WHY?

Why? Did I miss something or did I discuss something taboo without knowing it?

Anyway, point remains, in the current catalog or not, if you want a previously listed seperate tender - they are out there.

Sheldon

Some of my recent projects:

First a Bachmann 2-8-4 coverted into a Lima super power 2-8-2 similar to the DT&I 800 series locos:



Second, a 4-8-2 with a hicken tender and Delta trailing truck



And, a 2-6-6-2 with vandy tender and Delta trailing truck



All these need final painting and weathering, the 2-8-2 will be lettered ATLANTIC CENTRAL.

Sheldon

Now that they have been out for a while, I would like your thoughts on the pulling power of the Bachmann 2-8-4's.

How much have you tried to pull?

How steep are your grades?

How do they compare to other Spectrum locos you may have?

Thanks,

Sheldon

For many years now there has been talk of needing to remove the capacitor or capacitors that are across the motor leads of Bachmann locomotives when installing DCC decoders.

Some recent testing with my Aristo Craft Train Enginner throttles, several conventional power packs, and a number of Bachmann spectrum steam locomotives has yielded some interesting results.

Two Spectrum locos in particular have always suffered from a reputation for less than smooth starts and a slightly high slowest speed. The locos in question are the DC versions of the 2-8-0 and 4-6-0.

While they do perform better on the Train Engineer than on conventional power packs, they still did not equal the performance of many other models, by Bachmann and others.

So I got to thinking about why, since the TE output is a pluse widith modulated signal and makes everything run good, why did these two loocs still seem a little balky?

So I cut out the capacitors, and presto! They now run as slow or slower than any other loco I have and start much smoother. And, the improvement was seen on both the Train Engineer throttle and several different MRC power packs I have.

So all these years these Bachmann locos have been hiding their true potential for DC operation. Well, I'm off to the work shop, I have about 20 more tenders to disassemble and caps to clip.

Sheldon

I hope the software people fix this board soon.

Lots of problems as others have mentioned.

Errors when posting, or trying to edit posts.

And, roadnames, listing at the list level, would be nice on the product pages.

Why do computer software engineers always have to "fix" things that where not broken in the first place?

And why can't someone design a product page software that is as easy to use as a paper catalog?

Computers are not "better" than paper at a lot of information tasks, they are just different, with a different set of advantages and disadvantages.

Not impressed with the new site.

Sheldon

As many of you know, I have often supported the idea that control systems for model trains are not one size fits all and that one should carefully consider their needs and wants before investing in expensive/complex control systems.

In addition to my continuing interest in the latest forms of computerized block control, I am now exploreing a new option - radio control.

This was prompted by seeing some others effectively using the Aristo Craft Train Engineer on their HO layouts. The following is the test results I have compiled and posted on the Aristo message board where I have been consulting with other TE users, mostly in large scale.

As promised, here are my test results on the trackside TE with HO scale. This is a bit long, and I will be posting more, but this seemed like  more than enough for now. Questions and comments are welcomed.

For the last several weeks I have been conducting tests with the Aristo Craft Train Engineer, CRE-55470, to determine how best these throttles could be applied to HO scale layouts, in particular my layout that is currently in a rebuilding phase.

First, let me just mention that I am an experienced modeler of 35-40 years and also have a strong electrical and electronics background. And, for a number of reasons I have rejected DCC as not being suitable for my needs on my new layout. This is not a criticism of DCC, for some layouts/modelers it is the perfect answer. But control systems for model trains should weigh all factors, complexity, desired features, style of operation, layout size, cost, maintenance, just to mention a few.

The two factors that ruled out DCC for me are decoder installation in a large fleet of motive power, and complex operational sequences with many small buttons on many/most of the throttles. Other negative factors include programming locos and complex wiring infrastructure for a large layout - not the magical two wires touted in the early days of DCC. I have always felt that for all that wiring infrastructure, I could “build in” more features with other systems, not have deal with features I don't need/want, and avoid the need for decoders.

Rigid thinking by many established in the hobby and active in the model press has lead to some assumptions by many that are not necessarily true. I have paid great attention over the years to different control system approaches and found that many alternative systems work quite well, again depending on your goals.

My Train Engineer Tests:

Locomotive performance - I tested a wide range of brands and types of both steam and diesel locos on both the linear and PWC settings. I was very pleased with the slow speed performance on both settings. The PWC setting does provide smoother start up at slower speeds and did allow slower steady speed operation. The PWC setting also greatly enhanced the performance of all constant lighting circuits. With the PWC setting, the headlights almost always cam on at full brightness before the loco moved. No over heating or damage was experienced on the PWC setting.

