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Author Topic: POWER SUPPLY  (Read 5870 times)
EARIC

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« on: January 26, 2011, 07:07:18 PM »

Will a 15volt 5amp power supply work on the ez command (not a booster)but power supply
Thank You
Robert
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EARIC

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« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2011, 07:23:23 PM »

THANK YOU
Robert
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mf5117

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« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2011, 07:50:55 PM »

I have a question if the 5 amp power supply he has will not work . why does Bachmann sell the 5 amp power booster . Is it because you have to go from the controller to the booster then feed the power to the track from the booster . Does the DC voltage output from a regular controller interfere with the DCC .And if you say it would work how would you hook it up . I've run 5 to 6 strings on my 5x9ft layout layout with my EZ command also FA-FB unit and haven't ever noticed a drop in power or a difference in how the locomotives run ... JUZZ WONDEREN

This was from the Manuel from the Bachmann 5 amp power Booster!!!!
And Provides extra current to the track so an increased number of DCC locomotives can run on your HO, N, O, or Large Scale layout.
Output voltage can be adjusted to meet your scale requirements.
Can be used with any NMRA/NEM-conformant DCC system.
Air vents and a fan to ensure proper ventilation and prevent overheating.
SAFETY FEATURES include: * Thermal overload protection * Opto-isolation (current) interface that consumes 30ma.
This eliminates any possiblility for hidden ground loops thru your power station * 7V signal on the DCC bus to prevent the booster from accidentally sending power to track when the command station stops sending signals Green LED indicates that power is on.
Red LED indicates an overload or short circuit.
The Power Booster is protected by a thermal circuit breaker which resets when the short circuit or overload is corrected.
Both printed and DVD format instructions.

Regards mf5117


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mf5117

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« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2011, 08:07:38 PM »

OOOOOHHHH it is a power supply I read ... And how would it work and why only draw no more than 1.5 amps . So when I'm running 5 or 6 strings with a couple of double headed gp 40's and an FA-FB unit I think I'm pulling more than 1 amp I think . I here and read so many different issues with the EZ command and I haven't had any problems with the one I have . It's a great little unit for what it is ...
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mf5117

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« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2011, 10:53:45 PM »

you know your right hunt I do remember seeing that in one of the illistrations . thanks for the post and the graphic . I thought so just wanted to make sure .I was always tempted to buy the 5 amp power supply ,but never did because i never saw any power loss . the only problem I ever had was I fried a 4-8-4 sante fa steamer due to i left it on a turnout sitting idle .I remember reading the post of what might have caused it but it's been long ago and I can't remember what the cause was . But it made the room stink for a week . I was running 4 or 5 loco's at the time and the 4-8-4 was stting idle and just started smoking so I ate that one . motor's decoder ,but the other loco's were fine. just a siding off the main with no return . and poof . there went 200.00 . I ask alot of questions got alot of answers checked alot of things . But something I remember about it being left on the siding Idle .
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Doneldon

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« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2011, 10:59:22 PM »

5117-

You can connect a five-amp booster to the EZ Command system without a problem; however, you are taking a chance of frying your EZ Command if you connect a five-amp power supply to the EZ Command and then "overwork" it. There are two important differences to note here: First, the booster is connected "downstream" from the EZ Command unit and, second, a power supply and a booster aren't the same thing, even though it seems like they perform a similar function. You don't need to know the engineering involved. Just don't do it.

It would be very easy to inadvertently overload your EZ Command and fry it, even if you have an ammeter in the circuit because there aren't any bells or flashing warning lights to get your attention when you overdo it. I have asked this board many times about overamping an EZ Command for my grandson and no one has ever replied with anything other than don't do it. Actually, your response from Hunt is about the most permissive I've seen and I would heed it if I were you.
                                                                                                                                                                                                           -- D
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Jim Banner

Enjoying electric model railroading since 1950.


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« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2011, 12:20:27 AM »

Power sources that from time to time are subjected to overloads or short circuits generally have some form of protection to keep them from burning themselves up.  In your house, this job is handled by fuses or circuit breakers.  In laboratory type power supplies, it is handled by electronic current limiting.  In dc power packs, it is usually handled by self resetting circuit breakers.  And in DCC command stations, it is usually handled by electronic current limiting, over heat protection, and/or a fuse.

