Bachmann Online Forum

Discussion Boards => HO => Topic started by: stationmaster12 on October 01, 2014, 10:00:04 AM

Title: DCC compatibility
Post by: stationmaster12 on October 01, 2014, 10:00:04 AM
Hi everyone!!! I want to know if anyone of you have experience running MTH HO trains with the Bachman EZ DCC system. The reason I ask is because I was gifted  a MTH SD70ACe that I want to run on DCC, but I do not have a DCC system yet. I like the price point of the Bachman EZ DCC starter set, but I am not sure it it will operate my SD70ACe. My main concern is the adders changes for the loco. My layout is only 4' X 6' and I am using Atlas code 93 track. Thanks for the help. I look forward to the replies!!!
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: JimJim on October 01, 2014, 10:07:21 AM
Hello,
First a question: Is the gifted loco DCC?

Second, take a look at "HO crossover track" in this forum.

Hope this helps.
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: stationmaster12 on October 01, 2014, 10:20:36 AM
Yes the loco is DCC and sound MTH's Protosound 3.0
Thanks!!
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: JimJim on October 01, 2014, 10:56:33 AM
Included with the E-Z Command system are instructions on how program a loco to a specific address; 1-9 on the E-Z Command system, address 10 is used for DC operation, unless you add an external DC controller like I did to free up that channel for DCC use.
There are also instructions included on how to reprogram a decoder with a previously assigned address.
Hope this helps.
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: richg on October 01, 2014, 01:44:29 PM
You will do better with the Dynamis DCC controller.

There are issues running MTH locos with DCC systems that I have read in a couple other train forums. Don't remember the details though.
Some users replaced the MTH decoder with a DCC decoder. The last I knew is the MTH have DCS technology.
I suggest you Google mth dcs with dcc.

Rich
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: stationmaster12 on October 01, 2014, 01:48:23 PM
It does. Thank you!!! I think my loco can be programmed on the main. That is what I have to figure out next. If it does then I'm in good shape. Thanks again. And if you think of anything else please let me know. By the way here is a pic of my layout. I did some scenery work this morning.!!

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=482325281908519&set=gm.1484390321839901&type=1&theater

Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: rogertra on October 01, 2014, 02:31:48 PM
Quote from: richg on October 01, 2014, 01:44:29 PM
You will do better with the Dynamis DCC controller.

There are issues running MTH locos with DCC systems that I have read in a couple other train forums. Don't remember the details though.
Some users replaced the MTH decoder with a DCC decoder. The last I knew is the MTH have DCS technology.
I suggest you Google mth dcs with dcc.

Rich

I tend to agree with Rich here.  I've read that MTH developed their own DCC system which is not 100% compatible with NMRA Standards DCC.  Sadly, this is why I've avoided purchasing any MTH locomotives.

Cheers

Roger T.

Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: richg on October 01, 2014, 04:03:39 PM
Quote from: rogertra on October 01, 2014, 02:31:48 PM
Quote from: richg on October 01, 2014, 01:44:29 PM
You will do better with the Dynamis DCC controller.

There are issues running MTH locos with DCC systems that I have read in a couple other train forums. Don't remember the details though.
Some users replaced the MTH decoder with a DCC decoder. The last I knew is the MTH have DCS technology.
I suggest you Google mth dcs with dcc.

Rich

I tend to agree with Rich here.  I've read that MTH developed their own DCC system which is not 100% compatible with NMRA Standards DCC.  Sadly, this is why I've avoided purchasing any MTH locomotives.

Cheers

Roger T.



Again, make sure you do the Google search as the MTH systems is, "DCS", not DCC if the locos have not been modified by others.
They are nice looking locos though.

Rich
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: jbrock27 on October 01, 2014, 07:34:03 PM
YouTube can also be a friend:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnVFaUVVMT0
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: hawaiiho on October 01, 2014, 10:31:48 PM
I have several MTH locos, both steam and diesel; older ones have more problems using DCC than newer ones.

The main remaining problem being the inability to use service mode or a programming track mode. 

All programming must be done on the main.

Hope this helps.

Will
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: Jerrys HO on October 01, 2014, 11:17:16 PM
Just a reassurance to Station Master 12. I have the same loco as you and I run the EZ Command and this loco just fine. The MTH unit has much more functions than you will be able to use without a upgrading to a better system.
Off the top of my head the functions available are:
F1 bell
F2 short horn
F3 long horn
F4 can not remember (CRS)
F5 crew talk
F6 I believe mutes the sound and if you press it multiple times it will change the volume setting
F7 coupler crash
F8 coupler clash
F9 CRS
F0 lights

Some listings may be out of order but I have not ran my loco's in about 6 months :-\
Pressing crew talk is cool for about a minute then it's gotta go :P.
If you have the booklet that came with it it will show the functions I mention and more.
Very nice running loco, smooth and quiet. Has BEMF which is a plus especially on grades.

Jerry

Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: stationmaster12 on October 02, 2014, 12:40:30 AM
Hey Jerry,
Thanks for the reply. I'm seriously considering the E-Z Command especially after reading your post. When running your SD70ACe, which number  button for address do you press on the E-Z command? Thanks again!
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: Doneldon on October 02, 2014, 03:23:11 AM
Quote from: stationmaster12 on October 02, 2014, 12:40:30 AM
I'm seriously considering the E-Z Command

SM12-

If you like the Bachmann DCC system dig a little deeper than the EZCommand and get the Dynamis. The entry-level system has very limited power, no programming ability and the ability to send instructions to only ten DCC locos. However, it will only be able to run two or three at once, depending on whether or not they have sound. The power can be increased at a high cost but that will not change the number of locomotives it can handle at one time or its inability to program decoders.

