Using masonite for structures?

[Woody Elmore]

So, Ray, how long have you had stock in the foamcore company? Just kidding but I agree with you about foamcore over masonite.

Rather than cut out for the windows, couldn't the masonite be assembled in sections? You could do a full size panel then glue two pieces next to it, leaving space for the window? The panels could be reinforced from the backside with masonite strips. 

Incidentally, I would suggest that masonite not be used for roadbed.  It just is a bad idea.

[Woody Elmore]

Oh - I forgot - Merry Christmas to all out there. I hope Santa Claus is good to everyone!

[AlanMintaka]

Al - If I may repeat myself: Foamcore makes a much better building material than Masonite (hardboard). Hobby Lobby carries nice large sheets of foamcore (20"x 30"); and sells them for $1.99 each. You can easily build a medium sized (in HO) structure with one sheet. The only drawback is that Hobby Lobby only carries this product in white (it can be had elsewhere in a variety of colors). If you require larger sheets, you local sign shop can get it in 4'x 8' panels...possibly larger).

In summary, foamcore is cheap and easy to work with. You have already 'experimented' with hardboard...why continue down a path laced with diminishing returns? The only application I have found foamcore lacking is as transfer table material. The foamcore is much too light...5 mm birch plywood is much better (with the addition of automobile wheel weights...even better).

Get a piece of foamcore - a low temperature hot glue gun - and experiment. With the application of printed paper transfers, and weathering, you will be pleasantly surprised.

Ray

Hi Ray,
As I noted,

"So now I'm experimenting with various kinds of foam to serve as a lightweight roof.  I bought some fan-fold foam 3/8" thick and practiced my nonexistent cutting skills until I got the right shape without beveled edges."

The fan-fold foam I bought is the same material as foamcore.  Sorry, I should have been more explicit about what that stuff is.  That's what I'm experimenting with when using the acrylics.

The local hobby shop sells foamcore in sheets that are too small, and wants ridiculously high prices for larger sheets.  Thus I appreciate your reference to the Hobby Lobby.  If they have a website, I'll find it.

White doesn't bother me so much.  I can prime and paint whatever colors I need to get the job done.  The only limiting factor has been cost around here, except for that fan-fold stuff. 

The problem with the fan-fold foam, as I'm now finding out, is that there are a lot of surface imperfections that need to be treated before painting.  They weren't really obvious until after the first coat of acrylic primer last night.  There are numerous pinholes (prob from handling equipment) and a very slight rippling that is easily seen with the primer.  I've spackled a second sheet and will be sanding that to see if I can get a flat surface.

But it's a lot of work just for a flat surface.  I will look into that foamcore at Hobby Lobby, thanks again for the reference.

Just a note here: I wouldn't be too hasty with calling Masonite a "dimishing returns" venture.  It's still great for flat surfaces with no cutouts, and excellent as roadbeds on raised track, highways, and bridges.  For printed transfers it's every bit as good as any other flat material that can be glued.  The two surfaces it already has - gloss and matte - are already prepped to go for whatever applications require those finishes.  The matte side is particularly good for flat tar roofing and rural roadbeds.

In addition, as I pointed out in my very first post, I have a ton of this stuff and it's all free.  It's far from being "diminishing returns" in all those respects.  If anything, what I've learned so far only limits it in those two categeries I happen to need for my application: small cutouts and weight (for large roof spans).

That's about the listing of end results so far.  What I still don't know is whether the acrylic paint I've been having to use with these foam products is dangerous - especially the sprays, which are really synthetic lacquers and stink to high bull orifice, much more than enamel sprays.  I have a big unfinished basement I can evacuate after I'm done working until the vapors settle but no praying booth, and this time of year no decent ventilation.

Sorry to ramble.  To echo Woody, Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, Happy Chanukah, Happy Kwanzaa, Lecherous Saturnalia (that one's mine), and Joyous Etc too all!

Big Al Mintaka

[RAM]

Masonite would work great for the base for building.

