It's been brought to my attention that the original three engines in the Bachmann Thomas range have a large number of faults. This only includes Thomas, Percy, and James, the most bought, but also most criticized engines in the range. Now, it's time to get down to the facts and show why.
The basic introduction to this is, I love the Bachmann range, and all my newer engines like Edward, Henry, etc. have proved to have decent length lives so far, and run a lot smoother than my Bachmann Thomas, and the James I ran often at the club. It's rather disappointing to have these facts being the downfall of the range. Now how about we go and see what each problem is?
Thomas the Tank Engine
(image from unknown source)
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/thomastankengine.png)The image above is from Thomas and Gordon, and shows a fine view of Thomas' small drive wheels with plenty of space between them, unlike James'.
(image from unknown shopping site)
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/bac642.gif)
Now here's the Bachmann Thomas. Lets point out the errors.
- Not a very smooth runner
- His stripes on his boiler mold out for some reason, rather than perfect lines around it.
- There's a lack of front coupler.
- Bit large drive wheels
- The space between his splasher and tank is absent.
- Thomas also has an unusual face, cheesy grin face that represents nothing in the show.
Now, how can Thomas be improved?
- First off, lets start with his paint job. Thomas oddly of all engines, has paint that wears the easiest. This should be addressed to, as well as his boiler stripe issue.
- A nice addition would giving Thomas an open cab. Not quite necessary, but just a good addition.
- Give Thomas better hauling power, and some weight!
- Front coupler; Tomix, removed part of his front, and put the coupler there. It's highly likely Bachmann would have to do the same here.
Photo reference (lost source):
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/tomixthomas.jpg)
- The space by his splasher; it could be adding a small bit of space, which I noticed none of the chassis actually occupies the area. Or, for a similar result, a Japanese Thomas modeler got a great result painting the space black (from Adult Thomas):
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/thomas2.png)
- Lastly, the face and chassis/wheel appearance. Thomas has some decent faces, but I think the best faces are those put below. They're not "Overly insane" happy, but really just the kind of face Thomas would have on a normal day, especially at a Model Train Convention! The top three images show faces, all from the episode "No Joke For James," while the drive wheels reference is from "Thomas Gets Bumped," and the general Thomas is from "Thomas and the Rumors."
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/thomasface.png)
Percy the Small Engine:
(image directly from "Thomas, Percy, and the Post Train")
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/percymkay.png)
Here we see Percy, tired from working the Mail Train. Looks like a really useful engine!
(image from Adult Thomas)
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/bachmannpercy.png)
Now here's the Bachmann Percy, quick examination and he doesn't look very much like he does on television, now does he? Luckily, Bachmann Percy is the most stand able among the three engines. His chassis could use some more power though. Lets point out his errors.
- Like Thomas, has that boiler stripe problem
- Also like Thomas, he lacks a front coupler. This problem was corrected on the Bachmann Juniors retooling of Percy, but this is sold in the United Kingdom.
- For some odd reason, Percy is clearly marked with a manufacturing mark on the middle of his body on all of the produced models!
- Another face that has no real TV series counterpart.
- The side rods have an unusual addition of half a loop.
- Percy is a bit "out of gauge," as when running him by my platforms, his steps for his crew seem to stick out too much!
Now, how can Percy be improved?
- Give Percy more hauling power, and a lot of weight!
- Like Thomas, an open cab would be a nice addition, but not necessarily something we despise as modeler customers.
- Remove that odd loop on the chassis, to give a better appearance.
- Smoothing out and remove the manufacturing mark on his top.
- Give Percy a smaller cab step
- Percy could due with a face we all recognize. He always has a chipper, cute happy smile on his face, and lesser known for a big cheesy grin. Here's some examples from "Thomas, Percy, and the Post Train," "Thomas, Percy, and the Chinese Dragon," and "Woolly Bear."
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/percyfacessparks.png)
James The Red Engine:
(thank you Chris of Sodor Island Forum for finding the image)
(http://i397.photobucket.com/albums/pp56/flyingkipper/deleted277.jpg)
And lets bring out the worst for last, James. By far the second most popular engine in the entire series, the image above is a great reference for James.
(from unknown shopping site)
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/34112.jpg)
Now here's the Bachmann James. Looks like a decent enough model, eh? Not really. This model frustrated me to wits end, and was thus ULTIMATELY DESTROYED in attempt to fix and open it! I was not a happy camper that day.
- James has black wheels, but the model presents both his wheels, and tender and tender wheels with the color grey.
- James is often complained as the worst runner amongst the three engines, and I understand why!
- There is no front coupler on the bogie.
- The face is the usual grin, but shows major error.
- James' smoke box is not painted all the way down. This is right by his face, where a large blank space of red is.
- James' cab is ENTIRELY closed, and nearly impossible to access. All the other Bachmann engines have a cab that's open now, and you can easily put a little HO scale human in it for fun, but James has the hideous cab that hints further of being a toy, not a model.
Now, how can James be improved?
- Lets FIRST of all, paint all his grey wheels and tender into his splendid black shade.
- Next, very importantly, give him a much nicer open cab. I've taken it off before, and even now it'd be partially possible.
- Give him some more weight, and hauling power; he's a mix traffic engine, so I would highly hope he could pull Edwards loads (around 20 wagons) and a bit more.
- Add a front coupler to James' front bogie.
- Repaint the spot on the smoke box
- Fix up his face. Hornby gave him that humongous grin we all recognize him with. Sure it's a nice grin to look at for a moment, but after awhile, we gotta admit that it gets creepy! Below are images from "No Joke for James." All of them are the same face, and show James with a general smile on his face, and looks much more casual. I strongly recommend this face!
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/jamesface.png)
Dear The Bachmann, Bachmann Industries, or anyone:
I stood to say these overhauls and changes to the range would do the business good, and from what I've seen in the Large Scale range, the paying of attention to quality is paying off. I still stand my ground that the HO range could do some revisions to meet with the wonderful quality Bachmann is bringing out in the Thomas range these days. Most of the Thomas merchandise lines do revise their products every so often (Wooden Railway and Hornby being prime examples), so why not Bachmann too? Bachmanns already has confirmed the possibility with the Oil tanker (which I personally welcome the change).
So, I'm up setting up suggestions for yet another piece from the Bachmann Thomas range, I give you...
The Brake Van... Mk II
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan2.png)
Here is a typical brake van used in the television series, Thomas and Friends. They're usually dark brown, or gray, it varies.
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan4.jpg)
Now, here's the Bachmann Brake Van for the Thomas range. Its rather bland and unappealing. Basic errors include:
- Personal nitpick: The body is just one big piece, rather than having the cab be a separate piece.
- The entire brake van is just white with a black chassis, and doesn't resemble brake vans in the show in terms of color.
So, what can be done?
Well, lately, most if not all of the Bachmann Rolling Stock is just repaints from the Bachmann Branchlines (aka the UK) freight cars. So how about digging up one and use it for the Bachmann Thomas range. Lets look...
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan6.jpg)
- This is a 20 Ton British Railways brake van in Bachmanns range. For Television Series fans, this is a good candidate for the Brake van. It has the recognizable design that we see in the TV series all the time, and simply has a more realistic appearance than the Bachmann Thomas brake van at the moment.
Now, lets spice it up a bit!
(http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/403/spite.png)
Now whose this old fellow? It's the Spiteful Brake Van. Hey, if the Bachmann range would put in the M wagon of all rolling stock, I can see this guy getting a chance. But am I saying make a model of this old rival of engines? Not quite. My idea is for the Spiteful vans face be added to the brake van revision; basically, small touch that would bring out a personality to the new brake van.
(http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/681/spite2.png)
It would be the ideal rolling stock to go with Bachmann Donald and Douglas, wouldn't you think?
Speaking of rolling stock...
Troublesome Trucks
(http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/4827/bachmann.png)
The Bachmann Troublesome Truck #1 and Troublesome Truck #2 have been in the range for a long time. While I generally don't find a problem with them, I personally find one flaw in them: Their faces aren't completely accurate. This is quite a shame when compared to Troublesome Truck #3, who has an amazingly accurate classic face.
(http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/2508/truckm.png)
Perhaps a face revision is in order? It wouldn't take much effort, as the truck body and chassis itself are fine. One thing is for sure though, whatever face is picked...
(http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/2108/cgi.png)
...Using the CGI face would ignite some interesting discussion (to say the least), considering the response gained from the new Bachmann Diesels face. The model era faces do have more expressive faces though.
In Conclusion, these are minor detail updates and rolling stock revisions that have been a curious thought of mine for awhile. These touches however, could very likely spark new interest in these products. I hope these suggestions are considered. Over and out.
Next time.. I'll go West!
