Bachmann Message Board

Discussion Boards => General Discussion => Topic started by: ilikeconrail on March 18, 2014, 06:58:15 PM



Title: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: ilikeconrail on March 18, 2014, 06:58:15 PM
Well cars I really need some I don't care if it's not the best the only ones out there a walthers and there a set of 3 for 86$ and I'm not looking for walters to expensive. Please if there is a slight change let there be low detail many surround like 25$ per car. I think I'm not the only one out there looking for them rather it might make you some good money there I'm just looking for some well cars with some cargo bins. Thanks and thank you for reading this. ;D


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: AGSB on March 18, 2014, 08:47:01 PM
Have you checked Ebay, there are many there.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: rogertra on March 18, 2014, 10:49:14 PM
Kato make them, Walthers make them, both sell in three packs and sell for around $70 to $75 for a three car set.

Remember, these days, modellers do not want cheaply made, poorly detailed freight cars.  They want well made, well detailed quality products as I'm sure Bachmann well knows.

The days of the inexpensive, Athearn Blue Box kits are long past, even though, by the standards of the day, they were considered a good product.

So, if Bachmann were to compete with the other two makers, they'd need to produce a product of equal quality and that means a similar price range.


Cheers

Roger.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 19, 2014, 06:22:20 AM
I'm not sure why Blue Box kits would not be considered a "good" product by even today's standards ???


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: Jerrys HO on March 19, 2014, 06:56:11 AM
Put your glasses on Jim... 8) ;D

Quote
The days of the inexpensive, Athearn Blue Box kits are long past, even though, by the standards of the day, they were considered a good product.

Jerry


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 19, 2014, 12:29:33 PM
Put your thinking cap on Jerry, because I am not sure you are following what either Roger, or I are saying buddy. ;)


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: Jerrys HO on March 19, 2014, 07:16:55 PM
Put your thinking cap on Jerry, because I am not sure you are following what either Roger, or I are saying buddy. ;)

My thinking cap was on. Me thinks you did a good job avoiding though ;D.

By the way I never got to experience the blue boxes, but as Roger stated if Bachmann did them they would be about the same price. Look at the pricing on the newer heavy weight passenger cars and compare.

Jerry


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 19, 2014, 08:48:24 PM
Sorry Jerry, I still don't think so  ::).
My comment was not directed toward price or any comparison of Bachmann making a similar product these days. My comment was about what I believe was Roger's inference about Blue Boxes, which was that in the day (which is not now) they were considered good products, but not now.   I had made my comment based on what he said here and what I remember reading in some of his other postings on Athearn freight cars.  My comment was meant to convey I think they were good then and they are good products now which is not what I think he was hinting at.  Since you have no experience with them, I don't know why you are commenting on them.  Why don't we take a breather and give Roger a chance to chime in and he can say whether I am all wet or not as far as my understanding of what he was hinting at? 


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: rogertra on March 19, 2014, 11:16:04 PM
By today's standards with scale and stand off grab irons and ladders, scale corner steps, finer body details, better under body detail like brake rigging (Even though nobody sees it) and other improvements, the Blue Box kits with cast on grab grab irons and ladders, clunky corner steps, not so fine body detail, no brake rigging etc., etc., are no match for today's quality rtr freight cars.  Ditto for Blue Box diesels, they just do not compare to today's diesels, which is why they've all been discontinued.  However, in their day, they were "scale" modeller's first choice but those days have passed.

Cheers

Roger.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 20, 2014, 07:49:02 AM
Just what I thought you meant Roger.  While I disagree they should no longer be considered "good" products by today's standards, I do appreciate your clarification.

One small point.  While the BBs are no longer made, the RTR (Ready To Roll) line has been the replacement.  Very similar in mechanism to the last run of BBs (as far as diesels go) but with the finer detail that you point out was lacking in the BB models.  The same finer detail is true of the RTR rolling stock.

Cheers to you as well.

-Jim


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jward on March 20, 2014, 08:08:48 AM
I'm with mr brock. the blue box and roundhouse cars are still good performers.

most of the upgrades in the rolling stock over the years has been in appearance. but fine details do not hold up well on a heavily operated railroad. if the detail parts were metal they would be more robust, but they are usually plastic.

consider this: in a review of a new locomotive a few years back, model railroader praised the detail on the locomotive, but mentioned the reviewer couldn't even get this locomotive out of the box without breaking off detail parts.

I will live with the clunky ladders.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: rogertra on March 20, 2014, 11:52:10 AM
Just for the record, 95% of my freight cars are Blue Box or Roundhouse.

However, zero of my locomotives are old Blue Box locos, they have all been retired in favour of Spectrum and other more accurate models.

Cheers

Roger.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 20, 2014, 12:27:33 PM
I think it would lead to a better understanding of what these were, if there was a better description of what "old" is Roger.  Are we talking about diesels, with rubber band drives?  Or the grey "jet" motor ones?  Or the gold can motor ones?  If the first, I would have deep sixed them too.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jward on March 20, 2014, 01:01:43 PM
the main reason I no longer use my athearn is because their electrical pickup system, while adequate for dc, is balky and unreliable on dcc. but for many years they were the backbone of my fleet. the newer ones with the scale width hoods still look right to me, with some minor discrepancies from real life (stepped frame over the fuel tank on a gp60 for example, emd stopped using stepped frames  long during gp50 production, years before the gp60 was introduced.)

they were certainly more accurate than the atlas rsd12 from the same period.



Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: rogertra on March 20, 2014, 01:23:25 PM
I think it would lead to a better understanding of what these were, if there was a better description of what "old" is Roger.  Are we talking about diesels, with rubber band drives?  Or the grey "jet" motor ones?  Or the gold can motor ones?  If the first, I would have deep sixed them too.

