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Discussion Boards => HO => Topic started by: jonathan on September 07, 2014, 08:53:04 AM

Title: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 07, 2014, 08:53:04 AM
I figure it's going to be another six to eight months before I get a chance to work on the upcoming Sound Value USRA Mikado.  So to keep my hands busy, I'm working on another brassie.  Just thought I'd share a bit.

This is an OMI S-1a 2-10-2 or Big Six:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/DSCN4482_zpsf985ce38.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/DSCN4482_zpsf985ce38.jpg.html)

I held out for the more expensive (ouch) version of this model because of the detail and blind driver.  Radius is a concern:  24" is the best I can do with the available space.  Even with the blind driver this loco does not like 24" radius curves.  So....

I took a file to the frame around the first and fifth driver wells, and cut a notch to give the drivers more side-to-side motion:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4503_zps12a376e5.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4503_zps12a376e5.jpg.html)

This actually worked... I think.  ;D  The locomotive is not completed, yet.  But I have pushed the frame/wheels around the layout to make sure it can make the curves.

For such a pricey model, I was surprised at all the bad solder joints. As an example, several parts of the tender frame came off in my hands while I disassembled.  Perhaps you can see the fresh solder where I repaired this part in the upper left corner of the photo:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4511_zps96dd7812.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4511_zps96dd7812.jpg.html)

Haven't gotten to the boiler, yet. I know there are numerous joints needing attention.

Anyway; progress to date...

Primer:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4518_zps07b56c65.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4518_zps07b56c65.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4516_zps2852efbb.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4516_zps2852efbb.jpg.html)

Tender frame:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4537_zps97e504a1.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4537_zps97e504a1.jpg.html)

Drilled for headlight and reverse light:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4543_zpsda40802a.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4543_zpsda40802a.jpg.html)

Driver frame:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4540_zps61307efd.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4540_zps61307efd.jpg.html)

In this photo, can you see how the axle blocks, on driver's one and five, are moved in just a bit?
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4539_zps7b229aa4.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4539_zps7b229aa4.jpg.html)

Cleaned lubed and rewired the motor assembly.  While not used, it is 25 years old after all:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4541_zps1107b049.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4541_zps1107b049.jpg.html)

This will be the coal load one day:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4548_zps01536acd.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4548_zps01536acd.jpg.html)

Just this morning, I added decals to the tender.  Still need to be treated with microsol and so on.  But you get the idea:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4544_zps8c6bf423.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4544_zps8c6bf423.jpg.html)

Will post more as I make progress.

Regards,

Joanthan


Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: GN.2-6-8-0 on September 07, 2014, 12:44:31 PM
Thanks Jonathan'interesting as always ;D
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Doneldon on September 07, 2014, 09:57:03 PM
Quote from: jonathan on September 07, 2014, 08:53:04 AM
This will be the coal load one day:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4548_zps01536acd.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4548_zps01536acd.jpg.html)
Regards,Joanthan

Jonathan-

You want to be very careful with that white, foamy coal. I understand that it burns extremely hot.

                                                                                                                                      -- D
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Irbricksceo on September 07, 2014, 10:21:06 PM
HA! Good one Doneldon.

Looking good Jonathan, I wish I had the talent, and more importantly, the Patience for some of these projects you undertake. Keep us up to date!
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: MrBandO on September 08, 2014, 08:33:59 AM
Jonathan:

What do you use for your primer?

Thanks,
Greg
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 08, 2014, 09:43:02 AM
Greg,

I now use a spray primer I get from Home Depot. I think the brand is Rustoleum. It's good for wood, plastic and metal.  It works fine.

What worked the best for me was Floquil Grimy Black.  It went on incredibly thin and stuck great. Can't get that stuff anymore.

Having experimented a bit, I find the Rustoleum sticks well after being baked at 170 degrees for 20-30 minutes.  After that, it's quite difficult to remove the primer from the brass.  That's a good thing.

Following the primer I add a flat black coat, bake, than a clear gloss coat, OR a gloss black coat, bake, then decal and dullcote.