I made this topic as a suggestion to Bachmann. Sure this is a lot of talk for such small changes, but talking with a lot of modelers I know has brought up these as rather annoying concerns, and disadvantages even with the competition with Hornby (a lot of people are willing to have items shipped from the US to the UK, and from the UK to the US nowadays with the increase of on line shopping). I think it's also time for them to receive their updates after nearly 10 years into the range.
I understand most plans go through HiT Entertainment first, and I hope they like these plans as much as I do, as will other members who will post in this topic.
All Images, Thomas and Friends, etc. are copyright (c) to HiT Entertainment, and respective photo shooters of the home models.
I own none of the images used, in which they are simply used for references.
3 thumbs up!
Agree all the way! ;D some parts like the half circle on Percy being changed might save bachmann money! less parts = less building cost. Plus its what we want! :o So really doing things like that makes everyone happy :D! Thanks for sharing Sparks! :D
Sparks I love the enthusiasm and how much time you have made into making this thread possible. The suggestions you have put on the three engines and the pointers you gave are very clear and understanding. You have earned my respect on that one. ;)
However regarding Thomas, there is one thing you have forgotten which I can understand why you forgot it since it was the same mistake Bachmann and Tomix both made and was not used in Season 4 onwards. (Only in Season 1-3) and that was on the back of Thomas there are red stripes that form a square.
That's just a suggestion I have but other then that I'm really happy with where this thread could possibly go in the future. :)
Hah!
Been so long since I've actually taken note to the back of Thomas, I forgot that smaller detail! :P
And cheers, I don't think I'll have much more to say about this thread, less it be detailed reasoning for future releases.
However, should I bother with Annie and Clarabel? ;)
Well Annie and Clarabel I don't see having a change anytime soon since I don't see too many people complaining about them. It's worth a shot though. :)
However I did think of an idea regarding this right after I made this post, and I really hope you don't mind me thinking of this suggestion but would you be interested in making a nitpicks video regarding these three models (And Annie and Clarabel if you wish)? Why I am asking is I think that the more people who see these errors the more discussion we will have and more importantly maybe a higher chance of newer editions of the three models being done. ;)
It all depends on how I do it. I could narrate it, or put text over it, making all this information and critique into a video would require a lot of work.
And me buying a new camera. :P
True it was just a suggestion I had, no worries. :P
But yeah, I hope that all is well and like I said before newer editions of the three main engines would look really awesome for the range and I hope Bachmann thinks about our suggestions and thoughts because it really would make a difference for a lot us modelers out there.
One thing I would like to point out with Percy is that he doesn't have a back gray hook. All the others have them, but he doesn't. I took one off of my old Gordon that I made into Henry MK1 and stuck on the back of Percy. :P
Quote from: Sparks on May 03, 2009, 06:13:25 PM
It's been brought to my attention that the original three engines in the Bachmann Thomas range have a large number of faults. This only includes Thomas, Percy, and James, the most bought, but also most criticized engines in the range. Now, it's time to get down to the facts and show why.
The basic introduction to this is, I love the Bachmann range, and all my newer engines like Edward, Henry, etc. have proved to have decent length lives so far, and run a lot smoother than my Bachmann Thomas, and the James I ran often at the club. It's rather disappointing to have these facts being the downfall of the range. Now how about we go and see what each problem is?
Thomas the Tank Engine
(image from unknown source)
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/thomastankengine.png)The image above is from Thomas and Gordon, and shows a fine view of Thomas' small drive wheels with plenty of space between them, unlike James'.
(image from unknown shopping site)
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/bac642.gif)
Now here's the Bachmann Thomas. Lets point out the errors.
- Not a very smooth runner
- His stripes on his boiler mold out for some reason, rather than perfect lines around it.
- There's a lack of front coupler.
- Bit large drive wheels
- The space between his splasher and tank is absent.
- Thomas also has an unusual face, cheesy grin face that represents nothing in the show.
Now, how can Thomas be improved?
- First off, lets start with his paint job. Thomas oddly of all engines, has paint that wears the easiest. This should be addressed to, as well as his boiler stripe issue.
- A nice addition would giving Thomas an open cab. Not quite necessary, but just a good addition.
- Give Thomas better hauling power, and some weight!
- Front coupler; Tomix, removed part of his front, and put the coupler there. It's highly likely Bachmann would have to do the same here.
Photo reference (lost source):
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/tomixthomas.jpg)
- The space by his splasher; it could be adding a small bit of space, which I noticed none of the chassis actually occupies the area. Or, for a similar result, a Japanese Thomas modeler got a great result painting the space black (from Adult Thomas):
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/thomas2.png)
- Lastly, the face and chassis/wheel appearance. Thomas has some decent faces, but I think the best faces are those put below. They're not "Overly insane" happy, but really just the kind of face Thomas would have on a normal day, especially at a Model Train Convention! The top three images show faces, all from the episode "No Joke For James," while the drive wheels reference is from "Thomas Gets Bumped," and the general Thomas is from "Thomas and the Rumors."
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/thomasface.png)
Percy the Small Engine:
(image directly from "Thomas, Percy, and the Post Train")
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/percymkay.png)
Here we see Percy, tired from working the Mail Train. Looks like a really useful engine!
(image from Adult Thomas)
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/bachmannpercy.png)
Now here's the Bachmann Percy, quick examination and he doesn't look very much like he does on television, now does he? Luckily, Bachmann Percy is the most stand able among the three engines. His chassis could use some more power though. Lets point out his errors.
- Like Thomas, has that boiler stripe problem
- Also like Thomas, he lacks a front coupler. This problem was corrected on the Bachmann Juniors retooling of Percy, but this is sold in the United Kingdom.
- For some odd reason, Percy is clearly marked with a manufacturing mark on the middle of his body on all of the produced models!
- Another face that has no real TV series counterpart.
- The side rods have an unusual addition of half a loop.
- Percy is a bit "out of gauge," as when running him by my platforms, his steps for his crew seem to stick out too much!
Now, how can Percy be improved?
- Give Percy more hauling power, and a lot of weight!
- Like Thomas, an open cab would be a nice addition, but not necessarily something we despise as modeler customers.
- Remove that odd loop on the chassis, to give a better appearance.
- Smoothing out and remove the manufacturing mark on his top.
- Give Percy a smaller cab step
- Percy could due with a face we all recognize. He always has a chipper, cute happy smile on his face, and lesser known for a big cheesy grin. Here's some examples from "Thomas, Percy, and the Post Train," "Thomas, Percy, and the Chinese Dragon," and "Woolly Bear."
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/percyfacessparks.png)
James The Red Engine:
(thank you Chris of Sodor Island Forum for finding the image)
(http://i397.photobucket.com/albums/pp56/flyingkipper/deleted277.jpg)
And lets bring out the worst for last, James. By far the second most popular engine in the entire series, the image above is a great reference for James.
(from unknown shopping site)
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/34112.jpg)
Now here's the Bachmann James. Looks like a decent enough model, eh? Not really. This model frustrated me to wits end, and was thus ULTIMATELY DESTROYED in attempt to fix and open it! I was not a happy camper that day.
- James has black wheels, but the model presents both his wheels, and tender and tender wheels with the color grey.
- James is often complained as the worst runner amongst the three engines, and I understand why!
- There is no front coupler on the bogie.
- The face is the usual grin, but shows major error.
- James' smoke box is not painted all the way down. This is right by his face, where a large blank space of red is.
- James' cab is ENTIRELY closed, and nearly impossible to access. All the other Bachmann engines have a cab that's open now, and you can easily put a little HO scale human in it for fun, but James has the hideous cab that hints further of being a toy, not a model.
Now, how can James be improved?
- Lets FIRST of all, paint all his grey wheels and tender into his splendid black shade.
- Next, very importantly, give him a much nicer open cab. I've taken it off before, and even now it'd be partially possible.
- Give him some more weight, and hauling power; he's a mix traffic engine, so I would highly hope he could pull Edwards loads (around 20 wagons) and a bit more.
- Add a front coupler to James' front bogie.
- Repaint the spot on the smoke box
- Fix up his face. Hornby gave him that humongous grin we all recognize him with. Sure it's a nice grin to look at for a moment, but after awhile, we gotta admit that it gets creepy! Below are images from "No Joke for James." All of them are the same face, and show James with a general smile on his face, and looks much more casual. I strongly recommend this face!
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/jamesface.png)
I made this topic as a suggestion to Bachmann. Sure this is a lot of talk for such small changes, but talking with a lot of modelers I know has brought up these as rather annoying concerns, and disadvantages even with the competition with Hornby (a lot of people are willing to have items shipped from the US to the UK, and from the UK to the US nowadays with the increase of on line shopping). I think it's also time for them to receive their updates after nearly 10 years into the range.