My Blue Box models were the ones with the sintered metal wheels and fly wheels from the late 1970s and 1980s.  These were the geeps with the over wide hoods, the SW1500 that was actually a SW7, the F units, a Baldwin switcher etc..  The ones that were superseded by the better quality Atlas, Kato and P2K models by Life Like and, of course, the excellent Spectrum models for steam.

Currently, the only Athearn locomotive models I have on the GER are two each of the Genesis 4-6-2 and 2-8-2 locos.  After a fair bit of work, and some additional detailing, these are now fine running models.  However, I've refused to purchase Athearn locomoitves ever since they refused to honour their warranties on the Genesis steam with the split gear syndrome.

My current diesel fleet consists of Kato/Atlas and P2K models.  I haven't purchased many new diesel or steam models in something like ten years.  The last models I purchased were two sound equipped Bachmann Alco 2-6-0s for branch line service over a year ago and a few months ago a pair of Bachmann FA-2 CNR diesels that I needed for my CNR transfer run.  I now have enough locomotives for my current operation.  Before that, I think the last steam I purchased was three of the 4-6-0s, before DCC was an option on anything, which have never been removed from their boxes.

I have a new model railroad to build so any spare cash is directed in that direction, not on model locomotives or rolling stock I don't need at the moment.

Cheers

Roger.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 20, 2014, 07:36:58 PM
Thanks Roger.  It's tough to tell from your response, if you ever owned any of the BB locos that had the improved gold can motor; it definitely was not part of their '70s line but came out in the early '80s and had brass flywheels.  The sintered metal wheels continued until they were replaced with nickel ones in the RTR series.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: rogertra on March 20, 2014, 07:42:23 PM
Thanks Roger.  It's tough to tell from your response, if you ever owned any of the BB locos that had the improved gold can motor; it definitely was not part of their '70s line but came out in the early '80s and had brass flywheels.  The sintered metal wheels continued until they were replaced with nickel ones in the RTR series.

I probably did not own any of their "improved gold can motor".  By the time that was released, I'd switched over to the better quality models offered by Kato/Atlas, P2K et al.

As stated previously, the only Athearn locos I now operate are two each of the 4-6-2 and 2-8-2 models.  I avoid Athearn diesels as there are still better and more accurate models available for my 1958 era GER than those produced by Athearn.

Cheers

Roger.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 21, 2014, 07:02:36 AM
Thank you.  The gold motor is a good motor IMO.
I like the Proto 2000s and 1000s myself.  Just need to have care for the fragile detail parts and have spare axle gears on hand for the P2Ks.  I don't particularly like the tabs on the shell for some of the P2Ks.  You know where the P2K cloned a lot of ideas in their design from, don't you?


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: rogertra on March 21, 2014, 01:26:00 PM
Thank you.  The gold motor is a good motor IMO.
I like the Proto 2000s and 1000s myself.  Just need to have care for the fragile detail parts and have spare axle gears on hand for the P2Ks.  I don't particularly like the tabs on the shell for some of the P2Ks.  You know where the P2K cloned a lot of ideas in their design from, don't you?

Main reason I discontinued Blue Box diesels was the inaccuracy of the body castings. The Blue Box hood unit's bodies were too wide, so as to accommodate the motor and plus the lack of stand off details.

It's the fragile detail parts that are the selling point for me. So the combination of finer details and a better running chassis and scale width bodies that was the reason I retired all my Blue Box units.   :)

And I know you can swap P2K gears and axles with Blue Box gears and axles.  :)

Cheers

Roger.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 21, 2014, 03:59:40 PM
Part of my point in mentioning the newer gold can motor, is that is was made narrower, thereby curing the "wide body" detail issue.  I understand your point, as even those models did not likely have all the kinds of details (at least stock anyway) you like to look for and have.


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: ilikeconrail on March 22, 2014, 03:20:57 PM
What help!!!


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 22, 2014, 10:37:08 PM
What help!!!

What's this mean?


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: ilikeconrail on March 23, 2014, 09:58:12 AM
They didn't help me


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: Jerrys HO on March 23, 2014, 10:27:53 AM
They didn't help me

I believe they did....

Have you checked Ebay, there are many there.

Kato make them, Walthers make them, both sell in three packs and sell for around $70 to $75 for a three car set.

Remember, these days, modellers do not want cheaply made, poorly detailed freight cars.  They want well made, well detailed quality products as I'm Bachmann well knows.

The days of the inexpensive, Athearn Blue Box kits are long past, even though, by the standards of the day, they were considered a good product.

So, if Bachmann were to compete with the other two makers, they'd need to produce a product of equal quality and that means a similar price range.


Cheers

Roger.

As you are finding out, this hobby can get pretty expensive but still cheaper than some of my other hobbies ;).

Jerry


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: jbrock27 on March 23, 2014, 12:29:50 PM
Jerry's right ILC and I beg to differ with you.  Your question was addressed early on and your choices presented to you.  Now it is time for you to make some choices.  I don't know what else you would expect of folks. 
As far as the information you are perceiving as unhelpful; even though it may not all be about the topic you were interested in, it is information nonetheless.  Ever hear that knowledge is power?


Title: Re: Well cars is there any chance bachmann will make them
Post by: rogertra on March 23, 2014, 02:24:20 PM
They didn't help me

Like jbrock27, I beg to differ.

There was a suggestion to search E-Bay and my post explained why a cheaply made, poor quality product will not sell in today's market.

You are looking at $65 to $80 for a three pack and that's the way it is, unless you can find something on E-Bay.

This can be an expensive hobby (Don't tell my wife) as the days of a $5.00 to $10.00 freight car kit are long gone.  How much clearer can we make it?

Cheers

Roger.