guide

[whatsamatteru]

hi everyone, i have been in the card collecting rhelm for years and there is a price guide called beckett.  is it not by far the be all of prices but it does give you some aspect of the price of a card so at least you know the neighborhood.

is there something like that with trains.  there are so many products out there.   new and old.

thanks

[Woody Elmore]

There are Greenberg Guides for things like Lionel, American Flyer and brass models. I doubt that there is a guide for HO trains - there have been many manufacturers over the years. Companies like Varney and Mantua/Tyco produced huge amounts of HO trains.

As for pricing, some trains, like Lionel, have many collectors and an organization like the TCA (Train Collector's Association) helps with pricing guides.

Some HO trains are collectible but often the old stuff from 20 to 30 years ago are worth only what someone will pay for them.

[ebtnut]

There has been the Brown Book in several editions that listed prices for brass import locos in HO.  A newer book (title escapes me at the moment) has recently been advertised in the model RR press.  In general, only the brass market has had any kind of consistent rise in values over time.  Let's face it, value is generally equated with rarity, and most models have been made by the thousands, if not tens of thousands.  Take a look at the prices people ask for stuff at train shows. 

[RAM]

get on ebay and if you find something you have, click on to watch.  That way you can tell what they are selling for.

[whatsamatteru]

well did some research today.  one is i only do o.  ho is worth nothing.  but i think ebay is killing the dealers.  i went to 4 hobby shops today and asked if they would bring the prices down at all.  they all came down but not much at all.  but they were still40-100 dollars off of ebay.

[jward]

the problem is, many ebay sellers have little or no overhead. they have no store, no rent, lights, etc.

the local hobby shop may be higher in price, but will often special order items you can't get on ebay. remember that.

my hobby shop that will order me whatever i need, i try to give most of my hobby money. he does me no good if he's out of business.

[whatsamatteru]

yea, believe me i am not a great supporter of ebay.  but there is not much in the card world or the train world that i see so far that you cant get there.  hopefully they dont run em out of business.  a lot of card shops haveclosed up and just selling on ebay themselves or doing the shows.

[mf5117]

i like what you said j ward , keep it alive keep the local hobby shop alive , i go to them 1st even if i look online .

[jward]

don
i'll tell you what you won't find on ebay.
you are new to the hobby. where do you go for spare parts for your trains?

if you decide to scratchbuild some buildings, to give your layout a unique look, can you get the supplies on ebay?

you want to superdetail your locomotive, and paint it for your favourite railroad, can you get the detail parts and decals on ebay? and in the case of the decals are they fresh?

also, when you buy on ebay, and find the item isn't what you thought it was, how do you return it? in the hobby show you can see and try before you buy.....

trains and collcetors cards are two completely different worlds. most of us could care less about book value of our trains, we just want to build a nice looking layout for them and to run the wheels off them. we often make upgrades to them using after market parts, that would make a collector cringe.

[CNE Runner]

I wasn't going to enter into this minefield; but decided to put forth my own two cents.

Regarding eBay: Sure eBay has definitely hurt the LHS - by offering the same products at a much reduced price...but the same can be said for the entire Internet. When I have a hobby need, I 'surf the web' and try to find the best price I can as this stretches my modelling dollar. Each time I make an Internet purchase, I am taking money out of my LHS's pocket. Eventually enough funds have flowed past the LHS that they are forced to radically modify their business plan or go out of business entirely. With the possible exception of service/advice, the LHS cannot compete in today's electronic marketplace. BTW: How do you compete with someone who has little to no overhead?

Purchasing on eBay is an example of "buyer beware". Unless you know what the product is worth, you cannot make an intelligent decision as to its purchase. Additionally, whilst no funds are used for sales tax (thereby depriving the local economy of needed revenue), shipping costs can be astronomical. The only way for today's modeler to survive is to become better informed. To do otherwise is to waste what little disposable income we have.

Regarding train price guides (and I get almost all of them - resulting in considerable overhead for our small business): View price guides as a means to give you some idea as to the highest price an object will fetch (this is especially true of Lionel products). Example: I have a Lionel Fallen Flags #1 (Wabash) that is absolutely mint as it has been out of its boxes twice and never touched rail!  TM lists this set as having a mint value of $750...try to get that in today's market! Price guides are just what their title says: price guides. The old adage that says something is worth what someone else will pay for it is absolutely true with trains.

So what does the current situation (the Internet) and economy mean to those of us that sell trains? We are getting out of the business. My wife and I plan on selling the remainder of our stock over the coming year and then 'folding up the tent.' It is no longer profitable to pack all your show inventory, schlep 50+ miles to a show, pay $50 for a couple of tables, haggle with customers (who can get it cheaper on the Internet...then why are you talking to me?), and give up a day that can be better used in our motor home. Have you noticed many train shows are less populated with vendors than they used to be? 'Ever wonder why?

Again, these are my thoughts and opinions. I am not trying to start a heated discussion - nor am I crying in my diet soda.

Respectfully,
Ray

[RAM]

When you buy something on the internet, you pay the postage.  When you get it at the local hobby shop.  The LHS pays the postage.  On ebay you might get a good buy.  They few thing in HO that I have won were not that great a deal.  I wonder why something bring the price that they do.  right now there in a ho tyco superman box car.  $4.50.  Not bad you say.  However the postage is $8.60, which bring the total to $13.10.  Oh well a superman box car is not model railroading anyway.

[whatsamatteru]

hi, again i want to make sure that everyone knows i am not some supporter of ebay.  and also i am not trying to find out what the prices are because i am a collector.  but being new i thought it would be a good idea so i dont get hoodwinked.

postage on ebay:  yes you pay postage but you dont pay tax.  i got a set of a dealer for 229 but paid 13 dollars tax.  so its about the same

ebay problems with item.  i have never had a  problem that wasnt resolved.   they have a great dispute system in place and you also have buyer protection.

feedback system.  if you buy off a guy that has 96% feedback then you deserve what you get.  look at nothing below 98%.

so again i am not on ebays side but its going to be hard for the dealer to compete with a store.  i hope he does.  but 2 just closed here in the last year.

[CNE Runner]

Don - What's not to like about eBay? It is merely another venue to conduct business. One of the best things, I can say about eBay, is the plethora of choices it gives one (this is certainly not limited to model railroading). Buying and selling on the Internet is just a new way of commercialism...a way by which we have all profited.

We need to all enjoy the tax-free status that buying on the Internet allows us...it will end in the future. How long do you think the government will 'turn a blind eye' toward the billions of tax dollars lost? As our federal, state, and local indebtedness grows; this revenue stream will be dammed...of that you can be sure.

Ray

[jward]

right now there in a ho tyco superman box car.  $4.50.  Not bad you say.  However the postage is $8.60, which bring the total to $13.10.  Oh well a superman box car is not model railroading anyway.

$4.50 for tyco boxcar (local hobby shop is selling tyco cars for $3)
$5 for a new set of trucks and wheelsets.
$2 for couplers with draft gear boxes.
whatever some plastruct tubing (to fill in the huge hole in the bolster) 4 2-56 screws, and some styrene to use as coupler shims costs.

probably $12-13 invested turning a sow's ear into a silk purse....

sounds like for the money spent you could get a decent ready to roll car....

and we haven't even factored in postage yet....

nope, $4.50 was not a good deal, unless you like rebuilding things.

[whatsamatteru]

cne.  i am not against ebay either i was just stating that i wasnt making post supporting them either

yes that is one item,  i can find a ton that works the other way as well.  bigger items are good and there is a lot of free shipping