Dynamis is more powerful plus it is a full-featured system which will give you complete programming ability for a virtually endless number of locos. I'm not writing this because I work for Bachmann. I don't. But I feel very strongly that even a newbie model rail will quickly become disappointed with the EZCommand's limitations.
                                          -- D
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: Jerrys HO on October 02, 2014, 04:39:22 PM
Quote from: stationmaster12 on October 02, 2014, 12:40:30 AM
Hey Jerry,
Thanks for the reply. I'm seriously considering the E-Z Command especially after reading your post. When running your SD70ACe, which number  button for address do you press on the E-Z command? Thanks again!

I keep mine addressed to default (3) for the reason others have stated about MTH. I figured everything works fine where it's at so leave it alone. All other loco's (Bachmann) are assigned to other address's.
Some here knock the ability of the EZ Command because of it's limited ability but as an entry level system that came with one of my set's, it has helped me learn DCC a lot easier.
I have this problem that if it's available let's play with it. In my case I don't have it so it was easier to learn the basics and hang out at the local club and watch the use of their NCE system. Others have helped with tutorials sent to me by PM's also.
I have chose the NCE system for numerous reasons ease of use and the local club uses it so it would be easier for help from local guy's than searching the net.
As far as the last poster stated about the Dynamis being better, IMHO it is an infrared system which can be interfered with (search and you will see some problem's other's have had) and has functions that are there but unusable ( supposedly for future expansion???).
The basic EZ Command is a good option to start with so you can learn as you go and when you are ready you can decide which system is going to work for you ( Dynamis,NCE,Digitrax,MRC (great power packs, unfriendly DCC station from what I have read).

Jerry
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: stationmaster12 on October 02, 2014, 05:05:06 PM
Jerry,
Thank you for your input! I really appreciate it. I think I will go with the Bachman EZ Command. Based on the research I've done including your input it should work just fine for what I need. In the past I've had the chance to operate the older Digitrax Zephyr and a MRC Prodigy Express. Both nice, but I can not afford either one now. I ran into an EZ Command on Bay for like $50 plus shipping new. I'm going to jump on that one. Thanks again for your time your have been very helpful!!
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: hawaiiho on October 02, 2014, 08:10:26 PM
Doneldon's comments are excellent points. I used the Dynamis for several years and still keep it as a backup.
I upgraded beyond the Dynamis for two main reasons. My new system allows connection to my computer and the new system will  read CV's.
If those are not requirements then the Dynamis is a very good option. In my opinion the EZ Command is a little limited for use with most sound locomotives. It is fine for the Bachmann Sound Vaue units but is quite limited for any sound units beyond that. I did a lot of shopping and was able to obtain my Dynamis for what I considered a very, very good price.
I still say and have researched it extensively, since I have several MTH locomotives that the negatives are FAR blown out of proportion. As I said in a previous post, the major thing that I have encountered is that the MTH locomotives must be "Programmed on the Main". A Service mode or program track will just not work with them as yet; although MTH has promised an upgrade that will correct that issue. I can honestly say that I have run into no other problem. For this, the Dynamis is MORE than sufficient.

I have heard that advanced consisting is not useable when using DCC to control MTH locos, but that is something I rarely use and have never needed with my MTH locos. Additionally, the old consist wil work fine and works great with the Dynamis. If you still have doubts, do what I did; a lot of RESEARCH!
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: ACY on October 03, 2014, 01:46:32 AM
I have 4 MTH SD70ACe locomotives with DCS and sound. If you intend to utilize a variety of sounds then a more advanced DCC system would be ideal. If you only operate MTH locomotives you could buy their DCS system I suppose which would give you maximum functionality. However I have found advanced DCC systems to be more than adequate with sufficient compatibility for most people. With that said I think most would find the abilities of the EZ Command system to be a bit lacking, mainly because MTH locomotives have 20-30 sound functions while the Bachmann EZ Command only has 10 buttons. It would not make sense to use a budget DCC system with a locomotive with advanced capabilities, where the locomotive retails for $300+. Otherwise why have a locomtive with 30 sound effects if you can't use over two thirds of them. The Dynamis system would be certainly adequate in my opinion for use with MTH sound equipped locomotives.
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: stationmaster12 on October 03, 2014, 08:36:01 PM
Hey guys,
All of you make excellent points. The reason I am considering the EZ Command is because of it price point. Yes I have a MTH SD70ACe, but it was a gift. I did not pay for it. I do not have the budget to support a plethora of sound locos  and the latest gadgets. If funds were not an option I'd buy the MTH DCS Commander and a MRC prodigy Squared system. That being said the EZ command is very appealing  to me at this time.
Title: Re: DCC compatibility
Post by: rogertra on October 03, 2014, 09:43:43 PM
Actually, if you want the "best" DCC system with the least amount of problems and the most flexibility, then the NCE system is the way to go.

And yes, I'm biased.  :)

Cheers

Roger T.