[CNE Runner]

Al - I hear you...lots of hardboard that was free. RAM has a great idea of using hardboard for structure bases. I once used foamcore for this purpose (I didn't have any hardboard) and had limited success. You can also use up a lot of hardboard with fascias...the stuff does come in handy.

Happy/Merry/Joyful holidays to all (including our Greco-Roman pagan friends),

Ray

[AlanMintaka]

Hey All,
If anyone's still keeping an eye on this thread, I've been getting continuously better results as I experiment with different roofing materials. 

Masonite is still great for bases and walls but it weighs a little too much for the large flat roofs and decks I want to build. 

I used art shop foam board (foam core between two sheets of acid-free cardstock).  It can take any kind of spray paint I've been throwing at it: Rustoleum, Krylon, Krylon Fusion (supposedly special for plastics).    Enamel like Rustoleum that would normally eat right through foam core that wasn't protected somehow, gives a nice coat of paint on the cardstock without leaking through to erode the foam inside.  There is some very minor scoring of the foam at the edges between the cardstock sheets but nothing really serious if the roof is going to have some sort of edging.  The drawback with this stuff is cost.  It's big bucks.

Also I finally found an outfit that sells high-impact styrene sheets in sizes I can use.  It turns out that styrene sheeting 0.03" thick is pretty much the same material used in these Girder and Panel/Bridge and Turnpike sets for wall/roof panels and roadways.  This styrene is perfect for flat roofs, interior floors, and decking.  Also I can cut holes at the edges for the anchoring beams using a hand-held paper cutter.  The right size for making ring binder holes works fine.  I haven't had to cut any holes away from the edges yet but I'm not worried about that. 

This stuff takes Rustoleum and Krylon with no trouble.  If the Rustoleum is compromising the styrene somehow I sure can't see it. 

Here's the place that sells the plastic sheets in affordable lots of flat stock and larger amounts on rolls.  I bought 25 sheets of the High Impact Polystyrene 0.03" 18" X 24" flat stock/white.  There's no clear; the other color available is black.  I chose white because I figured it would be easier to paint.

http://www.professionalplastics.com

Now I'm sure those of you who've done a lot of work with plastic sheeting have better ideas about the material.  I chose this particular stuff based on a combo of cost and similarity to the material used in the Kenner sets.  These guys sell all kinds of other plastics in sheets, rolls, and rods.  I have no idea of tradeoffs between the types yet, for example why this high-impact styrene is any better than polypropylene for what I'm doing.

Krylon gray primer on this styrene sheeting is the perfect color and material for what I want.  The only problem is that the primer is easily marked in handling and so will require some kind of clear-coating or sealing.  Or, gray Krylon Fusion finish paint that's about the same color.

Anyway that's where the flat roof (and now flooring and decking) effort is at.  I have a long and expensive learning curve.  Here's hoping I'm finally converging on a solution.

Have a good one,
Big Al Mintaka

[CNE Runner]

I was surprised to see this thread still active and assumed Alan hit on a popular theme. My Monks' Island Brewery is just about ready for building (and background flats) construction - so I am experimenting with some new foamboard techniques. While in Hobby Lobby a couple of weeks ago, I came across a line of products that are designed for crafting with foamboard. The line, of tools, is produced by Logan Graphic Products of Wauconda, IL and is marketed under the FoamWerks brand. Essentially there are 4 or 5 products that make cutting foamboard much easier.

Out of the available products I have purchased the cutting guide, straight cutter, V-groove cutter, and rabbet cutter. In addition to my purchases the company offers a bevel cutter, a freestyle cutter, a large hole cutter, and several sizes of small hole cutters. WARNING: these cutters are expensive! I used the 40% off coupon to bring their prices more in line with my budget.

So far I have used the straight cutter, cutting guide, and V-groove cutter with success. The V-groove cutter will enable me to make all the walls of a small/medium structure out of one continuous piece of foamboard. The rabbet cutter will make the final joint almost invisible. Check out a video clip on these products at:

www.foamwerks.com

My first task will be to construct a repair shed for the layout...should be interesting since I have little experience in the 'crafting world'.