One anomaly that was found, locos with inexpensive built in decoders (like the Bachmann GE 70 tonner) did not perform well on either setting. Locos of this type are not great performers on analog anyway, but with TE they are worse.

I did not test the TE with any analog sound equipped locos (like the new BLI Blueline) and I tested only one DCC/DC sound equipped loco (BLI N&W class A), since it is the only DCC/DC sound equipped loco I own. The Class A actually preformed about the same as it does on any regular DC power pack, which is really only mediocre in my opinion because of the high starting voltage of those sound decoders in analog mode. It was slightly better on the analog setting, but differences where very slight. The basic sound system worked normally, but I was completely unable to access the horn and bell functions. So, if the Class A is typical, the TE, even in PWC mode, will run/work with high quality dual mode sound decoders. The next step would be to test some of the accessory sound controllers with the TE for whistle/bell control. Since I do not like or use sound in HO so for me it is not an issue.

Section Control w/multiple receivers - Back in the dark ages of model trains, early attempts to run more than one train on a connected system of track often used a simple system of simply dividing the layout into different sections (not really blocks, think zones or groups of blocks) and putting a separate power supply on each section. For more detail on this and a modern look at it, go to www.aglasshalffull.org/article-multi-throttle.html and read more.

So the question was, will the TE work in this system, what are the problems, pit falls, etc. This would require a train to move from receiver to receiver. What would be the operational and electrical implications of this and will it work? The advantage of such a system would be VERY simple layout wiring.

The answer is yes and no. On the linear setting it was easily possible to go from receiver to receiver with no problems. Simple diode circuits where wired up with pilot lights for easy reference as to the direction setting of the receivers, and bulb intensity helped with matching speed settings. Also, newer TE receivers with the fixed response to the direction button are much better for this type of operation.

On PWC, the story is not as good. It seems that no matter what, the motors in the locos want to add the two sets of pluses together during the time the loco is picking up from both receivers, causing a very unpleasant surge in speed. No amount of voltage matching or system phasing had any improving effect, including the risky use of a common power supply.

So, with PWC, moving from one receiver to another is not a practical approach. And, while it worked in the linear mode, matching the speeds was somewhat harder than I had hoped. So I have ruled out simple section control with the TE.

Modified Cab Control - Many years ago (1960’s & 70’s) a modeler by the name of Ed Ravenscroft combined section control, cab control and power routing trackage (sometimes called X sections) to create a versatile form of cab control that required 1/3 or fewer block toggles than cab control and allowed the layout to be operated in several different ways, namely in a local/walk around fashion or from a main “dispatchers” panel. His system is outlined in a series of articles that appeared in several issues of Model Railroader during 1974.

While TE will not work with Ed’s exact wiring approach, the implementation of his system or a conventional cab control system should be no problem. It will require switching both wires of the cab power (no common rail wiring or “grounded” systems), and rotary switches that short out other positions should be avoided, but there are endless simple solutions to these issues.

In such an application the TE will have the advantage of being wireless and any transmitter can instantly become any free cab (by using the ten channels as the cab assignments). Several simple systems of local cab assignment instantly come to mind, such as coded plugs or push button controlled relays that could be controlled at various locations around the layout rather than one fixed control panel.

Power Supplies/short circuits - At HO scale (or N scale) current levels the TE needs no more than a 3 amp fuse and a good 3 amp/13.8 volt regulated power supply. I found those sold for CB radio operation to be quite effective. Separate power supplies for each receiver and the 3 amp fusing made it seemingly impossible to damage a receiver or a loco. And while I did not try to damage anything, I did have several fuse blowing events. I do intend to install the cooling fans even at these lower current levels. A cool electron is a happy electron!

User Friendly? - I found the TE to be very user friendly. This is an important factor to me. I easily became able to operate the transmitter without looking at it and was able to quickly get a good feel for any loco and control it with great precision for switching, coupling, etc. This was especially true on the PWC setting.

Features - I had the opportunity to test both the older and newer transmitters. The older one was the first series of the 10 channel type. The direction recall was unresponsive at times but was obviously useful for the applications I was testing. The speed recall was useless at the voltages/speeds of HO scale. At most speeds of normal operation little or no change and only one, two or sometimes three lights lit, giving no useful indication of speed. The on/off and all stop features of the new transmitter are much more useful.

I also had both older and newer receivers. The older ones responded to any direction button in a flip flop manner. Not good for small scales. I was quite pleased to find the new ones have returned to the absolute left/right design that was, from what I understand, on the original TE. This is very desirable for small scales no matter what type of control system is used, blocks, sections, zones, etc. I understand that some in the large scale crowd prefer the flip/flop arrangement - this just goes to show the big differences between running trains on “bench work” vs. in the back yard. 

