Hi, Folks
I recently purchased a Bachmann DCC Turnout #5 (right) and have run into a frustrating problem. The good news is that it's a cinch to program and switches perfectly every time. Here's the problem: when I run an A/B locomotive set, the B end gets stuck in the track when I set the turnout to right. (There's no problem when it's closed.) I'll try to explain what I discovered.
It seems that the part of the track that shifts to send the train to the right (sorry, I don't know what that's called) moves a little as the locomotive passes over it, which isn't a problem with a single locomotive or the passengers cars that it pulls. It only gives me fits when I run an A/B arrangement. When the A loco passes over the turnout, its rear wheels appear to create a little space between the track part that goes straight and the one that veers to the right. The front wheels of the B loco, then, enter the turnout while the shifter part of the track hasn't quite yet settled back to the full rightward position, so the B loco gets jammed between the two parts of the track.
One more thing: when I manually pull the A/B set through the turnout it works fine as long as I pull the A loco. As soon as I push or pull the set with only the B end, it jams as described above. I have run only one locomotive set so far, but I doubt the others will behave any differently. i
Does anyone have a solution to this problem? I'm really at a loss to figure it out.
Thanks
Keith
there are two things I do when I make my own switches that you can try. the problem you are having may with your switchpoints may be solved by these. derailments often occur when wheels catch the very ends of the points, so I've found it prudent to "hide the point" by putting a slight kink in the rail, just before the points. the idea here is to guide the wheels away from the ends of the points. you must be careful not to put too much of a kink in the rail, or your track will be out of guage and cause derailments. the other thing that helps is to file a bevel on the ends of the points. the ends of the points should be almost razor sharp instead of the blunt end of rail you get when they come from the factory. when I build my own, these things are taken care of before the track is laid down. it is a bit harder to do this when the track is down, or with a premade switch like you have, but it can still be done, carefully, with a small jeweler's file.
one other issue you might have is the wobble in the points. I don't have this problem as I have designed this wobble out of the ones I build, but others have either tightened up the pivots at the opposite end of the points, or added a small shim under the points on the throwbar. tightening the pivots works best when they are small rivets that you can tap with a nail set. if you decide to shim the throwbar instead, use a small bit of index card between the throwbar and the point, test it to make sure it solves the problem before you glue it in place.
kee-
Your B-unit's are picking the points of the turnout. It sounds like your A-unit's weight pressures the turnout enough to keep the points tight while it's on the turnout, but the points then shift a little. Things either settle back into place with the reduced weight of your cars or the cars' wheels are just enough thicker that they don't slide into the gap between the point and the stock rail.
Jeff's ideas are good ones but they are difficult to do on an installed turnout. I suggest that you try the shim or rivet tightening first. If those don't do the trick you can file a tiny wedge-shaped piece out of the stock rail so the point can nestle into it a little more. Failing that, file the edge on the point as Jeff suggests. I've never tried the kink fix myself, but the idea scares me a little. You would be looking at an almost microscopic kink and I'm just not sure how you could do that to an installed turnout without risking destroying it. Jeff -- do you have any further hints about this?
-- D
what I've done in the past is to grip the rail in needle nose pliers and give it a little twist. I haven't done this in a few years as I now build my own switches, and can file the notch in the rail for the points to fit in, before I ever spike the rail down. but when I still used atlas switches, the kink worked like a charm.
Jeff-
All right! I think I'll try it.
D
Thank all of you for your responses. Yes, Don, the B unit is picking up the points. I tried the shim, but that didn't work, so I then tried to file down the points as you suggested, Jeff. I guess I pushed a little too hard, so I broke the point off. I was so frustrated that I threw the entire thing into the garbage can. I've ordered another one from Amazon, which should arrive tomorrow, and I'll see if I have the same problem.
I originally used regular Bachmann turnouts, you know, the ones without the numbers (e.g. #5), and found that the curve of the turnouts didn't work for longer cars, so I ordered the #5 thinking that everything would work out. As far as the curve goes, it's great, but only if the locomotives will stay on the track without getting snagged on the points. If the turnout I ordered doesn't work, Bachmann's going to hear from me, pronto. Can any of you recommend other DCC turnouts compatible with EZ Track?
I won't even go into the torture of installing lighting kits on Walthers Santa Fe passengers cars as that's for another non-Bachmann forum.
Keith
If a single car or engine is picking a point, you might find that the back to back wheel spacing is incorrect. Use a good quality wheel & track gauge to check the back to back wheel spacing, then adjust the wheels accordingly.
You can get wheel & track gauges from the NMRA (See: https://www.nmrastores.com/Public_Store/product_info.php?products_id=53&osCsid=uf8t9v10e7skmr640ovdo1utd4 (https://www.nmrastores.com/Public_Store/product_info.php?products_id=53&osCsid=uf8t9v10e7skmr640ovdo1utd4))
--OR--
From tool houses such as Micro Mark (See: http://www.micromark.com/nmra-gage-ho-scale,7530.html (http://www.micromark.com/nmra-gage-ho-scale,7530.html)).