I understand most plans go through HiT Entertainment first, and I hope they like these plans as much as I do, as will other members who will post in this topic.
All Images, Thomas and Friends, etc. are copyright (c) to HiT Entertainment, and respective photo shooters of the home models.
I own none of the images used, in which they are simply used for references.
One detail I'd like to mention for all of them is (and this counts for Gordon, Henry, and Toby as well) that the British couplers should be black, not gray. Also for Annie and Clarabel I'd like to see a black running board, red buffer beams, and black British couplers. ;)
I didn't really count those, as many members have proved that repainting them is about a 5 minute job. Same with the hand rails; not much of a point making them actual rails, since these are for kids to hold easy (but we like our better detail too!). :P
Most mistakes I mentioned are large errors, and would require a lot of time on our part.
Annie and Clarabel, you said just what was needed to be said, but since that's all there really is to say, I didn't bother. Good noting though. ;)
Way to stick it to the Bach-Man! Seriously though, Bachmann should consider some of these updates and modifications thus adding detail and more realism to the television series it models. Sure, all these are great suggestions, and any one done would be a big step to achieving more realism... I'm not stating anything for sure or anything, but let's the Bach-man tell us his input... Good or bad.
You make good suggestions, Sparks.
Oh, ThomasFan247,
I like your new picture for your studio thing. It looks a bit more "at home" with the Thomas model and the forums general theme of light/regular blue.
Joshua
And BTW, the "odd loop" (as you call it) on Percy's chassis is actually called the "crosshead guide yoke." But yes, the TV series Percy has an inside yoke while the Bachmann model has an outside yoke.
Hay, long time no post.
Well wanted to point out about one thing for the james, thomas, and percy moldels. One thing (for all actaully) is that the eyes paint scratches off easly, thus having an odd thomas moldel, why my broken percy has now one painted eye and one made w/ a sharpy. I say the should put a plastic coating over it to prevent that. Another thing was that front couplers are a great idea seeing that even little kids want to pull the trains backwards, the all would need a front coupler. But also they should work on the troublesome trucks. For one they are black int the series, but bachmanns are a plastic gray, and then the wheels are too big, and not show acurate, pluse the wheels have some kind of "steps" in the sides. And even Tobys face isn't TV accurate. I just hope they don't go for the CGI immage faces instead, that wouldn't be good :(. Aw well lets just wait and see what will happen.
i agree, i think its time to fix the models
Sparks, I would like to point out, Thomas in the T.v. Series has the same height as Edward. Upgrading Thomas, percy and James is a Great idea and i thought i point out another deatail that was over looked or forgoting
I find heights harder to notice, but that's just me.
I hope Bachmann takes a gander at this thread. :)
What's REALLY annoying about James having a closed cab is- well- look at the photo for him online and on the backs of the packages. Open cab.
Quote from: Santa Fe buff on May 04, 2009, 08:15:52 PM
Way to stick it to the Bach-Man! Seriously though, Bachmann should consider some of these updates and modifications thus adding detail and more realism to the television series it models. Sure, all these are great suggestions, and any one done would be a big step to achieving more realism... I'm not stating anything for sure or anything, but let's the Bach-man tell us his input... Good or bad.
You make good suggestions, Sparks.
Oh, ThomasFan247,
I like your new picture for your studio thing. It looks a bit more "at home" with the Thomas model and the forums general theme of light/regular blue.Joshua
Thanks :D
I feel that this thread might of been just a bit too big for Bachmann to read. :P
I hope he sends us a reply soon...
Seeing no one else has come forth...
These are Children's toys. They are not going to spend THOUSANDS on retooling the molds just to satisfy a minority. The majority of those who own a Thomas set are between 6 and 10, and don't know, or don't care about the inaccuracies. Bachmann Industries cannot make any more money, only lose money by retooling the molds to satisfy a dozen people. Why don't you just correct this yourself?
Hornby did updates on their models several times, for the exact same market you consider not worth updating for. Consider the additional fact that the Bachmann engines are already hard enough to modify, and that the original three engines were approved under Gullance, and not HiT Entertainment. I actually have tried to do the corrections myself, but you can really go only so far before annoyance (not worth the fuss) comes in. The majority of the market is from 8 and older actually. No specific age limitation.
To my knowledge Hornby puts faces on its OO equipment, so when they update their OO equipment, so does the Thomas. Bachmann USA does not produce mainstream British Equipment. Bachmann equipment is intended for Children who will recognize the character, not rivet counters. Its not going to happen, I can tell you that much... They won't sell any more than they did before. Consumers will buy them because they want one, and they won't be any more popular after the retoolings, so the company would be LOOSING money.
I still say it'd be a gain, not a loss. Hornby does not update their Thomas locos when the base engine is updated. Their E2 Class models haven't been touched since the 80s, and ended when the model was reused as Thomas, which was updated regularly after. These are kids buying the models, but even as a kid at 5 or 6 I was well aware of the detail on a toy or model. If they wanted to, they could be just as lazy with their new models and make lower quality versions of Edward, Mavis, Spencer, etc. but it's apparent that for toy models, the Thomas range does have some decency. It's not like much would be lost, especially during the economic downtime, rather than spend more on new engines, just go about fixing up existing engines to the up to date standards. Once the new revisions would be done, the older versions would be discontinued.
Saw a Henry Chassis converted to an On30 USA model once. Don't think anyone would want to do a similar modification to Thomas, Percy or James (other engines in the range are smoother runners to note).
Dear The Bachmann, Bachmann Industries, or anyone:
I still stand to say these overhauls and changes to the range would do the business good. Most of the Thomas merchandise lines do this to their toys eventually (Wooden Railway and Hornby being prime examples), so why not Bachmann too?
So, by popular demand of members here, I'm up setting up suggestions for yet another piece from the Bachmann Thomas range, I give you...
The Brake Van
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan2.png)
Here is a typical brake van used in the television series, Thomas and Friends. They're usually dark brown, or gray, possibly to show coming of age.
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan4.jpg)
Now, here's the Bachmann Brake Van for the Thomas range. Its rather bland and unappealing. Basic errors include:
- The wheel chassis is different from any brake van I've ever seen.
- General nitpick: The body is just one big piece
- The entire brake van is just white with a black chassis. Bland
So, what can be done?
Well, lately, most if not all of the Bachmann Rolling Stock is just repaints from the Bachmann Branchlines (aka the UK) freight cars. So how about digging up one and use it for the Bachmann Thomas range. Lets look...
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan6.jpg)
- This is a 20 Ton British Railways brake van in Bachmanns range. For Television Series fans, this is a good candidate for the Brake van. It has the recognizable design that we see in the TV series all the time, and simply has a more realistic appearance than the Bachmann Thomas brake van at the moment.
Now then, there's a second candidate, and it's a bit more technical, to say.
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan5.jpg)
- This is another 20 Ton British Railways brake van in Bachmanns range. It's a bit chubbier, and none of these have ever appeared in the Television Series. So.. What makes them a good choice? Well it's actually the original books, the Railway Series, that make this type a perfect choice.
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan1.png)
- Here is an illustration from the Book "Duck and the Diesel Engines," which shows the brake van in use. It's not an oddball either, these brake vans are practically the Sodor Railway (North Western Railway) standard:
(http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s60/Sparks_tr/Trains/brakevan3.png)
- This is illustrations of The Spiteful Brake Van from the Book "The Twin Engines." He's just an example of a Sodor brake van, and even lives up to his villainous name when torturing Donald and Douglas. Not quite the same type of brake van as the Bachmann UK design, but still a short length brake van none the less.
So the conclusion is, either brake van is a good base for replacing the original. Either design would work, but if the shorter length one were chosen, would be a treat to many fans. As said though, both would work very well, so it's all up to Bachmann. Perhaps what people prefer below this post can make an influence too...
i agree with all of you about the first three models being redone.
Sparks, You a Genius, Bachmann should also do the The Spiteful Brake Van as well
i agree with that make the spiteful brake van :) :) :) :)
I think its a splendid idea, but the Spiteful Brake Van just isn't that well known. In the TV series he was just recognized as a short lived annoying brake van.
If we want to compare him to Scruffy, he had a name to live up to in the series, and showed as a more symbolic conflict with Oliver.