Conclusion - Given the other wireless choices for model train control, their costs and complexity, the TE offers tremendous value for the price. Combined with other conventional wiring systems I see great potential to rival the operational features of DCC and maybe even exceeding them in some ways. Lower cost, no loco modifications (or expensive decode equipped locos) and good wireless reliability are all pluses in my book. I am now planning the exact details of how I will implement the TE.

It is obvious that good design and constant improvement has made the TE a very effective control system. The publishing of more info on its use should help expand its use. Much to my amazement (or maybe not) there is little to nothing published about using the TE in smaller scales - maybe I can help change that.

More latter as I decide exactly how to impliment my control system.

Sheldon 

       

I hope the Bach Man doesn't mind, since they don't have a wireless throttle of any kind.

Who is using Aristo's Train Engineer, in any scale/guage?

How do you like it?

Any problems?

How many units do you own?

How big is the layout you use it on?

Thanks for your thoughts.

Sheldon

I am very interested in several of the new offerings comming up and have a few questions/comments. They are:

Please offer the Peter Witt trolley undecorated.

Which boiler style/sand dome location will the unlettered 2-8-4 be? Any chance we can get both versions unlettered?

There seems to be some confusion as to which line the 2-8-4 will be in, Spectrum or Regular. Which is it? This matters little based on the pictures but advance advertising by dealers/press release reports seem conflicting.


And while I'm here, a few other questions:

Any hope for some real parts support - I sure hope so? Still could use those extra delta trailing trucks.

Could the next batch of GE 44 tonner's include a rerun of the red unlettered version? I would like a couple more to go with my two new red 70 tonner's.

Thanks again for all the great quality at great prices. I just picked up two more 2-8-0's this past week. Bachmann dominates my steam fleet by more than two to one against all others combined. Still hoping for a non PRR Pacific and a modern 10 wheeler to round things out.

Sheldon

A while back I asked the Bach Man if the new standard line 70 ton switcher ws in fact the same loco as the older spectrum version. He indicated that is was, and indicated that it was being released as a standard line loco because spectrum line products now have even higher standards.

I finally got around to picking up a couple of these little jewels yesterday. What a great product and great value. The going rate seems to be about $35, which is what I paid. They look and run great, have decoders for you DCC guys, and, except for maybe cab interior, how much more detail could be placed on such a simple machine in 1/87 scale?

If this is any indication of the future, than Bachmann standard line may well be a product more seriously considered by more discriminating modelers who previously bypassed it completely. This may in fact be true of the newly announced 2-8-4. While it is not a loco I have any interest in personaly, the pictures do look good. If it runs as good as a Spectrum, it should be a big hit, dispite the duplication factor.

Thanks again Bachmann for such great products at great prices.

Sheldon

Who can tell me what color scheme or schemes would have been seen on C&O cabooses in 1953/54?

Sheldon

As a follow up to my previous post on layout design, I have a new question.

What kind of turnout control do you use? Manual? Electric remote? Ground throws? Mechanical? Some of all/each? Central control locations? Along the layout edge? 

If you use DCC, do you use stationary decoders to control turnouts?

And most importantly, why do you use what you use? Are you happy with it? And, what if anything would you do different in the future?

When we have a few responses, I will share my thoughts and my choices.

This is truly a topic with no wrong answers or choices, but rather depends heavily on the style and goals of your layout as to which will work best.

Sheldon

Does anyone know if the new DCC equiped locos are wired the same as the DC locos?

Example: If I take the tender from a DC 2-8-0 and put it behind a DCC 2-8-0 in place of the DCC tender, will the loco and all lighting work?

Sheldon

I have designed a number of layouts for fellow modelers and am working on another right now.

I am interested in knowing the following about anyones layout.

Who has multi decks?
How high is each deck?
How deep are your scenes?
Do you use a helix or work your way up/down the room?
Do you use staging?
Is your staging hidden or visable?
Is your mainline single or double track?
Do you model a prototype or freelance?
Do you model a specific era?
Is your layout continuous or point to point?
How big (square feet) is you layout room/space?

Feel free to answer as many or as few of these questions as interest you.

Thanks

Sheldon

Dear Bach Man,

Any chance of getting some of those delta trailing trucks that are now being supplied extra in the newest runs of the Heavy Mountain.

I'm sure they would sell well. I would take at least 6, I know steamgene wants some.

I'll bet half the people who have bought Mountains and 2-6-6-2's would buy them to upgrade their locos.

This is another example of the need for a real parts department.

Sheldon