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Author Topic: Railroad wars  (Read 13736 times)
ryeguyisme

Heavy Mountain Steam


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« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2012, 11:18:52 PM »

Wars over right of way, existed on John Allen's Gorre and Daphetid, with the G&D fighting the Devil's Gulch and Helengon narrow gauge over trackage rights haha
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Woody Elmore

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« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2012, 09:06:43 AM »

And Whit Tower's Alturas and Lone Pine also had trackage rights on the G&D.

Allen and Towers made model railroading a fun, interesting hobby. They weren't concerned that a box car may have extra roof ribs or their steamers didn't follow a prototype. They ran trains.

As for pawning HO equipment, I don't think a pawn shop would pay very much for used HO equipment or even be interested.
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Desertdweller

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« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2012, 10:29:36 AM »

A correction to one of my previous posts:  Mitchell SD, the Milwaukee Road's hope to be capital of SD, is not on the Missouri River.  It is on the James River, south of Huron.

Huron had its own hopes to be capital, and went so far as to build their own capitol building ("If you build it, they will come",) but it didn't succeed.

The Milwaukee's jumping-off place was Chamberlain, on the Missouri River South of Pierre.  Railroads were forbidden to build across the Great Sioux Reservation until 1905 when the reservation was split up.  Then a railroad race to Rapid City was staged.

The C&NW won the race by three weeks.

Both the C&NW and the CB&Q had reached the Black Hills earlier, but by routes avoiding the reservation by approaching through Nebraska.

Les
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jward


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« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2012, 11:37:10 AM »

 railroadrivalries go back almost to the beginning. b&o built their line to wheeling,wva from baltimore because they were blocked from building directly to pittsburgh by the state of pennsylvania, who were backing the pennsylvania railroad instead. keeping the b&o from building into pennsylvania forced them through much more rugged and expensive to build and operate territory.  the b&o was only permitted to build into pittsburgh from wheeling, an uncompetitive, roundabout route.

later, b&o was able to back, and later take over, a more direct line from cumberland, md to pittsburgh.

b&o was also forced, by the c&o canal, to build on the south bank of the potomac river east of cumberland. this put them in the awkward position of straddling north and south during the civil war.

at the turn ot the century, george gould tattempted to build a true transcontinental railroad. he built a super railroad into pittsburgh, using tunnels and bridges to eliminate most of the grades. but the pennsy blocked him from building east of pittsburgh, leaving him with an expensive line with little traffic. the costs of building to pittsburgh brought about his downfall. eventually, pittsburgh & west virginia, and weswtern maryland completed the route, which ran until the mid 1970s and was known as the alphabet route.
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Jeffery S Ward Sr
Pittsburgh, PA
Doneldon

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« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2012, 07:01:46 PM »

The Santa Fe and D&RGW nearly came to bullits and blood over the right-of-way between La Junta and Denver.

                                                                                                          -- D
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Desertdweller

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« Reply #20 on: September 23, 2012, 08:24:35 PM »

I think that was Jay Gould.  He did better west of the Mississippi, owning the Missouri Pacific; Denver and Rio Grande; and Western Pacific.  Three railroads giving an end-to-end route from St. Louis to San Francisco.

Les
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jward


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« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2012, 09:15:25 AM »

in the east, he also controlled the wabash, wheeling & lake erie, and the western maryland. his problem was there was a gap between the western maryland at cumberland, md and the wheeling & lake erie at wheeling, wva.   thus, he was witin 200 miles of a true coast to coast route from baltimore to san francisco.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2012, 09:17:02 AM by jward » Logged

Jeffery S Ward Sr
Pittsburgh, PA
ebtnut

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« Reply #22 on: September 24, 2012, 01:21:18 PM »

My recollection is that Gould lost control of his transcontintal dream as a result of the Panic of 1907.  Think of the 2008 crash on steriods.  The Connellsville extension was begun in 1910.  The association of rail lines from Gould' scheme were the genesis of the Alpabet Route from Chicago to Baltimore. 
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Doneldon

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« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2012, 03:53:18 PM »

Jeff-

We may yet see a true coast-to-coast railroad. It's only a matter of time before
the Santa Fe and Norfolk Southern merge or the Union Pacific and CSX join up.

                                                                                                            -- D
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jward


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« Reply #24 on: September 25, 2012, 01:38:46 AM »

technically. we already have one that reaches 3 coasts, since cn bought illinois central. most of it is in canada, though.
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Jeffery S Ward Sr
Pittsburgh, PA
jward


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« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2012, 01:42:55 AM »

My recollection is that Gould lost control of his transcontintal dream as a result of the Panic of 1907.  Think of the 2008 crash on steriods.  The Connellsville extension was begun in 1910.  The association of rail lines from Gould' scheme were the genesis of the Alpabet Route from Chicago to Baltimore. 

undoubtedly, the panic had something to do with it, bht gould incurred so much debt building what became the p&wv that it wouldn't have taken much to put him under.

ironically, the last link, the p&wv from pittsburgh to connellsville, was completed during another time of economic uncertainty, in 1932.
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Jeffery S Ward Sr
Pittsburgh, PA
ryeguyisme

Heavy Mountain Steam


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« Reply #26 on: September 27, 2012, 11:55:46 PM »

Gould hindered Moffat's progress of the denver and salt lake railways line through rollins pass

Moffat died spending all he had trying to finish the route
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beampaul7

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« Reply #27 on: September 28, 2012, 06:50:45 PM »

Doneldon, what war between D&RG & Santa Fe are you talking about?  The only one I'm aware of was the Royal Gorge War.

Mystified.

Paul G







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Doneldon

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« Reply #28 on: September 28, 2012, 08:32:03 PM »

Paul-

That's the one. The two railroads had hired guns and were ready for a shooting war.

                                                                                                                   -- D
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beampaul7

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« Reply #29 on: September 28, 2012, 11:42:25 PM »

Hi Doneldon,
La Junta is about 100 plus miles E of the Royal Gorge. No action occured around La Junta that I'm aware of.  If I remember correctly, the main confrontation between Bat Masterson & co. and the D&RG occured at the Pueblo roundhouse.

Paul G
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