Well, Scruffy was made even though Oliver blew him to pieces and he comitted suicide a few seasons later. Am I right? :D
bachmann should make oliver and toad too go along with s.c. ruffy :)
Quote from: James The Red Engine on June 10, 2009, 06:18:39 PM
Well, Scruffy was made even though Oliver blew him to pieces and he comitted suicide a few seasons later. Am I right? :D
Hmmmm.... maybe, In that episode, it did have Scruffy's face. Suicide??? Well it looked like they did not know and Percy pushed them to hard because they needed a good push. So suicide is to me a 98%no. I used to watch this episode a lot and was lots of fun to watch. Also if you watch the episode, when they are in the mines(cars on the loose) You could tell that Percy will not fit. Probably not even Bill or Ben!!! So story line: Percy is working at a quarryish area, a foreman asks Percy to push some cars into a mine. Percy backs up to the barrier wall and races for the cars. Then Percy bumps them and they go through the mine way to fast! the cars go faster and faster until they Hit a barrier holding the place up. Then dirt starts to fall. Then a person yells "the mine's collapsing!" Percy runs backwards and watches the tracks crumble. Then his driver thinks the barrier wall will save them but he was wrong. They did not know Percy was under the mess and then they started to clear the mess and found Percy! I could not find the episode. :(
it's the episode (if i'm right) put upon percy. :) :)
Quote from: shining time on June 12, 2009, 08:53:46 PM
it's the episode (if i'm right) put upon percy. :) :)
That's the one! :) I found it!!!! :o ;D ;D ;D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZ7w4L0Vn20&feature=related
Sparks, I don't mean to be rude but your images aren't showing.
Quote from: ZeldaTheSwordsman on June 12, 2009, 11:06:21 PM
Sparks, I don't mean to be rude but your images aren't showing.
I noticed that too 2 days ago but thought keep quiet about it....
Was tidying up my Photobucket, sorry. :P
i thought i was right on the episode thanks jettrainfan
Reposting here so it doesn't get lost in the Wishlist Topic
Donald and Douglas the Twin Engines
(http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/ttte/images/thumb/a/a4/DonaldDouglas.png/250px-DonaldDouglas.png)
Here we see the pair of twins sitting together idly at Brendam Docks yards.
So lets cut down to it, why should Bachmann make Donald and Douglas next? First let me cut off the question of "What about those engine retoolings you said?" The engine retooling suggestions were never said to be of any date. However I would not be surprised if they were done for 10 Years of Bachmann, 65 Years of Thomas or whatever reason. Now then, back to Donald and Douglas...
These are a popular pair of engines among nostalgic fans and newer fans alike, and been around since Season 2. But why do them next instead of say Duck, or a more recent character like Rosie? Well, we did just have Emily, Spencer and Salty recently, so maybe we should go back the the pre HiT/Gullane era. As for Duck though, well, you'll read why Donald and Douglas will be more favorable engines.
In recent years, Donald and Douglas have been heard of less, but recently returned in episodes like "Saved You," and "Gordon and the Engineer." But they've also been in many of the episodes re-released on DVD from VHS tapes, and their Season 6 and 7 episodes "Twin Trouble" and "Bad Day at Castle Loch."
(http://www.thomasandfriends.com/usa/images/trains/donald.jpg)
So, lets look now at what makes these two engines profitable.
1). Bachmann would save money in developing two engines, for the price of a bit more than one: Donald and Douglas are twin engines, with MINOR differences. Basically all that Bachmann would do is make Donald, take the model and make a second pair, change the face to Douglas' face, change the paint work to sport Douglas' nameplate and "10" on his tender, and you have two engines! Quicker profit!
2). They're recognized by the youth and are pretty popular engines among Thomas fans in general. Hornby hasn't beaten Bachmann to making Donald and Douglas either, so Bachmann has the entire market for the UK (and Australian?) market who buys from Ebay and other websites that ship oversea.
3). Donald and Douglas are based on the 812 Class, which has been shown to be recognized among real modelers. People who would want a RTR Caledonian 812 Class could cheaply buy Donald and or Douglas, do some detailing up and modifications, and have their engine in no time!
4). To anyone wondering why I didn't say Bill and Ben...
Bill and Ben are smaller engines, so developing a working chassis for them with their small size, and getting them to pull a heavy load would be a bit more frustrating than making an easy 0-6-0 Chassis for Donald and Douglas.
5. Speaking of Chassis, Donald and Douglas' chassis could in fact be REUSED for another engine, Duck the Great Western Engine. In the TV Series, the three engines seem to appear to use the same Chassis, right down to drive wheel size, space, and all. I wouldn't be surprised at all if right after Donald and Douglas were made, Duck was announced and used the same chassis. That's an even better money saver! Just reuse the chassis and make the body for Duck.
Conclusion:
With the economy in a money crunch right now, Donald and Douglas would be a fairly good pair of engines to make. It's almost a shortcut for the company to make and sell more engines at a cheaper price! These twin engines provide large opportunities for the market ahead of them, take the advantage! They even provide development advantages for the two of them, and plans for Duck. Why avoid that? ;)
Instead of posting my response in both threads, I'll stick with posting in this one only. :P
Anyways, regarding Donald and Douglas being made. I now can see them coming out before Duck and Diesel for the reasons Sparks had just said. It would be great to see them especially because Hornby hasn't (Most likely never) will make Donald and Douglas models for their range. Let's hope that Bachmann can turn this around and add the twins to the range. Duck could be added with them if they are announced, but if not my hopes will be high for the year after that. Along with Diesel too, because hey if they would be making Duck why not add Diesel with him? :P But onto the subject of Donald and Douglas, I strongly support this happening, but this leaves me thinking if they are going to be made, are the name plates gonna be in the middle of the boiler like in S3-Beyond or how they were originally placed in Season 2:
(http://webpages.charter.net/mortickles/images/friends/Donald_Douglas.jpg)
As you can see, I'm all up for originals and I hope they would turn out the way they did in Season 2. If not though, then all the same I will be happy with Donald and Douglas models added to the range.
Maybe they could sell Donald and Douglas together? Just a thought.
Quote from: SmokeyNSteamer on July 02, 2009, 02:39:56 PM
Maybe they could sell Donald and Douglas together? Just a thought.
It'd be too much of a hassle if you only need one engine.
also, it would be cheaper if you could only afford one at a time.
You all have a point---
If the twins were sold together, and one twin broke down, you'd have to buy a duplicate of the other (non-broken) twin as well.
Maybe Bachmann can sell the twins BOTH together and separately...wait, that'd be too expensive...would it?
Quote from: SmokeyNSteamer on July 03, 2009, 01:14:49 AM
You all have a point---
If the twins were sold together, and one twin broke down, you'd have to buy a duplicate of the other (non-broken) twin as well.
Maybe Bachmann can sell the twins BOTH together and separately...wait, that'd be too expensive...would it?
Too much packaging to have them together and separate! They will be sold separately. I think for electric HO/OO trains they won't include two engines together, especially Donald and Douglas. Heck, Hornby didn't even do that will Bill and Ben and Arry and Bert. And those two sets of twins are usually packed together in take along and wooden ranges (Lionel too for Arry and Bert). Never have I seen a Donald and Douglas packaging together.
Quote from: Sparks on July 01, 2009, 10:44:17 PM
1). Bachmann would save money in developing two engines, for the price of a bit more than one: Donald and Douglas are twin engines, with MINOR differences. Basically all that Bachmann would do is make Donald, take the model and make a second pair, change the face to Douglas' face, change the paint work to sport Douglas' nameplate and "10" on his tender, and you have two engines! Quicker profit!
Well, everyone says that, but I have to agree and disagree with that. Yeah sure, making a totally new engine would cost more than having 2 of pretty much the same parts, and chassis and what not, but they would also have to make double the chassis' for those two engines, and also the wheels, the body, and all that other stuff. So, I'm just saying its very profitable, but you have to spend about double the money for chassis'.
Um, your thinking of something, and I don't think it's clear. It's not two different engines, to the maker, it's one engine with two road numbers. Like a GP40 for GTW available for two different numbers. It's just more paint and having to design the style that might make it cost more. Overall, the body and chassis for both locomotives can still be made at the same factory, and can be interchangeable. You understand what I'm saying? :)
Joshua
*clap clap clap* I like this topic.
EDIT: Sparks had the right idea.
Yeah, I get what you're saying. I don't know what I was thinking :P
Basic reusing of tools.
Quote from: Chaz on July 03, 2009, 02:50:20 AM
Quote from: SmokeyNSteamer on July 03, 2009, 01:14:49 AM
You all have a point---
If the twins were sold together, and one twin broke down, you'd have to buy a duplicate of the other (non-broken) twin as well.
Maybe Bachmann can sell the twins BOTH together and separately...wait, that'd be too expensive...would it?
Heck, Hornby didn't even do that will Bill and Ben and Arry and Bert. And those two sets of twins are usually packed together in take along and wooden ranges (Lionel too for Arry and Bert). Never have I seen a Donald and Douglas packaging together.
