If you use Krylon paints and seal in the decals with their matte, beware of their change in paint formulas. The new paints, Indoor/Outdoor, are in the cans with the taper cap and the new spray nozzle; these are enamel paints. If you use Matte Finish to seal in the decals, this is a lacquer base. The results can be wrinkling to the point of ruin. Krylon now only makes the enamel clear in a gloss (useless to me) --- no flat is currently being made. The only possible matte is their water based matte finish but I haven't found it on the shelves, yet. So be careful and do a trial spray first, I didn't and I am sorry now. Lee in Tucson.
So that's what did it. I lettered my large scale connie, and when I sprayed on the matte finnish, it blistered the decal. I used Krylon Matte. No more, it's going in the garbage.
Bruce
I have a can of the new Krylon acrylic in FLAT clear. It dries with a flatter finish than the matte paint. I bought it a couple of months ago at Wal-Mart.
Jim Pipkin
Thanks for the heads up. I had thought just the packaging was new, but now see the "new" stock numbers start with a 5 before the four-digit color code.
The Krylon matte I have been using with no problems so far is #1311 which is said to be non-yellowing.
Larry
My problem started when I painted (with the new black paint), decaled and then coated (with the old matte finish) 2 identical flat pieces, same time and place; one wrinkled and one was okay. Stupid me blamed myself so I redid the wrinkled one with same results. Also had the same trouble with the new red paint on a caboose I was doing at the same time. That is when I finally wrote Krylon. Too bad they don't label these cans with the type of paint product other than the chemical contents. Other paints from them actually did say enamel/lacquer. Lee
Bach man should let Krylon know how the Bachmann Bashers have had their world turned upside down. To have the perfect can finishes at resonable prices was wonderful.
I've always used TESTORS DULL COTE to seal my decals. The can says it's a flat lacquer, but it has not caused any decals or dry transfers to wrinkle.
Jestor--Dullcote is OK for indoor models, but will not hold up in repeated outdoor exposure, and getting caught in a thunderstorm ruined it on some of my gauge 1 equipment . That equipment was lightly rubbed down and recoated with Krylon 1131 matte clear, which is holding up fine, including being out in the rain.
Ole--have you heard back from Krylon yet? My response from them indicated the new product is more sensitive to conditions and drying time. But, your example of identical pieces seems to question that.
Anyone interested in the full response I received can go to My Large Scale and my thread on the Model Making forum. You do not have to be a member to read the forums.
Larry
Larry: I have had a continuing dialogue with Krylon; they do reply promptly. But as for explanations of their paints, it leaves something to be desired. So far, they offered to send a can of their new clear but it only comes in a gloss; that was back on January 21st and I still haven't seen anything. Krylon never brought up using/trying their Low Odor Clear Finish (latex) spray --- it was suggested to me by a fellow modeler. I finally have a can of it and will try it this weekend. Krylon's reply to using their latex matte clear? '... it will probably work for that. I'd still recommend doing some testing first, just to make sure it's working well...' As a customer, it sure would be nice to have the manufacturer do the testing rather than me. As far as the 2 identical pieces, painted with the new (enamel) black and dull coat with the old (lacquer) spray with 1 wrinkling and 1 not, 'this is usually going to cause problems...' I would like something more definite than that. Lee in Tucson
Not only does the new Krylon (clear satin) have an appetite for decals, it did a number on some spray-can Scalecoat II my friend had used for an accent stripe.
Quote from: ole on February 08, 2009, 09:00:27 PM
If you use Krylon paints and seal in the decals with their matte, beware of their change in paint formulas. The new paints, Indoor/Outdoor, are in the cans with the taper cap and the new spray nozzle; these are enamel paints. If you use Matte Finish to seal in the decals, this is a lacquer base. The results can be wrinkling to the point of ruin. Krylon now only makes the enamel clear in a gloss (useless to me) --- no flat is currently being made. The only possible matte is their water based matte finish but I haven't found it on the shelves, yet. So be careful and do a trial spray first, I didn't and I am sorry now. Lee in Tucson.