I try very hard to keep all my coats as thin as possible to avoid losing the rivet detail

Probably gave more info than needed.  :)


Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: ebtnut on September 08, 2014, 11:08:59 AM
Jonathon:  Where will the DCC  board and speaker go?  Vandy tenders can be a pain that way.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 08, 2014, 01:15:12 PM
My few brass locomotives are DC only.  I run them for my own pleasure at home. The DCC/Sound Locos travel to train shows and are for showin' off on our club modular layout.

Don't want to risk damage to these babies.  ;D Bad enough I put a little wheel wear on them, but I can't take 'em with me.  So...

The way a brass Vandy tender is constructed, it would be quite a challenge cutting a hole large enough to install a decoder and speaker.  There are those who have done it.

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: rogertra on September 08, 2014, 05:03:57 PM
Looking good.   :)

Cheers

Roger T.

Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 09, 2014, 05:10:28 AM
Thanks for the kind words, guys.

A fellow beano fan, who is much more knowledgeable than me, has been helping me with unique details.  He has access to picture angles we internet surfers don't often get.

Thus, I'm constructing a few extra details to throw around the tender.

There was a gadget connected to the coupler lift bar, so the crewman wouldn't have to climb down from the top of the tender to uncouple:

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4550_zps599a5c54.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4550_zps599a5c54.jpg.html)
It's removable for storage--just hangs on a fine hook:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4553_zps66464f28.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4553_zps66464f28.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4551_zps882a41bd.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4551_zps882a41bd.jpg.html)

This is a penstock hook; handy for grabbin' stuff when you're on top of the tender.  Not sure where to install it, yet, but every tender had one:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4552_zps4ea4e006.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4552_zps4ea4e006.jpg.html)
Made of steel wire--I haven't painted it, yet.

After 7 treatments of microsol and two coats of dullcoat, the decal edges never did completely disappear.  Sometimes, things just don't go your way:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4554_zps44dc3ce5.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4554_zps44dc3ce5.jpg.html)

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jbrock27 on September 09, 2014, 06:47:58 AM
Great stuff!
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: GN.2-6-8-0 on September 09, 2014, 01:02:24 PM
Would of helped had you applied the words separtely! ;D
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 09, 2014, 01:11:28 PM
Yep.  Just call me, lazy.  ;D
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jbrock27 on September 09, 2014, 01:11:32 PM
I wondered about that myself, but, would that not have made it more difficult to get them all lined up on the same axis?
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 10, 2014, 05:26:41 AM
That's the reason I don't cut them separately--so they line up.  I do intend to weather the whole locomotive, once it's done.  That should help.  Plus, the camera really brings out the lines.  Hard to see in person.

Anyway, tender is done, save for weathering and the coal load.  The reverse light works. On to the main event:

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4561_zps4444fb55.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4561_zps4444fb55.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4565_zpsfa133f2f.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4565_zpsfa133f2f.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4566_zpsaf64d8b2.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4566_zpsaf64d8b2.jpg.html)

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jbrock27 on September 10, 2014, 06:48:21 AM
Thank you for your answer Jonathan.
Looking great!
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Irbricksceo on September 10, 2014, 08:39:14 AM
Looks Great! I'm  curious, Did you wire the light to turn on in both directions?
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 10, 2014, 10:46:39 AM
Again, thank you.

The reverse light is a Surface Mount LED (SMD).  It will turn on in only one direction.  Hence, the positive lead is wired to the tender frame.  The negative lead, with resistors, runs to the frame of the locomotive--wired backwards from the headlight.

Moving forward the headlight is on.  Moving backwards, the reverse light comes on and the headlight turns off.

With this simple-type wiring, I ocassionally get what I can only attribute to a static build up (guess).  In other words, every once in a great while, the reverse light will flash while the locomotive is moving forward.  Strange... not really noticable when hauling a consist.