You got a point there Chaz old boy. Sure, some of us would like to see the twins sold together, but it would be a pain in the arse to work with and then you got the $ issue there both for the company to package it and for the buyer to purchase it. I myself think they should be sold separate. Now if a set was made, I'd say there would be a good idea, but it's all up to Bachmann Trains what they want to do. :)
i agree with you james the red engine they should be sold separately and together if a set was made
Yet, is it really that hard to save up for both and just pay a little more shipping. If they were sold together, you'd still pay for each engine, maybe a tad more too. It's a great idea to sell them as a set, but I don't think that's much of a working idea unless it was for a train set with a few cars and E-Z Track. Not to mention the DC controller. That might work, other than that, I think separate is a clear choice.
Any arguments?
The set could be called "Donald and Douglas' Big Haul" I'll give Bachmann all rights to use that if they wish, not likely, but just to be sure... ;)
Joshua
that is true but also it would probably be a big set
Yeah, it would. I was thinking about something like Bachmann's E-Z Commander sets, two locomotives and a couple of freight cars. For the Thomas line, minus the E-Z Commander, plus the DC controller. If it is a big set, perhaps a set for each locomotive, which again, doesn't really help the idea of combining them. Also, I'm not sure if that will work out for Bachmann...
Wow, you know, we've laid a lot of facts down, now I'm going to research into the company more, see if this whole idea of new engines really would help them out.
Joshua
I did all this fact and research to give Bachmann themselves a hint. :P
However I wouldn't be surprised if Donald and Douglas were released together in a loop set.
Okay, that makes sense. So I guess it might be a good idea. How about a post from the Admin?
Joshua
I heard that Hornby might make them later this year or even next year, might be fake, the the hornb borad adminitrator ( like the bachmann) said that its very possible. So is that bad or good?
Later.
Bad for us guys who live in the US. If hornby makes them, then we can't get them. They're only available in the UK. Unless you're a big enough moron to shop from Ebay. (DUH, DUH, DUHHHHHH)
Quote from: panniertankboy8751 on July 07, 2009, 03:37:35 PMUnless you're a big enough moron to shop from Ebay. (DUH, DUH, DUHHHHHH)
Explain, because you sound very oblivious. :P
Quote from: panniertankboy8751 on July 07, 2009, 03:37:35 PM
Bad for us guys who live in the US. If hornby makes them, then we can't get them. They're only available in the UK. Unless you're a big enough moron to shop from Ebay. (DUH, DUH, DUHHHHHH)
They could ship them to the US, cost a good amount but possible.
i know of a site that sells hornby thomas. the site is: http://www.jadlamracingmodels.com/
but u do have to pay in english pounds
Or with, you know, Paypal. :P
When I bought my honby thomas from ebay, it's regular price was $40.00, but shipping and handeling was $25.00. So I had to pay $65.00 to bay one hornby engine from ebay. Hay does anyone sells hornby stuff on craigs lists ???
Same here! I paid $20 to ship a older unit i got off eBay. It was the same model as duck. :P Still has work to do on it.
I'd never pay that much... :D Then again, I'd never order anything special for Thomas like you guys love to. I just want one Thomas engine and that's all.
Joshua
Quote from: goldwing on July 08, 2009, 11:53:18 AM
When I bought my honby thomas from ebay, it's regular price was $40.00, but shipping and handeling was $25.00. So I had to pay $65.00 to bay one hornby engine from ebay. Hay does anyone sells hornby stuff on craigs lists ???
You probably bought it from JadlamRacingModels then. :P
Here are some good faces for Thomas if he had interchangeable faces
Where? Did you forget something? :o
Joshua
oops sorry ::) ::) :-[ :-[
here it is
http://img135.imageshack.us/i/2008thomasfaces01finallan3.png/
Much better!
Joshua
OH GOD, MY MISTAKE IS CONTAGIOUS!!! WAAAAA... :o mama.
Thats cool though, but if hronby REALLY does come out with a Donald and Dug, than thats the day I make my reenactment of Thomas Comes to or for (can't remember witch one) Breckfast. But hasn't anyone seen Dans, check it out on his diavent art page:
http://thethomasmodeller.deviantart.com/
Later, mama.
to help you out, its Thomas comes to breakfast.
hope this helps!
yeah your right jettrainfan
Thanks Jet, you rock like a metor that falling into sun shine, or something like that :P
But still, hay what chasis is donald and dug any way. COW, MOOOO. :-X
Later
i guess youtube pays off ;D
Well, bringing the thread up for more discussion, with the recent hype of Duck, Donald and Douglas.
You ever wonder if Bachmann is about to come out with the models? I wonder if that's the other thing Anthony didn't tell us... :o
Joshua
Reposting here so it doesn't get lost in the Wishlist Topic
The Breakdown Train
(http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/5877/5b72d82afb5c0eea1a2cee6.jpg)
The Breakdown Train is pushed into place by Thomas, from Thomas and the Breakdown Train. (c) HiT Entertainment 2010.
So, there has been a lot of rolling stock in popular demand. The most common-place being the Red Coaches, and the Breakdown Train. Chaz covered the Red Coaches, so I'll cover the latter of the two. Thanks goes to him for saving time, and being just as formal with his post.
So, back to the Breakdown Train; what does it bring to the range? Well, up til Season 10, The Breakdown Train was the crane that was traditionally used to clear wrecks off the Sodor Railway. The set made its iconic debut in Thomas and the Breakdown Train. It quickly drew in profit among the popular Thomas ranges such as ERTL, Wooden Railway, and even Hornbys OO Gauge Thomas range (the UK equivalent of Bachmann Thomas). I think it's time for Bachmann to cash in on it as well.
(http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/9743/askjgsdakads.png)
Thomas passes a confused Rocky, from Thomas Puts the Brakes On. (c) HiT Entertainment 2010.
First off, some people would rather Rocky over the Breakdown Train, and I can see why. He's newer, he's cutting edge, and he has prototypical accuracy to boast. HiT has also given him a lot of focus as the "new" breakdown train in recent seasons, possibly to show off his abilities being put to the test in CGI. I like Rocky as much as the next guy, but I don't think he would be best for the Bachmann range. What is it about Rocky that brings him at a disadvantage?
1). He's quite a large set piece. What I mean by this is he consists of three pieces of rolling stock, and put together would give him one of the biggest containers to date. How is this a disadvantage though? I'll get to that.
2). He's very detailed. Rocky, unlike previous Thomas stock, has a lot of fiddly and specific parts to him, even so far as having moving pistons to operate his crane. He's anything but a mold, and may lead to a lot of breakable parts. Considering Bachmanns other merchandise within the range, this would be pretty different.
These two facts combined can lead to a hefty development and retail price. How this compares to the Breakdown Train, I'll get to in a moment.
(http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3014/halloween10.png)
Iron 'Arry and Bert hide cheekily in the Breakdown Trains shadows in Halloween. (c) HiT Entertainment 2010.
Now, what advantages does the Breakdown Train have?
1). It has a history. Season 1-7 episodes are still commonplace among the Thomas franchise (and in some places and or cases, may be more commonplace than later episodes), especially within DVDs. Any child watching them would soon learn about the Breakdown Trains existence, and probably want one.
2). Price advantage. To have a complete Breakdown Train set, you'd need two of the cranes, and then the Works Coach*. This can benefit in various ways; the crane and the flatbed can be sold as one pack (or both separate), and then have the Works Coach sold separately too. This means for customer convenience, they can buy whatever part of the set they want, need, depending on their preference. With Rocky, they'd be stuck with the complete set and with a bigger price tag. This means people might be turned down by the said high price tag. The Breakdown Train being in "pieces," to put it, can attract more customers as it would be a cheaper alternative that can be expanded by customer choice.
3). Every railway needs it's breakdown train, so why not Sodor? Bachmann already released Cranky before, so a crane wouldn't be foreign to the range either.
4). The shape of the Breakdown Train. It has more of a "mold friendly" shape than Rocky, which will be easier on the manufacturing of it. Even the flat beds for it have less detail that needs attention. Basically not much more to say here, as the reasoning is pretty much what it says on the tin can.
The Works Coach
(http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/4363/thomasandthebreakdowntr.jpg)
The Works Coach sits in a siding, from Thomas and the Breakdown Train. (c) HiT Entertainment 2010.
The Works Coach is a piece of rolling stock that is generally, but not always associated with the Breakdown Train. It's what the workmen ride in when a train takes the breakdown train to a crash site. Having this included in the range is optional. I don't have any specific opinion on whether it has any reason to be made or not. It'd be nice to have though, in a novelty way.
Conclusion:
With the ever increasing brand that is Bachmann Thomas & Friends, more and more customers are being drawn to its appeal. Recent classic engines Bill & Ben, and Donald & Douglas are coming out too, so it'd be a nice touch to have the classic Breakdown Train come alongside them later in the years.