The three forms of command station protection work differently:

The electronic current limiting circuit sets a maximum value of current that may be drawn, even in case of a short circuit.  An automobile tail lamp used in series with the track is one form of current limiting - the track cannot draw any more current than the light bulb is willing to pass.  In case of a short circuit, all the booster inside the command station does is light the bulb.  A more sophisticated form of electronic current limiting shuts off the current to the track if the current exceeds some threshold value.  Then at regular intervals, the circuit turns the current back on for a very small fraction of a second.  If the track is still drawing excessive current, it turns the current off again.  The circuit can cycle on and off indefinitely until excessive current is no longer being drawn.   Then the circuit reverts to normal operation.  This is more complex than the light bulb but has very definite advantages (we can discuss them some other time if anyone is interested.)

The overheat protection circuit monitors the temperature of the output transistors, the ones that feed current to the rails.  If the transistors' internal temperature exceeds 150o C, the silicon melts and the smoke comes out.  A number of things can contribute to overheating.  Too much output current being drawn, too high an input voltage, and too high ambient temperature are three common ones.  The overheat protection circuit does not care what is causing overheating.  Its job is to turn everything off when overheating occurs and keep it off until it detects that the temperature has returned to a safe level.

The fuse does not handle routine over current conditions.  Good thing too - model railroading would be a whole different sport if we had to replace a fuse every time we had a derailment or some other condition causing excessive current to be drawn.  A fuse, when used, is normally a last line of defense and gives up its life only when a catastrophic event occurs.  In a DCC booster, failure of the over current circuit and/or failure of the overheat protection circuit would be high on the list of possible catastrophes.

From using an E-Z Command, I have come to the conclusion that all three of the above protection methods are built into it.  If you were to open up your E-Z Commander (NOT recommended!) you would see a thermistor next to the output transistors of its booster circuit.  That thermistor is the key element in the overheat protection scheme.   If you were to open up the E-Z Command,s "wall wart" power supply (also NOT recommended,) you would find a fuse, all ready to blow if all else fails.  Knowing that  the fuse does NOT blow every time  a train derails or every time we try to run too many trains at once means that there is some kind of over current protection built into the E-Z Command.  We can also infer that this over current protection is electronic as simple circuit breakers cannot open fast enough to protect a fuse.

Bottom line, it should not matter if you use a transformer with a higher current rating as long as the voltage is the same.  Now all we need is to find someone willing to try it out and possibly ruin his E-Z Command.  (Why is everybody suddenly looking at me???)

Jim     

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Growing older is mandatory but growing up is optional.
EARIC

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« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2011, 03:16:45 PM »

THANKS FOR ALLYOUR INPUT.
Robert
PS can you use any other throttle control on the ez command other then the bachmann work around?
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ACY


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« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2011, 04:32:48 PM »

THANKS FOR ALLYOUR INPUT.
Robert
PS can you use any other throttle control on the ez command other then the bachmann work around?
For DCC use the walk-around companion, if you want to free address 10 you may only add a Bachmann DC controller, that is shown in the diagram, the magnum one will not work or any other manufacturer's unless you want to go down the same road you did with the power supply (potential damage is involved).
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mf5117

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« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2011, 08:24:15 PM »

See that's what I can't get a grip on yet is ,I run my EZ commander into the ground .And it hasn't failed me yet . I know I say I run 5 or 6 trains at a time . and I have, but usually 2 strings going opposite on the 18" rad and one going the other way on the 22" rad . and doing some switching and when I feel good and confident ,I'll bring on another to the 22" rad and get brave and bring on another . keeping up with the speed set and making adjustment's as needed then doing some switching on the inside of the layout running lights as well and I don't get the problems people have with the overloads and burning up there units . And no extra feeders . I did the math and on the 5x9ft layout I have about 38ft of track with main and turnouts and the upper 15" rad semi dogbone . comes off a switchgoes up the 4% grade almost 70" up to the semi dogbone on the secound level with a feeder , feeding power to secound level . hmmmmmm

Jim I'll buy another EZ command and try it . I have my other MDT I'll put on the track and see .And do the test .

p.s Jim you have learned and taught me so much here and I thank you . can't wait until i can pick your brain about large scale !!!!

regards mf5117
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Doneldon

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« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2011, 04:03:55 AM »

5117-

No, not another EZ Command. You can use the Walk A
round Companion or the basic Bachmann Controller
which comes with their non-DCC sets. You DO NOT want
to connect a second EZ Command.
                                                     -- D
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mf5117

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« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2011, 08:21:55 AM »

I know not to do that .I was just saying I would do it just for giggles . I know it will smoke it . I was going threw some boxes and found an old old old Nscale power supply and a Lionel 80w power supply from the 60's .I remember as being a kid having an 027 3 rail set didn't think I still had any equipment left over . Maybe I need to look up in mom and dads attic . running out of room with all the Gscale equipment I have been buying . I keep all and everything the boxes as well with the HO stuff ....
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