I used the new dark green gloss with the new clear gloss (both indoor/outdoor with tapered caps and new nozzles) and every time I sprayed over the the green (even after letting it dry for days) with the new gloss clear it wrinkled the green to all heck. I have since switched to Testors gloss cote and have not had anymore trouble when spraying it over the new Krylon dark green gloss. Point is, beware of the new Krylon clear coat also and ALWAYS test first!!!
Has anyone tried the new Krylon (tapered cap) Satin Black over Bachmann's steam loco black? I am planing to cover the white stripes and lettering with Krylon Satin Black. Then renumbering and use clear Deft over this. This thread has me nervous and there is not much room for testing on the On30 Shay.
Quote from: #94 on March 18, 2009, 08:31:57 AM
Has anyone tried the new Krylon (tapered cap) Satin Black over Bachmann's steam loco black? I am planing to cover the white stripes and lettering with Krylon Satin Black. Then renumbering and use clear Deft over this. This thread has me nervous and there is not much room for testing on the On30 Shay.
Painting over existing stripes and lettering will not completely hide them, because the thickness of the original stripe & lettering will still show through the new coat of paint. Putting the new coat on heavy enough to hide this will also obscure detail.
Regards,
Bill
That's interesting.
I just joined the discussion and am surprised to see the problems with the new Krylon. I've been using the new materials for months without any problem at all....
I use Bel-decal paper and print all my decals with an ALPS. I don't use commercial decals at all.
Most all my decals are applied to Large Scale trains.
I prepare the surface of the model with Arcylic Satin, allow to cure, apply the decals, allow them to dry for 24 hours, add 3 coats of satin again and 3-4 coats of matte. Can #1311. That procedure works great for me.
All manufacturers rolling stock has been done this way.
-Ok, so I should do the eraser thing to the lettering and stripe.
-I bought the Deft Lacquer because I had heard it was good over new decals and OK with the Bachmann loco black.
-The old Krylon used to work over Bachmann loco black and from this post should I believe that the new Krylon black is safe over the Bachmann colors?
-Lacquer does not work over the new Krylon?
-Should I use the Deft but get a lacquer based black paint?
-Or use the new Krylon and get an Acrylic Satin?
As there are always changes in chemistry because of "regulations" and such in the US, it's been my practice to test everything when those changes are made.
Depending on the decal material used, each type of application process needs to be tested for compatibility.
I can only speak from my own experiences. Using bel-decal material, printed on an ALPS printer, they Krylon Acrylic paints are compatible. Krylon Acrylic is compatible with most, but not all of the Large Scale paints. Plastic and brass. However, testing is the best advice.
Dull Coate has a tendency to destroy the ALPS printed decals. That's why I use the Krylon Acrylic products.
???I am wondering why you all are using the Krylon paint to begin with? There so many companies that specialize in model paints where the pigments are smaller giving a great finish.
Not dig'n for trouble just curious why?
El Loco,
I agree model paints are a safe bet, but Krylon paint meant:
-No driving 25 miles just to find out the hobby shop did not have what you want.
-No waiting for order to come by UPS.
-Convenience of being on the shelf every place spray paints were sold.
-Very economical compared to model paints.
-Matched Bachmanns paint quite well.
-To do what modelers do well: improvise and look for alternative solutions.
We will persevere.
;D I now understand, I am fortunate to have a LHS close by. I now have a better understanding.
Best regards. ;)
Since my first posting about Krylon products, I have made a change in my painting operations. No matter what color paint was laid down, I now only use the gloss acyrlic clear if decals are to be applied; if the paint is glossy then I skip this clear coat. Once the decals are down, then I use the water-based matte clear finish to seal in the decals. I am now comfortable to use these products without any problems but this only came after alot of experimenting.
Whatever your project and as previously stated, be sure to test on some scrap before spraying the final product.
Lee