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jbrock27 on September 10, 2014, 12:34:41 PM
I have had that happen occasionally, on some of the diesels I have wired this way.  I thought my eyes might have been playing tricks on me when I would see a very brief flash of the light at the opposite end of the direction the loco was going in and wondered why this would sometimes happen.  Otherwise, the directional lights operate as they were set up to.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Irbricksceo on September 10, 2014, 12:40:32 PM
Well, even with SMLEDs you could do it in both directions, but it would required diodes and be more trouble than its worth IMO. i've never seen this phenomenon you describe but It is curious.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: electrical whiz kid on September 11, 2014, 08:04:08 AM
Jonathan;
I have found that taking the time it takes to be excruciatingly fastidious pays off-I have done it most ways, and that is best.  For that reason, I decal on a rainy day, when I am totally relaxed.  I use a scalpel for doing decal work-it touches NOTHING else.  I had been using Floquil paint until they dropped the "good stuff" (the organic lacquer) so will start looking for a good gloss coat, and a relly really dead flat.
On the decals:  I try to make my cuts at the lettering as much as possible.  This helps tremendously, and the film won't  tend to show on the rest of the decal (optical illusion probably).
RIch C .
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jbrock27 on September 11, 2014, 09:34:30 AM
Rich, what method or trick do you use, when you cut at the lettering, to get all the letters to line up on the same axis?  Thank you.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Joe Satnik on September 11, 2014, 10:02:17 AM
Dear All,

Had your coffee yet?  Good.

Welcome to (old school) Electrical Engineering.

The reverse diode flash is caused by inductive kickback from the motor.

Any inductor, which includes a motor winding, is an energy storing device. 

It stores its energy in "current" (I), which is measured in Amps.   

Just the opposite is a capacitor, which stores its energy in "voltage" (V), which is measured in Volts. 

It is hard to get current going in an inductor. 

Once you get it (I) going, it wants to keep going. 

If you abruptly turn off the power to the inductor, it will try to keep the current going. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auvh0H4QvbY

That current has to go somewhere. 

In this case the reverse LED happens to be (conveniently) available to absorb (provide a non-destructive path for) that current, thus the flash. 

If your front LED is wired to run only in the forward direction, you will see it flash after you are running in reverse and abruptly turn off the power.

Inductive kickback can destroy sensitive electronics,

so in many cases reverse diodes are wired across inductive loads to absorb it. 

(http://www.coilgun.info/images/inductordiode.gif)

You may wake up now. 

Hope this helps.

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: ebtnut on September 11, 2014, 10:20:42 AM
BTW, Jonathon, I have one of the original Weside B&O Q-4b's.  I remotored it very early on with a big Sagami that just fit inside the firebox.  When our club decided to go to command control (with CTC-16 so you know how long ago this was) I wanted to run the loco there.  As with most Vandy tenders I've run across, you had to do major brass surgery to put anything inside the tender.  I kind of took the cheater's way out and bought one of the Rivarossie Big Six tenders and cut out the coal load so the receiver could be installed.  The loco is now DCC and still runs well.  If and when we ever get a new club space, I will probably put a sound module in it.  And yes, the original tender and water bottle are still in the box, still unpainted. 
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jbrock27 on September 11, 2014, 11:49:38 AM
Had 3 cups, thanks. ;)

Thank you for that explanation and tutorial Joe.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 11, 2014, 12:48:06 PM
Well, that does explain the flash... and it didn't put me to sleep.  :)  Thanks for that. If I read it correctly, the light will flash if the loco goes over a bit of dirty track, the motor briefly loses full current but keeps moving, providing the kickback.  It would be a very quick event.

Ebtnut, I have remotored the Q-4 as well.  Runs great, but won't be adding DCC.  I like your solution.

I've been slowed down a bit on the rebuild.  As I started to reassemble the drive train this morning, the middle driver (the blind one) froze up on me. I've figured out it's not a quartering or linkage problem.  Something's going on between the axle block and the wheel on the left side.  This make take a couple days to noodle out as I have to disassemble now painted parts--nerve racking indeed.

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Irbricksceo on September 11, 2014, 02:47:56 PM
Fascinating Joe thank you for your post

I remember your q4 post Jonathan, very nice looking loco. Was that the one w/ the screw reverse? Good luck finding the problem.

Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: ALCO0001 on September 11, 2014, 04:51:54 PM
Johnathan,
Nice work.
Was the Rustoleum paint high gloss ? I see your troubles with the decals that I had myself .I  ended up redoing them and put a top coat of clear over the baked paint and it solved the problem ,but before the clear I gave it a quick dunk in some vinegar to sort of etch the paint so the clear would stick AND rinse quickly or the brass will corrode.. It cost me a lot of time and a lesson in patience.Thanks for sharing !
Jack
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 11, 2014, 06:16:35 PM
The final coat of paint was a high gloss, custom transparent black paint.  Perhaps I didn't get is thick enough for that perfectly smooth finish.  Ah well, I did a bit of weathering and it looks much better, at least, something I can live with and not strip and redo.

I soak the bare brass in vinegar for 24-hours to get the etch.  Never tried it after the loco had a primer coat, if I read you right.

Irbricks, the screw reverse was on the 0-10-0 U class switcher.  That baby runs like a dream.  Actually the Q-4 runs pretty well, too.

OK, Question time.

I'm 99.99% sure I accidently got some thread locker on the axle of the blind driver.  This worked its way between the axle and brass journal that sits in the wheel well if you get my meaning.  This froze the wheel of course.

I have removed the driver from the frame.  Using a pliers I can hold onto the brass journal and turn the wheel, but it's really stuck.  I have tried light oil and paint thinner, while turning the wheel.  This has made it a little easier to turn, but still no free enough.

So... is there a chemical, or process, I can use to get the thread locker from between the journal and axle?  I have considered applying heat, and or soaking in hot soapy water.  Just not sure what to try next.

I do have a gear puller and quarter.  As a last resort I will pull the wheel and clean it out manually, but that's scary stuff.

Thoughts?

Thanks in advance.  Hoping I haven't created a permanent varnish.  :-[

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: GN.2-6-8-0 on September 11, 2014, 07:40:00 PM
Have you given any thought to soaking the driver and axle in say maybe alcohol over night? Only concern might be if its is a insulated driver's wouldn't want to chance damaging it.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 11, 2014, 07:45:26 PM
I think I solved my problem.  

I took a needle file to the middle of the axle and made some microscopic scratches.
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4567_zpseadc2a19.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4567_zpseadc2a19.jpg.html)

Then I turned the wheel while passing the brass block over the scratches.  After about 20 minutes of turning and turning, the wheel now seems to spin freely.  I applied a lot of light oil as well.  I don't even think my camera picked up the scratches I made in the axle:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4568_zps2a567f3d.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4568_zps2a567f3d.jpg.html)

Anyway, it seems I worked off enough of the thread locker (red medium) to get things working again.  Sorry for my panicked state, earlier.

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: GN.2-6-8-0 on September 11, 2014, 08:30:05 PM
Alls good that end well! NOW! care to tell us just HOW' you got Lock Tite in between the axle and the bearing in the 1st place.........Hmmmmmm? :)
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Doneldon on September 11, 2014, 11:31:35 PM
Jonathan-

I hate to say it but I think you need to disassemble the mechanism and polish out the thread lock with something
like a Scotch pad. That won't do anything to the metal but it will clean out the residual Locktite.
                                                                                                                                                 -- D
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 12, 2014, 05:15:08 AM
Appreciate it, Doneldon.  You are right I'm sure and, I almost did take it apart, but that made me very nervous.  Spare parts aren't easy to come-by on a 25-year-old model, and I felt better about cleaning it out without taking it apart.  It spins freely now, so I think I'm in the clear.

As to how I got the locktite on it in the first place... well... let's just say people shouldn't have more than one project at-a-time sitting on their desk, um, workspace... and then get sloppy when opening small chemical containers.  One never knows where little drops of stuff can end up. The worst part is you don't know you made a mess until it dries.

After a bit of weathering, the tender looks better.  You can hardly make out any lines now, except, perhaps just after the E in "BALTIMORE".  I think I can detect a line in front of the O in "OHIO". 