This is a suggestion by a customer, so I'm not an expert in the backstage of the industry. I just speak for what I would want, as a customer, in a very formal manner. I also believe that I speak for many others who are faithful to this brand.
Sounds great Sparks, very convincing as always. Glad we could get the voices clear about the pieces of rolling stock that are high in demand. I especially couldn't agree more with the points about Rocky. One broken piece or part on Rocky and no one wins. The breakdown train seems to be a lot more flexible in this case, and needless to say would look a whole lot better on a Sodor layout compared to Rocky.
Excellent Work, you are good at persuasion, I can tell 'ya that.
Besides if you want a Rocky just paint and modify the Hornby Breakdown Train.
I agree 100% with your reasoning, Sparks. Might I add, if it wasn't already in the post you had, that with the Breakdown Train being sold in different parts would add up profits comparable to that of Rocky by himself. If someone, such as I, were to buy the Breakdown Train items, I wouldn't having a problem buying two sets of the crane and flat wagon and one works unit coach, and it would add up.
If I were to be making decisions in Bachmann Industries, I would be bought on the idea of the Breakdown Crane and Flat Car as an item, and then
maybe even the Works Unit Coach as well.
Quote from: PasqualeCS96 on December 05, 2010, 08:46:09 AM
Besides if you want a Rocky just paint and modify the Hornby Breakdown Train.
If I'm correct with my assumption, you'd need a lot of plasticard.
Cheers to All
P.S. Let our wishes be greatly considered by whom it may concern.
Quote from: goldwing on May 05, 2009, 04:22:08 PM
Hay, long time no post.
Well wanted to point out about one thing for the james, thomas, and percy moldels. One thing (for all actaully) is that the eyes paint scratches off easly, thus having an odd thomas moldel, why my broken percy has now one painted eye and one made w/ a sharpy. I say the should put a plastic coating over it to prevent that. Another thing was that front couplers are a great idea seeing that even little kids want to pull the trains backwards, the all would need a front coupler. But also they should work on the troublesome trucks. For one they are black int the series, but bushman's are a plastic gray, and then the wheels are too big, and not show accurate, pulse the wheels have some kind of "steps" in the sides. And even Toby's face isn't TV accurate. I just hope they don't go for the CGI image faces instead, that wouldn't be good :(. Aw well lets just wait and see what will happen.
but they are gray.
Quote from: Sparks on July 01, 2009, 10:44:17 PM
Reposting here so it doesn't get lost in the Wishlist Topic
Donald and Douglas the Twin Engines
(http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/ttte/images/thumb/a/a4/DonaldDouglas.png/250px-DonaldDouglas.png)
Here we see the pair of twins sitting together idly at Brendam Docks yards.
So lets cut down to it, why should Bachmann make Donald and Douglas next? First let me cut off the question of "What about those engine retoolings you said?" The engine retooling suggestions were never said to be of any date. However I would not be surprised if they were done for 10 Years of Bachmann, 65 Years of Thomas or whatever reason. Now then, back to Donald and Douglas...
These are a popular pair of engines among nostalgic fans and newer fans alike, and been around since Season 2. But why do them next instead of say Duck, or a more recent character like Rosie? Well, we did just have Emily, Spencer and Salty recently, so maybe we should go back the the pre HiT/Gullane era. As for Duck though, well, you'll read why Donald and Douglas will be more favorable engines.
In recent years, Donald and Douglas have been heard of less, but recently returned in episodes like "Saved You," and "Gordon and the Engineer." But they've also been in many of the episodes re-released on DVD from VHS tapes, and their Season 6 and 7 episodes "Twin Trouble" and "Bad Day at Castle Loch."
(http://www.thomasandfriends.com/usa/images/trains/donald.jpg)
So, lets look now at what makes these two engines profitable.
1). Bachmann would save money in developing two engines, for the price of a bit more than one: Donald and Douglas are twin engines, with MINOR differences. Basically all that Bachmann would do is make Donald, take the model and make a second pair, change the face to Douglas' face, change the paint work to sport Douglas' nameplate and "10" on his tender, and you have two engines! Quicker profit!
2). They're recognized by the youth and are pretty popular engines among Thomas fans in general. Hornby hasn't beaten Bachmann to making Donald and Douglas either, so Bachmann has the entire market for the UK (and Australian?) market who buys from Ebay and other websites that ship oversea.
3). Donald and Douglas are based on the 812 Class, which has been shown to be recognized among real modelers. People who would want a RTR Caledonian 812 Class could cheaply buy Donald and or Douglas, do some detailing up and modifications, and have their engine in no time!
4). To anyone wondering why I didn't say Bill and Ben...
Bill and Ben are smaller engines, so developing a working chassis for them with their small size, and getting them to pull a heavy load would be a bit more frustrating than making an easy 0-6-0 Chassis for Donald and Douglas.
5. Speaking of Chassis, Donald and Douglas' chassis could in fact be REUSED for another engine, Duck the Great Western Engine. In the TV Series, the three engines seem to appear to use the same Chassis, right down to drive wheel size, space, and all. I wouldn't be surprised at all if right after Donald and Douglas were made, Duck was announced and used the same chassis. That's an even better money saver! Just reuse the chassis and make the body for Duck.
Conclusion:
With the economy in a money crunch right now, Donald and Douglas would be a fairly good pair of engines to make. It's almost a shortcut for the company to make and sell more engines at a cheaper price! These twin engines provide large opportunities for the market ahead of them, take the advantage! They even provide development advantages for the two of them, and plans for Duck. Why avoid that? ;)
hornby tock over australia, unfortnatley.
Quote from: branmas on December 11, 2010, 09:53:32 PM
Quote from: goldwing on May 05, 2009, 04:22:08 PM
Hay, long time no post.
Well wanted to point out about one thing for the james, thomas, and percy moldels. One thing (for all actaully) is that the eyes paint scratches off easly, thus having an odd thomas moldel, why my broken percy has now one painted eye and one made w/ a sharpy. I say the should put a plastic coating over it to prevent that. Another thing was that front couplers are a great idea seeing that even little kids want to pull the trains backwards, the all would need a front coupler. But also they should work on the troublesome trucks. For one they are black int the series, but bushman's are a plastic gray, and then the wheels are too big, and not show accurate, pulse the wheels have some kind of "steps" in the sides. And even Toby's face isn't TV accurate. I just hope they don't go for the CGI image faces instead, that wouldn't be good :(. Aw well lets just wait and see what will happen.
but they are gray.
so you mean in that one episode?
I'm just gonna throw this out there: you can edit your posts so that there isn't a triple posts. Use the "modify" button.
_________________________________________________________________________________________
Quote from: branmas on December 11, 2010, 10:14:50 PM
Quote from: Sparks on July 01, 2009, 10:44:17 PM
2). They're recognized by the youth and are pretty popular engines among Thomas fans in general. Hornby hasn't beaten Bachmann to making Donald and Douglas either, so Bachmann has the entire market for the UK (and Australian?) market who buys from Ebay and other websites that ship oversea.
hornby tock over australia, unfortnatley.
It isn't possible that Hornby took over the Australian market in terms of distributing Donald and Douglas models because
they haven't even been created yet. If Bachmann were to make the twins sooner than later, which is probably the case for the upcoming year, they would be unbeatable in the marketing and distribution of the Scottish Twins.
_______________________________________________________________________________
Quote from: goldwing on May 05, 2009, 04:22:08 PM
Well wanted to point out about one thing for the james, thomas, and percy moldels. One thing (for all actaully) is that the eyes paint scratches off easly, thus having an odd thomas moldel, why my broken percy has now one painted eye and one made w/ a sharpy. I say the should put a plastic coating over it to prevent that. Another thing was that front couplers are a great idea seeing that even little kids want to pull the trains backwards, the all would need a front coupler. But also they should work on the troublesome trucks. For one they are black int the series, but bushman's are a plastic gray, and then the wheels are too big, and not show accurate, pulse the wheels have some kind of "steps" in the sides. And even Toby's face isn't TV accurate. I just hope they don't go for the CGI image faces instead, that wouldn't be good :(. Aw well lets just wait and see what will happen.
For the eyes of the models: I am really curious as to how you were able to scratch away the eyes of a model with the face on. Were you poking at them with a toothpick or something (for no reason I might add)?
About the troublesome trucks:
A) They aren't black, they are a dark gray in color.
B) The wheels are to scale (at least from my views).
C) There are no steps on the trucks (to my knowledge).
The only thing that could ever consider the reason to fix the troublesome truck models is to darken the gray color.
One last thing to note: Bachmann Toby's face is in fact close to TV accuracy:
(http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091124214537/ttte/images/thumb/a/aa/TobyandtheStoutGentleman3.jpg/185px-TobyandtheStoutGentleman3.jpg)
vs.