Ray

[AlanMintaka]

...
Out of the available products I have purchased the cutting guide, straight cutter, V-groove cutter, and rabbet cutter. In addition to my purchases the company offers a bevel cutter, a freestyle cutter, a large hole cutter, and several sizes of small hole cutters. WARNING: these cutters are expensive! I used the 40% off coupon to bring their prices more in line with my budget.
...

Hi Ray,
You're right, those things are pricey.  Where'd you get that coupon?  I have an Amazon $25.00 gift certificate that would buy only one of the cheaper cutters, going by Amazon prices that is.  The local retailers listed on the Foamwerks page don't list the cutters in their online stores, which probably means they'd have to order them. 

At the local hobby shop they sell the Woodland Scenics hot-wire cutter with a bow guide accessory that makes it look like a coping saw.  As usual with anything made by Woodland Scenics, it's priced high, almost 50 bucks for the cutter and bow. 

At these prices for the Foamwerks and Woodland Scenics cutters, looks like I'll be roughing it for a while with whatever I have on hand.

For foam I've been using a utility knife for straight cuts.  It works OK as long as the blade is sharp.  Otherwise it catches and drags crud along, ruining the cut.  The hassle with even a sharp blade is trying not to get a bevel cut on a thick piece of foam.

That high-impact styrene, on the other hand, cuts very easily with a pair of paper scissors.  I draw a square line, then very carefully cut along it with the scissors.  This works better than a utility blade or hobby knife.  Either of those take several passes to get through even 0.03" of the stuff.  It's hard to hold the line on succeeding cuts, resulting in an uneven edge. 

For legal size sheets or smaller, I use an old-fashioned office paper cutter.

If I have the shed business right, this is an outlying structure you're going to build for your train setup?  Have you looked into the prefabs, wood or metal?

"Progress marches on".

Have a good one,
Big Al Mintaka

[Bruce Moore]

Bein' a tr-r-rue Scotsman wi' German roots, to boot, I too am just a bit on the thr-r-rifty side and tend to try to waste nothin', especially if is left over or free!

Using 1/8" Masonite is unwieldy at best and the tendency to leave ragged edges is a problem when making cutouts but there is a trick I learned from my wonderful HS industrial arts teacher: using masking tape on the surfaces helps reduce fraying of the edges on the rough side. Predrilling through the tape helps, too. Because the material s so fibrous, punching tends to leave ragged edges no matter how fine the cutting edge of the punch.

One thing that I've had success with in the area of cutouts is to install plastic frames from the smooth outside. That way, frayed edges aren't so much of a problem.

As far as painting is concerned, I clean the surface well with tack cloth then use a dull sealer. This seems to prepare the surface to hold whatever paint I want to use on the finished surface.

Keep on keepin' on, Lad! Don't let us try to convince you to scrap your leftover materials in favor of spendin' more than you want to!

[CNE Runner]

Al - I have got to learn to read the threads I have contributed to more often! Sorry I missed your question. Hobby Lobby usually has a 40% off coupon every other week in the Huntsville Times. You can get your own coupon at www.hobbylobby.com under the In Store Specials section. Here is the drill: print out at least a couple of these coupons. When you go to the store, give one to your significant other - while you keep the other. This means you get 40% off TWO items! Huntsville, AL has two stores so we could (in theory) get four items at the reduced rate. Check the website each week for the coupon.

WARNING Will Rogers...some items are already on sale and are not eligible for the 40% coupon. I used the straight cutter and V-groove cutter and realized that they are harder to use than first anticipated. Please understand that I have little to no artistic skills (where is a crafter when you need them?). I think I will 'make' a couple of trial structures before attempting the one I will laminate and use on the layout. So far I still have all 10 fingers and most of my blood.

Ray

[RAM]

Hobby Lobby usually has a 40% off coupon, you can also go the their web page and print them.