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4570_zpsc3fab6fd.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4570_zpsc3fab6fd.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4573_zps1f0a2a3b.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4573_zps1f0a2a3b.jpg.html)

I will try to get the glossy paint a bit thicker when I work the boiler shell. That should help.  Of course, there are no long words or phrases on that part.  :)

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Jhanecker2 on September 13, 2014, 04:33:50 PM
Locktite recommended  methylene chloride as a solvent or heating the parts to  482 degrees fahrenheit to release the thread locker . John 2
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 13, 2014, 08:12:03 PM
Aha! So heat would have worked.  Thanks JH2. Will keep that nugget for the next time I need to unlocked something.

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 14, 2014, 06:58:42 AM
I often take photos of construction progress to look for little things one can't see with the naked eye.

The smokebox front looks pretty good, until you really get in close:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4577_zps64d6c968.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4577_zps64d6c968.jpg.html)

Fortunately, touch up work is easier, once you know what to work on:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4578_zpsd862d721.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4578_zpsd862d721.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4581_zps0dceadb7.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4581_zps0dceadb7.jpg.html)

The drive mechanism up close:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4584_zpsd9584180.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4584_zpsd9584180.jpg.html)

The rods and valve gear haven't been weathered, yet. Spinning nicely so far.  I still see a little bare brass here and there:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4586_zps753a8c02.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4586_zps753a8c02.jpg.html)

The camera is a brutally honest tool. 

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: rogertra on September 14, 2014, 11:27:47 AM
Really nice work Jonathan.

I agree about the camera.  The eye sees what you expect it to see, just as our brain does.

In wartime it's call a "ruse de guerre" (trick of war) where you provide the enemy with what they are expecting see, only it's a deception, hopefully to your advantage. :)

Thanks to digital cameras, when I'm building scenery or working on locos etc., I also frequently take photos of the project because, as you say, the camera doesn't lie and shows you the faults your eye and brain refuse to see.

Cheers

Roger T.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: ebtnut on September 15, 2014, 11:01:20 AM
Jonathon:  Maybe try some ACC remover.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 15, 2014, 11:27:17 AM
I reattached the motor this morning and ran the mechanism for about 10 minutes in both directions.  So far, it runs very smoothly.  Seems like I cleaned it out well enough.

If I remember correctly, loctite is great for holding things in place if you don't want them to move.  I believe the bond breaks down once parts are moved back and forth continuously.  My thought is, if there is any residual loctite, it will break down and dissipate as the wheels turn.  At this point I don't see any evidence that there is anything left on the axle.

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Doneldon on September 15, 2014, 02:12:07 PM
Jonathan-

You are absolutely correct. Once a Loctite joint is broken it cannot reassert itself. As a kid I worked for a cousin in his optometry office. (He was more like an uncle age-wise and I think he was trying to interest me in the profession.) We used a quick application of heat to undo Loctite joint where screws held the temples to the frame of glasses and never needed to do it a second time or to clean out any residue. The Loctite basically vaporized right out of existence.
                                                                                                                                                                                                               -- D
P.S. Another great looking job here! I admire your work.
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 15, 2014, 05:52:45 PM
Thanks, Doneldon.

Here's the mechanism all ready to go; weathered, lubed, and runnin' right:

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4597_zpse18321cf.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4597_zpse18321cf.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4598_zps23b690f6.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4598_zps23b690f6.jpg.html)

It may be a while before I get the finished product.  The boiler is a project unto itself.  Needs solder repairs, little parts that get painted separately, lights, crew... not to mention I have to build a new paint stand.  It's too big and heavy for my other stands.

Anyway, I'm hoping a couple of weeks will suffice.

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 24, 2014, 05:24:34 AM
To remove the lacquer from the shell, I soaked it in thinner for a few days and washed.  Then I boiled it in a water/baking soda solution and washed.  Finally, I soaked it in vinegar for a couple days... and washed.