(http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091221201505/ttte/images/thumb/4/46/TobyBachmann.jpg/185px-TobyBachmann.jpg)
These images are of the property of Thomas the Tank Engine Wikia.
If anything, out of all you said, the couplers could be a good possibilty, but Percy needs a rear coupling
hook before anything happens. That is just not acceptable.
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Cheers
PPercy
Quote from: PerfectPercy on December 19, 2010, 01:08:44 AM
I'm just gonna throw this out there: you can edit your posts so that there isn't a triple posts. Use the "modify" button.
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Quote from: branmas on December 11, 2010, 10:14:50 PM
Quote from: Sparks on July 01, 2009, 10:44:17 PM
2). They're recognized by the youth and are pretty popular engines among Thomas fans in general. Hornby hasn't beaten Bachmann to making Donald and Douglas either, so Bachmann has the entire market for the UK (and Australian?) market who buys from Ebay and other websites that ship oversea.
hornby tock over Australia, unfortunately.
It isn't possible that Hornby took over the Australian market in terms of distributing Donald and Douglas models because they haven't even been created yet. If Bachmann were to make the twins sooner than later, which is probably the case for the upcoming year, they would be unbeatable in the marketing and distribution of the Scottish Twins.
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Quote from: goldwing on May 05, 2009, 04:22:08 PM
Well wanted to point out about one thing for the James, thomas, and Percy models. One thing (for all actually) is that the eyes paint scratches off easly, thus having an odd thomas model, why my broken Percy has now one painted eye and one made w/ a sharpy. I say the should put a plastic coating over it to prevent that. Another thing was that front couplers are a great idea seeing that even little kids want to pull the trains backwards, the all would need a front coupler. But also they should work on the troublesome trucks. For one they are black int the series, but bushman's are a plastic gray, and then the wheels are too big, and not show accurate, pulse the wheels have some kind of "steps" in the sides. And even Toby's face isn't TV accurate. I just hope they don't go for the CGI image faces instead, that wouldn't be good :(. Aw well lets just wait and see what will happen.
For the eyes of the models: I am really curious as to how you were able to scratch away the eyes of a model with the face on. Were you poking at them with a toothpick or something (for no reason I might add)?
About the troublesome trucks:
A) They aren't black, they are a dark gray in color.
B) The wheels are to scale (at least from my views).
C) There are no steps on the trucks (to my knowledge).
The only thing that could ever consider the reason to fix the troublesome truck models is to darken the gray color.
One last thing to note: Bachmann Toby's face is in fact close to TV accuracy:
(http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091124214537/ttte/images/thumb/a/aa/TobyandtheStoutGentleman3.jpg/185px-TobyandtheStoutGentleman3.jpg)
vs.
(http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091221201505/ttte/images/thumb/4/46/TobyBachmann.jpg/185px-TobyBachmann.jpg)
These images are of the property of Thomas the Tank Engine Wikia.
If anything, out of all you said, the couplers could be a good possibilty, but Percy needs a rear coupling hook before anything happens. That is just not acceptable.
_____________________________________________________
Cheers
PPercy
what i mean is there is no such thing as a store that sells bachmann stuff but is such thing as a store that sells hornby stuff in Australia( the reason i know this stuff is because i live in Australia).
Quote from: PerfectPercy on December 19, 2010, 01:08:44 AM
I'm just gonna throw this out there: you can edit your posts so that there isn't a triple posts. Use the "modify" button.
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Quote from: branmas on December 11, 2010, 10:14:50 PM
Quote from: Sparks on July 01, 2009, 10:44:17 PM
2). They're recognized by the youth and are pretty popular engines among Thomas fans in general. Hornby hasn't beaten Bachmann to making Donald and Douglas either, so Bachmann has the entire market for the UK (and Australian?) market who buys from Ebay and other websites that ship oversea.
hornby tock over Australia, unfortunately.
It isn't possible that Hornby took over the Australian market in terms of distributing Donald and Douglas models because they haven't even been created yet. If Bachmann were to make the twins sooner than later, which is probably the case for the upcoming year, they would be unbeatable in the marketing and distribution of the Scottish Twins.
I'm only 9, so i don't know what that means!
[move][move][move][move][move][move][move]
[/move][/move][/move][/move][/move][/move][/move] ::) :P ???
Quote from: Sparks on December 05, 2010, 04:12:43 AM
(http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/9743/askjgsdakads.png)
Thomas passes a confused Rocky, from Thomas Puts the Brakes On. (c) HiT Entertainment 2010.
First off, some people would rather Rocky over the Breakdown Train, and I can see why. He's newer, he's cutting edge, and he has prototypical accuracy to boast. HiT has also given him a lot of focus as the "new" breakdown train in recent seasons, possibly to show off his abilities being put to the test in CGI. I like Rocky as much as the next guy, but I don't think he would be best for the Bachmann range. What is it about Rocky that brings him at a disadvantage?
1). He's quite a large set piece. What I mean by this is he consists of three pieces of rolling stock, and put together would give him one of the biggest containers to date. How is this a disadvantage though? I'll get to that.
2). He's very detailed. Rocky, unlike previous Thomas stock, has a lot of fiddly and specific parts to him, even so far as having moving pistons to operate his crane. He's anything but a mold, and may lead to a lot of breakable parts. Considering Bachmanns other merchandise within the range, this would be pretty different.
These two facts combined can lead to a hefty development and retail price. How this compares to the Breakdown Train, I'll get to in a moment.
(http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3014/halloween10.png)
Iron 'Arry and Bert hide cheekily in the Breakdown Trains shadows in Halloween. (c) HiT Entertainment 2010.
Now, what advantages does the Breakdown Train have?
1). It has a history. Season 1-7 episodes are still commonplace among the Thomas franchise (and in some places and or cases, may be more commonplace than later episodes), especially within DVDs. Any child watching them would soon learn about the Breakdown Trains existence, and probably want one.
2). Price advantage. To have a complete Breakdown Train set, you'd need two of the cranes, and then the Works Coach*. This can benefit in various ways; the crane and the flatbed can be sold as one pack (or both separate), and then have the Works Coach sold separately too. This means for customer convenience, they can buy whatever part of the set they want, need, depending on their preference. With Rocky, they'd be stuck with the complete set and with a bigger price tag. This means people might be turned down by the said high price tag. The Breakdown Train being in "pieces," to put it, can attract more customers as it would be a cheaper alternative that can be expanded by customer choice.
3). Every railway needs it's breakdown train, so why not Sodor? Bachmann already released Cranky before, so a crane wouldn't be foreign to the range either.
4). The shape of the Breakdown Train. It has more of a "mold friendly" shape than Rocky, which will be easier on the manufacturing of it. Even the flat beds for it have less detail that needs attention. Basically not much more to say here, as the reasoning is pretty much what it says on the tin can.
The Works Coach
(http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/4363/thomasandthebreakdowntr.jpg)
The Works Coach sits in a siding, from Thomas and the Breakdown Train. (c) HiT Entertainment 2010.
The Works Coach is a piece of rolling stock that is generally, but not always associated with the Breakdown Train. It's what the workmen ride in when a train takes the breakdown train to a crash site. Having this included in the range is optional. I don't have any specific opinion on whether it has any reason to be made or not. It'd be nice to have though, in a novelty way.
Conclusion:
With the ever increasing brand that is Bachmann Thomas & Friends, more and more customers are being drawn to its appeal. Recent classic engines Bill & Ben, and Donald & Douglas are coming out too, so it'd be a nice touch to have the classic Breakdown Train come alongside them later in the years.
This is a suggestion by a customer, so I'm not an expert in the backstage of the industry. I just speak for what I would want, as a customer, in a very formal manner. I also believe that I speak for many others who are faithful to this brand.
i perfer the brakedown train
there all cool ;) ;D
Quote from: thomas' #1 fan on December 19, 2010, 02:25:13 AM
Quote from: PerfectPercy on December 19, 2010, 01:08:44 AM
I'm just gonna throw this out there: you can edit your posts so that there isn't a triple posts. Use the "modify" button.
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Quote from: branmas on December 11, 2010, 10:14:50 PM
Quote from: Sparks on July 01, 2009, 10:44:17 PM
2). They're recognized by the youth and are pretty popular engines among Thomas fans in general. Hornby hasn't beaten Bachmann to making Donald and Douglas either, so Bachmann has the entire market for the UK (and Australian?) market who buys from Ebay and other websites that ship oversea.
hornby tock over Australia, unfortunately.
It isn't possible that Hornby took over the Australian market in terms of distributing Donald and Douglas models because they haven't even been created yet. If Bachmann were to make the twins sooner than later, which is probably the case for the upcoming year, they would be unbeatable in the marketing and distribution of the Scottish Twins.