These gauges have the ability to help diagnose points, flangeways and other track and switch problems in addition to wheel standards. It is pretty much impossible to work on wheels and track without such a gauge.
Happy RRing,
Jerry
sorry to hear about the point breaking off. evidently the way Bachmann has them fastened isn't as strong as the atlas and peco I used to use. if you ever have to file a point again, try slipping something small like a match stick between the point and stock rail to provide somfe support.
before you completely trash an expensive switch, have another look to see if it can be salvaged. often, when you are in a calmer, less frustrated mood, you can find a way to fix things.
I agree with JerryB, a NMRA gauge is an invaluable tool to have when you are MRR.
Did I not read posts on this board previously that cited problems with Bachmann EZ turnouts picking points?
Hi, All
Well, I received another turnout in the mail today, hooked it up, and found no problem at all with it. I scrutinized the daylights out of the other one and couldn't find a problem, but I've noticed that the locomotive runs much more smoothly and quietly than it did on the turnout I threw in the garbage. Now to test the left turnout!
Thanks for all your help.
Keith
Glad it worked out :)
Bachmann Turnouts tend to have quality control problems. I too broke one of my turnouts trying to bend a point which did not quite sit flush with the stock rail. Now I examine the rails before I take the turnout out of the package. Once I have determined that turnout is straight a light filing help son the stock rail side of the points. I also do a light filing on the stock rail in some cases
Hi, Folks
Yes, I'm glad the new turnouts work, but I discovered an oddity in them. When I took the turnout out of the package, I looked at the bottom side and noticed a tiny wire that wasn't connected, so I hooked it up, thinking that it needed to be. I then noticed a message, cryptically written, that says the wire doesn't need to be connected for the switch to work. When I connected the turnout, everything worked fine until I closed the switch and then reversed the train so that it went backwards through the turnout. At this point, iy lost power, although it didn't do this if I reversed the train without closing the switch, that is, leaving it tripped.
Not one to give up, I decided to unplug the little wire on the bottom of the turnout and see what would happen. I ran the train in all directions with the switch in every possible position and experienced no loss of power. I chose Bachmann track because as a novice, I wanted a minimum of effort to learn the basics, but I've discovered that trial and error is taking up too much of my time.
Keith
Hi again, you guys
I think I'm just about ready to chuck this entire hobby as I've about had it with derailments, electrical problems, and general headaches. It's not as if I'm trying to do anything complicated or create complex layouts. For now, I've been happy just learning the basics of consists, DCC, and basic track configurations. I have a simple loop with a couple of turnouts on the laminate floor in my living room, no bumps or rises, just basic stuff, and still I find nothing but problems. As stated in a previous post, I decided to use EZ track so that I could concentrate on other issues.
This evening, I took my Santa Fe locomotives out of their boxes and attached several El Capitan cars hoping to enjoy my new turnouts. Joy quickly turned into another episode of frustration when the system wouldn't power up. I heard a faint click, so I thought it was just a loose wire somewhere. I tightened up all the connections but to no avail. I then decided to remove all the cars from the track and run only the locomotives, which worked fine. I then started adding back the cars and found that one of them was causing the problem: a Walthers Baggage-Dorm Transition Car (932-9770). Every time I put it on the track, the power shut down, and when I removed it, the power would restore itself or I could power it up from the controller. I don't see how a car without lights or any other power feature could wreak such havoc, especially when none of the others did so.
They call this the world's greatest hobby, but I'm ready to find something less nerve-wracking. I can't imagine what it would be like to deal with problems in a massive layout when this little trifle that I have has caused nothing but misery. I'm truly considering placing everything on eBay and calling it quits. It's just not fun any more.
Keith
Don't give up Keith!
Are you sure your Walthers car doesn't have lights? One of the trucks may have gotten rotated 180ยบ and be causing the short. Try rotating it back the 180.
8)
Dave,
Thanks for the encouragement; perhaps it'll be enough to keep me going a little longer. The Walthers car I referenced doesn't have lights and is not designed for a lighting kit, unlike most of the other cars in the El Capitan set. I'll try rotating the truck and see what happens. As always, I appreciate your input.
Keith
Keith.
I agree don't give up sometimes the frustration overcomes you , but when it's all figured out there is a certain feeling of accomplishment that somehow makes you forget why you got so frustrated in the first place. Patience does pay off in the end and you will soon learn why this is the Greatest Hobby in the World.
By the way I have been through the Bachmann turnout's inside and out and out of now 17 of them only 2 still need a little attention.
Jerry
Keith-
I understand how disappointing it is in the early stages of model railroading. You want nothing more than to run a few trains around in a circle and it just doesn't seem to ever get there. Be patient, however. It will get there. You will get there. Like any endeavor, there are a million things which can go haywire to baffle and frustrate a newbie. But it doesn't take long to get beyond those issues so you can experience the REALLY BIG frustrations. No. Just kidding. After a few false starts you'll find that your trains are running better and better. Will there be a time when everything goes perfectly? Probably not. But most things will work just fine and soon you'll be enjoying your trains most of the time with only the occasional glitch.