Here's a piece of the lacquer:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4664_zps16da495f.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4664_zps16da495f.jpg.html)

The shell was so ugly, after all my manipulations, I didn't take a photo of it. However, here is the primer coat:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4652_zpsd95bb87a.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4652_zpsd95bb87a.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4653_zpsd70cc852.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4653_zpsd70cc852.jpg.html)

Primer coat was rested for a couple days, then baked in a 170 degree oven for 30 minutes.

Flat Black coat, still wet in this photo, will be baked as well:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4659_zpsa001f32e.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4659_zpsa001f32e.jpg.html)

I will mask the smokebox and firebox, prior to adding the gloss coat.  The graphite color will be painted right over the flat black.  

All this is a lengthy process, filled with waiting... which I hate.  To occupy my modeling time, I finished the smokebox front, pony and trailing trucks, and the crew figures:

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4661_zps8c001fdc.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4661_zps8c001fdc.jpg.html)

Also finished the pilot.  The dummy coupler does swing side-to-side and will hold a regular coupler.  Thus, double-heading is possible:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4672_zps235e93be.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4672_zps235e93be.jpg.html)

I almost forgot... I added rerail frogs to the tender.  My wire hooks are not perfect, but who looks at models from a half-inch away?
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4667_zpsd4a87759.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4667_zpsd4a87759.jpg.html)

That's all the progress for now.  Gloss coat and decals are the next steps.

Regards,

Jonathan

Addendum

Whoa!  Shiny!
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4677_zpsa63bbb59.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4677_zpsa63bbb59.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4673_zps16e43725.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4673_zps16e43725.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4678_zps54370287.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4678_zps54370287.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 26, 2014, 09:07:04 PM
Quick Update:

All the black coats and decaling are complete.  Now it's time to paint the smokebox and firebox.  I'll use Neolube.

I enhanced the photographs to bring out the detail, so the loco looks more gray than black:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4679_zps734ba87b.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4679_zps734ba87b.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4680_zps2dadaf86.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4680_zps2dadaf86.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4682_zps2852190c.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4682_zps2852190c.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4681_zpsdd3d2060.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4681_zpsdd3d2060.jpg.html)

Tried to get a shot of the backhead before I painted the details and added the crew. Hard to get enough light:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4688_zpsa06b76c0.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4688_zpsa06b76c0.jpg.html)

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: Doneldon on September 27, 2014, 03:28:02 PM
Jonathan-

You're a wizard. You've done a perfect paint job and decaling.

                                                                                  -- D
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 27, 2014, 03:51:09 PM
Thanks, Doneldon! I don't know about perfection, but I'm starting to get the hang of this after 60+ paint jobs (that includes freight cars).

Finished a lot today (not much going on for a change).  All I have left is installation of the whistle pull, overfire jets (they're plastic) and final assembly of the major parts.

Added .5 oz. of weight to the shell. Bullfrog Snot to one left driver:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4689_zpsab9d9007.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4689_zpsab9d9007.jpg.html)

Still Trying to get a decent shot of the cab.  It has window glazing, weathering and stuff:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4697_zps7678b7eb.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4697_zps7678b7eb.jpg.html)

Various shots of the painted and weathered shell, with glazing and crew.  The glass never turns out in my photos:
(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4706_zps2c1e67ac.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4706_zps2c1e67ac.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4694_zps985b0407.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4694_zps985b0407.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4705_zps06d1f2ad.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4705_zps06d1f2ad.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4695_zps544d9155.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4695_zps544d9155.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4700_zps31a3e8f2.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4700_zps31a3e8f2.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4704_zpsb7b98b37.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4704_zpsb7b98b37.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4701_zpsdae72dbd.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4701_zpsdae72dbd.jpg.html)

Regards,

Jonathan
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: rogertra on September 27, 2014, 05:28:47 PM
Nice work, well done.

Cheers

Roger T.

Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: J3a-614 on September 28, 2014, 12:33:16 AM
As usual, a good looking project! 

It's still fascinating to see what your camera picks up.  For instance, under the magnification you have, it's possible to see what look like tool marks on the driver tires--as if they had come out of a wheel lathe! 