I'm only 9, so i don't know what that means!
[move][move][move][move][move][move][move]
[/move][/move][/move][/move][/move][/move][/move] ::) :P ???
Again with the posting 3 times in a row when you can make it one post... but anyways:
Donald and Douglas haven't been created by any modelling company yet, so if Bachmann creates them first, then they have a chance to be the main sellers of Donald and Douglas.
my thomas looks pretty much like the improved one you showed, only it looks its got a lazy eye. :(
I agree on the weight part, kinda... I mean, I liked how I used Thomas as a back engine to help Edward up a hill in my latest YouTube video - and Edward couldn't actually get up my hill while hauling 2 trucks, a wagon and a brake van.
If they make the engines too heavy (powerful), you won't be able to do fun stuff like that - PLUS even in the original TV show - they used wire to haul the engines up Gordon's hill - even when they weren't pulling a train (Percy running backwards away from Gordon has wire attached to his back to make sure he didn't slip during filming.
The one thing I agree with totally are the faces. I know that the licensor has full control over what is produced, but I would really love to see the faces look more like the ones from the original series (original 2 or the more recent ones - before CG).
Also, more interchangeable faces (different emotions for each engines) would be awesome!
The opposite is actually true; if an engine is too light, it can't haul a decent load.
Quote from: Sparks on January 07, 2011, 07:13:36 AM
The opposite is actually true; if an engine is too light, it can't haul a decent load.
I know. If I put the most slightest pressure of a finger on them while they're trying to get up a hill, they seem to move more... but I was just testing James out and he couldn't even pull Annie and Clarabel up a very low hill... while Thomas could... :/ I hope my James model isn't stuffed... coz he couldn't even pull one composite coach up the same low angle hill...
A good idea is to run your engines in for about an hour backwards and forwards to get them used to running. There's little space in James' cab for liquid weights (and I mean little).
Getting back to the breakdown train, I feel they will announce it for 2011 because they want to make a better one than Hornby. And knowing Bachmann they could make one better.
Quote from: Sparks on January 07, 2011, 07:18:05 AM
A good idea is to run your engines in for about an hour backwards and forwards to get them used to running. There's little space in James' cab for liquid weights (and I mean little).
Liquid, eh? What do you mean by that???
I used lead weights and electrical-taped them together. There is a small space on the top of his motor in the center to put a very very small weight, but in the cab, there is a decent amount of room. I'm almost happy that Bachmann didn't give James a true cab. ::) :P
Quote from: PerfectPercy on January 08, 2011, 09:40:47 PM
Quote from: Sparks on January 07, 2011, 07:18:05 AM
A good idea is to run your engines in for about an hour backwards and forwards to get them used to running. There's little space in James' cab for liquid weights (and I mean little).
Liquid, eh? What do you mean by that???
I used lead weights and electrical-taped them together. There is a small space on the top of his motor in the center to put a very very small weight, but in the cab, there is a decent amount of room. I'm almost happy that Bachmann didn't give James a true cab. ::) :P
Liquid lead. It's sometimes used in models to add to the weight, less common though.
Post moved to new thread
Very well reasoned, cat wait until you "Go West" Hopefully BACHMANN will do the same soon. ;)
What you said about the brakevan being one piece is actually false. I was bored one day so I decided to take apartmy brake van to see if I could make a better chassis, the cab actually does come off, it is snapped into place you can take it out and put it back with no problem. Without the cab it makes a fine flatbed. ;)
That's interesting. The brake van the club had seemed to be one piece (as in the body, not the chassis). I'll have to look into that some more.
Also, thanks Thomasj219. :)
This thread is now being archived.
Reopening this thread, but I will not be retyping my Duck post.
Dear Admins
I would like to know why my Duck thread, along with Simons model review thread, were deleted. It really feels right now that the input we've contributed isn't being valued. I just dunno what else to say right now.
It's stressing to know that formal threads with input, critique, and suggestions for the company are valued below threads about role playing unrelated to the product line.
Quote from: Sparks on July 01, 2009, 10:44:17 PM
Reposting here so it doesn't get lost in the Wishlist Topic
Donald and Douglas the Twin Engines
(http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/ttte/images/thumb/a/a4/DonaldDouglas.png/250px-DonaldDouglas.png)
Here we see the pair of twins sitting together idly at Brendam Docks yards.
So lets cut down to it, why should Bachmann make Donald and Douglas next? First let me cut off the question of "What about those engine retoolings you said?" The engine retooling suggestions were never said to be of any date. However I would not be surprised if they were done for 10 Years of Bachmann, 65 Years of Thomas or whatever reason. Now then, back to Donald and Douglas...
These are a popular pair of engines among nostalgic fans and newer fans alike, and been around since Season 2. But why do them next instead of say Duck, or a more recent character like Rosie? Well, we did just have Emily, Spencer and Salty recently, so maybe we should go back the the pre HiT/Gullane era. As for Duck though, well, you'll read why Donald and Douglas will be more favorable engines.
In recent years, Donald and Douglas have been heard of less, but recently returned in episodes like "Saved You," and "Gordon and the Engineer." But they've also been in many of the episodes re-released on DVD from VHS tapes, and their Season 6 and 7 episodes "Twin Trouble" and "Bad Day at Castle Loch."
(http://www.thomasandfriends.com/usa/images/trains/donald.jpg)
So, lets look now at what makes these two engines profitable.
1). Bachmann would save money in developing two engines, for the price of a bit more than one: Donald and Douglas are twin engines, with MINOR differences. Basically all that Bachmann would do is make Donald, take the model and make a second pair, change the face to Douglas' face, change the paint work to sport Douglas' nameplate and "10" on his tender, and you have two engines! Quicker profit!
2). They're recognized by the youth and are pretty popular engines among Thomas fans in general. Hornby hasn't beaten Bachmann to making Donald and Douglas either, so Bachmann has the entire market for the UK (and Australian?) market who buys from Ebay and other websites that ship oversea.
3). Donald and Douglas are based on the 812 Class, which has been shown to be recognized among real modelers. People who would want a RTR Caledonian 812 Class could cheaply buy Donald and or Douglas, do some detailing up and modifications, and have their engine in no time!
4). To anyone wondering why I didn't say Bill and Ben...
Bill and Ben are smaller engines, so developing a working chassis for them with their small size, and getting them to pull a heavy load would be a bit more frustrating than making an easy 0-6-0 Chassis for Donald and Douglas.
5. Speaking of Chassis, Donald and Douglas' chassis could in fact be REUSED for another engine, Duck the Great Western Engine. In the TV Series, the three engines seem to appear to use the same Chassis, right down to drive wheel size, space, and all. I wouldn't be surprised at all if right after Donald and Douglas were made, Duck was announced and used the same chassis. That's an even better money saver! Just reuse the chassis and make the body for Duck.
Conclusion:
With the economy in a money crunch right now, Donald and Douglas would be a fairly good pair of engines to make. It's almost a shortcut for the company to make and sell more engines at a cheaper price! These twin engines provide large opportunities for the market ahead of them, take the advantage! They even provide development advantages for the two of them, and plans for Duck. Why avoid that? ;)
Your wish has ben granted~ ;D
Quote from: Sparks on August 15, 2011, 11:59:12 PM
Reopening this thread, but I will not be retyping my Duck post.
Dear Admins
I would like to know why my Duck thread, along with Simons model review thread, were deleted.
Well I can tell you why your Duck thread was deleted, but not Simons reveiw thread. Your thread was deleted because of mine and Donald and Douglas fan 98's being stupid and saying how terrible the Hornby Duckk model is.
yah we were being a little fair bit stupid and yyyeeeeeaaahhhh :-[
Bringing this back because this is explained very well.
No it really doesn't
Excuse me? I just thought it was nice how sparks laid out all the improvements that's could be done. Sorry if you didn't agree.
This was a few years ago, why are you bringing back up old threads, it's not needed.
Sorry, you're right. I'll let it drop. My bad.
Bachmann should offer the brake van in different colors!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's funny to look back at these predictions and suggestions that I made from.. geez, almost 7 years ago, and see where the range has gone since then. This thread even pre-dates the CGI series!
The James revision seems to have almost happened, but who knows if it's just a paint correction, or whole new faces.
Thomas, Percy, and James getting new motors seems unlikely for the next foreseeable future. Probably not a bad thing, since Bachmann seems to be better off using those resources on Oliver, Skarloey and Rheneas.
Seems like the brake van finally did get a new design, but for the large scale range. Still have fingers crossed they'll carry those designs to the HO range.
Donald and Douglas also came into the Bachmann range not too long after those predictions.