One thing which will make an immediate improvement is getting your trains off of the floor. While I envy the youth which you must have if you are able to do model railroading on the floor, I'm aware that floor railroads have lots more gremlins than do the ones on a table or on a shelf attached to a wall. The dirt and fibers on even a clean floor will quickly infest your equipment and cause trouble. That's even true for EZ Track, which is about the best thing for a floor layout. Toss in the sore knees, the achy back and the embarrassment of needing help to get up for the hundredth time today and you'll see why I offer this suggestion.
Dave is probably right about the trucks on your Cap transition car. Even though the car doesn't carry lights, it's cheaper for the manufacturer to use the same undercarriage and trucks for all of the cars than different ones for each, especially since very few people, even very few MRs, would know or notice the difference.
Passenger cars commonly have one truck rigged for electrical pick-up from one rail and the other truck rigged for the other rail. If one of the trucks gets turned 180o, it becomes a dead short from one rail to the other. That would explain the click you heard when the power went off; it was the circuit breaker in your power supply.
Hang in there. You won't be sorry you did.
-- D
keesu : Follow the advice Doneldon & Jerry gave you . The Universe is not perfect or was ever designed to be perfect . Every endeavor has a learning curve and if you stick with it you will eventually learn how to overcome adversity. Failure can teach you as much or more than success. Instant gratification is seriously overrated and nothing worth doing ever comes easy . J2.
So much for the "easy" of EZ track...
Quote from: jbrock27 on July 21, 2013, 09:53:58 AM
So much for the "easy" of EZ track...
Sounds like his last problem was with another brands rolling stock.
Perhaps, perhaps not. It would be helpful if keesu got back to us to let us know. Unlike what I would call 85% of the posters that come here, who never do. So we therefore have no idea if any advice given was worth its 2 cents or not.
Hi, All
OK, i've decided not to give up after all given the encouragement you've all provided. Doneldon, I do plan to get my track off the floor in the near future as you suggested; I only set it up that way because I wanted a temporary layout as I learned the basics. And I'm not as young as you might think, my naivete about the subject belying my actual age.
As for the problem with the El Capitan car, I decided to remove the trucks and place them on the track separately and then together and found no problem, so I figured it had to be something in or on the body. I noticed little metal contact points under the trucks that I assumed transmit power to the car. I placed little pieces of Scotch tape over them, and the problem was solved! I should probably open the car to find the real offender, but I'm afraid I won't be able to reassemble it properly as has been the case when I tried to install lighting kits.
Thanks again for all your advice.
keesu
That's what Doneldon was talking about. those metal contact point are where you would attach the leads for adding the lights. One of the trucks must have spun around.
You can get it back together correctly it just takes a little patience.
Jerry
k good to hear from you further. Keep up the persistence in your problem solving and as previously stated by Jerry & Doc you should be rewarded with success. They among many others here, have a great working knowledge of EZ track, EZ track switches (turnouts) and DCC.
And we have knowledge of rolling stock! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Yes indeed, the Bachmann Silver Series, being among them ;D
Quote from: keesu on July 21, 2013, 02:58:02 PM
Hi, All
OK, i've decided not to give up after all given the encouragement you've all provided. .......
I feel your pain keesu.
I have a rather large DC Z scale Marklin layout with about 25 turnouts and it all works flawlessly. As I age and my eyes strain looking at 220:1 I recently bought a considerable amount of Bachmann HO EZ Track for DCC operation.
So far I have four turnouts and two crossovers and for the most part it all runs great, even on the floor. However for some reason one of my 4-6-4 locos derails on the left crossover but not the right. It can be frustrating but I'm expanding my layout to the point where I can avoid that crossover with that loco and move on.
I have a dual oval, soon to be triple oval layout with sidings in the centre running 3 diesels and one steam. A mix of Bachmann and BLI.
If I get frustrated I just have a break and come back to it later rather than bin everything altogether ;-)
Keith-
The trucks themselves aren't the problem. It's the fact that they have to be properly oriented right and left or they will be connected by the car's chassis and cause a short. That's why the trucks can be perfect by themselves but short out when they're installed on the car the wrong way. There's another unusual short which may help to illustrate this.
Metal-body or metal-undercarriage freight cars which run just fine can short out if they are connected to other metal cars which have their trucks installed so that they are on the opposite rail from the first car. How can that happen? It happens when both cars have metal couplers which have continuity with the cars' frames. One car has its non-insulated wheels on the north rail and the other has its non-insulated wheels on the south rail. Electricity travels from the north rail, through the truck and into the metal car to the metal coupler which is hooked to the metal coupler on the second car which is connected to the second car's frame which is connected through the truck to the non-insulated wheels on the south rail and bzzzt. Breakers trip, the trains stop and it's very hard to find the problem because each car alone, like each of your trucks alone, has no problem. They can couple with other cars uneventfully as long as those other cars have the "same polarity." Heck, you can even short out when there are intermediate cars which have electrical continuity from a metal coupler on one end, through a metal chassis or floor, to the coupler on the other end. This is why most rolling stock today electrically isolates trucks, metal frame parts and metal couplers.
-- D