The bit about loose solder joints was a not unknown complaint from some earlier Korean brass model production. 

Found a number of good photos of Big Sixes, hope you enjoy them.

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=66104&nseq=668

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=57107&nseq=681

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=55532&nseq=685
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 28, 2014, 07:42:32 AM
Thanks, Roger and J3a.

Photographs of the rear of a steam locomotive seems to be rare as chickens teeth.  That was a good one.  Even better was the color photo of a Big Six coming out of the Harpers Ferry Tunnel. After drinking it all in, I noticed the heavy brown on the side of the smokebox and front of the cylinders.  I have seen that bit of weathering before, and have been reluctant to apply that much brown to my own models.  I may get that brave this time.

Finished the last little bits before final assembly.  The overfire jets are from the extra parts bag from the Bachmann EM-1.  Bachmann comes through again.  Now, they are a spaced a little too far apart so I couldn't put the required 4 jets on the fireman's side. Three will have to do.  I don't mind a little compromise.  Because they are plastic, I used a tiny drop of white glue to hold them in place.  The next owner may be offended by plastic on the brass model.

Got the smokebox front back on, which was really, really difficult. Did not want to pop back in the way it popped off.  Must be the paint around the joints.  

The whistle pull is a piece of .008" brass wire.  I fine sanded it for toothiness (sp), soaked it in vinegar for several days, and painted it with slightly thinned grimy black.  It's held in place with a tiny drop of epoxy. The epoxy joint was painted over to hide it.

All that's left is soldering up the headlight wires and attaching to the frame.  I'm waiting a day to make sure I'm good and relaxed.

Regards,

Jonathan

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4708_zps499b7459.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4708_zps499b7459.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4709_zpsedf32793.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4709_zpsedf32793.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4715_zps5bb30132.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4715_zps5bb30132.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4713_zps4a41ad50.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4713_zps4a41ad50.jpg.html)

(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4714_zpsbb679e01.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4714_zpsbb679e01.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 29, 2014, 05:10:37 PM
Done and done.

Regards,

Jonathan



(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4755_01_zpscb06d864.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4755_01_zpscb06d864.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4769_zps7592b628.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4769_zps7592b628.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4750_01_zpsa0afa741.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4750_01_zpsa0afa741.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4744_01_zps9a08f99e.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4744_01_zps9a08f99e.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4739_zps981d06c0.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4739_zps981d06c0.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4738_01_zps473113a1.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4738_01_zps473113a1.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4737_01_zpseb23bc7f.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4737_01_zpseb23bc7f.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4735_01_zps8676a6b0.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4735_01_zps8676a6b0.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4730_01_zpscf027a34.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4730_01_zpscf027a34.jpg.html)


(http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu146/jsnvogel/Projects/DSCN4726_01_zpsa2f1830a.jpg) (http://s642.photobucket.com/user/jsnvogel/media/Projects/DSCN4726_01_zpsa2f1830a.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: ebtnut on September 29, 2014, 07:47:28 PM
Beautiful work, as always Jonathon.  Just curious, does the loco number mean something special?  I see it comes from the 1957 steam renumbering era. 
Title: Re: Yet another Locomotive Project
Post by: jonathan on September 30, 2014, 05:02:56 AM
Thanks, ebtnut.

As much as possible, I am trying to model those last few years of steam.  Although I have compromised a few years before or after if I find a model I really like.

Also, I have a couple of color photos of that particular locomotive, dating around 1958. 

And the most selfish reason:  I'm not very coordinated when it comes to decal work.  It's near impossible for me to get those tiny numbers on the headlights. I do have small numbers that would have fit better on the headlight wings, just couldn't manipulate 'em.  :)

Regards,

Jonathan

Addendum:

#524 had an unusual piping arrangement coming off the top feed double boiler check valve.  The right side pipe made a long diagonal trip down to the back of the locomotive.  A few other S-1a's had the same configuration, as did the model.  Makes you wonder what photos the manufacturer used when constructing the model.