it will tell you the exact elevation above table level of each track joint.
Quoteregarding the use of grades and inclines, it is not absolutely necessary to use the same gradient on either side of a hill.
Jeff you are correct. I used a 3% on one side and a 4% on the other. Both were stretched out by cutting them and adding blocks in to level ou different spots for an easier climb.
it's amazing what hides from the brain sometimes...must do this on the new layout! ;D