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Author Topic: Pull String for 4-6-0 Bell  (Read 5809 times)
punkin

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« on: August 08, 2015, 07:42:00 PM »

Hello everyone,

I was thinking of adding a little detail to my 4-6-0 anniversary bumble bee. I see from old photos that there was rope from the bell to the driver's compartment. The photos look like the rope would come from the bell handle/arm back to the work station but when I lay out a string to simulate that, there's a large stack thing (I do not know what this is) that is in the way.

I also see that on top of this large stack there is what looks like a whistle I was also thinking about adding a little detail by adding the control for this as well.

Has anyone tried this? I wonder if some parts because of scale are larger and maybe this can't be done. Just tinkering, nothing lost if this is a bad idea.


Thank you!
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Kevin Strong


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« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2015, 09:19:13 PM »

Typically, the bell cord would run from the bell through the cab on the fireman's (left hand) side of the cab. If there was a steam dome between the bell and the cab, sometimes there would be a loop through which the bell cord would run attached to the dome, other times it just rubbed against it, or sometimes it was far enough away from the dome that it didn't touch.

The cord for the whistle would run from the whistle through the cab on the engineer's (right hand) side of the cab.

Here's a photo of the inside of one of my cabs, showing the ropes running through the front wall, and being attached to the rear wall.



Most modelers (including me on most models) don't go so far as to model the ropes going to the back wall, instead they just poke them through the front wall and leave it at that. The "ropes" in this case are 24-gauge stranded wire with the insulation stripped off, twisted and painted to look like rope. You can use heavy thread as well, though it doesn't "drape" quite as naturally because there's not a lot of weight there. The wire is stiff enough to be bent to a natural-looking shape.

Later,

K
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Chuck N

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« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2015, 09:20:27 PM »

If you look at pictures of #12 on the Tweetsie RR in Boone, NC, you will see that the bell is centered infront of a large dome.  That is the engine the Bachmann used as the prototype for their 4-6-0.  I would guess that the bell cord either passed through an eye bolt somewhere between the cab and the bell or it just hung without any support.

There would also be a cord from the arm on the whistle to the cab.

Chuck
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punkin

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« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2015, 10:15:22 PM »

This is great stuff.

Thank you, so it is ok for the bell pull string to rub on the big stack part then?


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Kevin Strong


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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2015, 12:00:11 AM »

Yes. The "big stack part" would be the steam dome. The worst the bell cord would do would be to rub against the paint on the dome. The bell isn't rung all that much, so it would take a long time for the cord to cause any noticeable damage to the paint on the dome, if it wasn't run through an I-hook of some kind.

Later,

K
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on30gn15


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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2015, 03:49:57 AM »

There were a couple ways of routing the bell rope around domes between bell and cab.
Sometimes an arched tube was put at base of dome, with arch upside down to follow natural curve of rope. Have see photo with that tube less than a foot long to around a couple feet long. Sometimes that arched tube was on boiler jacketing below dome instead of on side of dome base.
Sometimes a simple loop somewhere on side of dome or base of dome was used and bell rope passed through it.

While the tube looks cool, for simplicity's sake, on my models I'm using a loop cut from those craft pins which have either a head or a loop. Superglue in to a hole, oh, I don't know the drill bit size, but small, on side of dome and away you go.

Here, this shows a high loop. I don't know if that it prototypical for D&S locos, but, hey, it is what I want to do.
Whistle cord arrangement is per assorted plans and photos, ones I know where they are without having to look much are in Kalmbach's book Steam Locomotive Cyclopedia, which I think is out of print at the moment.


Note: typically in US, bell rope was on fireman,s (left) side - on the Big Haulers I've turned bell around on ones where it could be persuaded to come unglued, on the others, whatever the factory glue was, it was very good stuff and the bell is staying backwards.
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When all esle fials, go run trains
Screw the Rivets, I'm building for Atmosphere!
later, Forrest
on30gn15


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« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2015, 03:58:27 AM »

An alternative for the whistle is to mount it on a pipe from side of dome as was often done as locos grew larger. Here a small copper tube was bent and stock bell pulled loose then stuck in end of tube which was in turn inserted in to hole drilled in dome. Pull rod is made from brass wire.


On this engine, bell rope loop is also placed high on side of dome, rope passing behind dome hints at that.


Another part which can be added is the sand dome control rod and lever, visible here as green painted rod above handrail.


If further information is required, please contact my research assistant, he will be happy to provide whatever documentation is requested.
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When all esle fials, go run trains
Screw the Rivets, I'm building for Atmosphere!
later, Forrest
on30gn15


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« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2015, 04:05:40 AM »

On other, closer, photos of other locos, part of long arc of bell rope lying against boiler can be seen to be a tube.
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns1294.jpeg

Difficult to see what was done on this one, it may just rub on dome and they hope for the best. http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns768.jpeg

This PRR 4-4-0 has loop high on side of dome. http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr8345.jpg

This bell rope passes through loop high on sand dome and then hard to tell what exactly is done between there and cab wall http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/lv1149s.jpg
While 1149 has loop on sand dome, 1163 has loop on steam dome http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/lv1163s.jpg
« Last Edit: August 09, 2015, 04:15:43 AM by on30gn15 » Logged

When all esle fials, go run trains
Screw the Rivets, I'm building for Atmosphere!
later, Forrest
on30gn15


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« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2015, 04:20:30 AM »

Whistle rope - here are a few PRR ones with the "mast and hawse pipe" arrangement I am using

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr933s.jpg

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr437.jpg
Note that 1175 below has 2 ropes to bell
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr1175s.jpg
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When all esle fials, go run trains
Screw the Rivets, I'm building for Atmosphere!
later, Forrest
punkin

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« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2015, 04:23:41 PM »

Wow, all very great information and photos. Wonderful ideas for me. Thanks so very much all  Grin
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Chuck N

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« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2015, 11:50:42 AM »

If you look carefully at some of On30's linked pictures, you can see the bell cord passing through an eye-bolt of some kind on the side of the steam dome.

Chuck
« Last Edit: August 14, 2015, 08:19:43 AM by Chuck N » Logged
on30gn15


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« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2015, 10:19:06 PM »

Another necessary part to add, on the models representing inside Stephenson valve gear, is the valve stem extending aft from the valve chest; and, the rocker arms which transferred motion from the mechanism on the axle to the valves.

I haven't completely noodled out exactly how I want to make those parts yet. Have done that on some HO models with strips and slivers of brass, but large scale requires a little bit more sturdiness.

Here's how the valve gear works http://www.steamlocomotive.com/appliances/valvegear.php
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When all esle fials, go run trains
Screw the Rivets, I'm building for Atmosphere!
later, Forrest
punkin

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« Reply #12 on: August 11, 2015, 04:47:02 AM »

Wow, the side gear information was a complete eye opener. I haven't seen but a couple real steam trains but I'm completely fascinated by all the hoses, gears and moving parts. I'm trying to arrange for a little excursion in hopes to see one that really works and moves. The thing that catches my attention is that all these parts have to be important otherwise I don't believe they would put it on there. A real mechanical marvel.

Thanks!
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on30gn15


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« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2015, 05:30:27 AM »

A couple photos you might enjoy, came via the Early Rail group in Yahoo, 2-6-0 steamers with special photographers' cars.
Note, the images are big.
Quote
Circa 1890s. "Delaware, Lackawanna and Western Railroad. Detroit Photographic Special." Detroit Photographic Co.'s rolling showroom-darkroom.
http://www.shorpy.com/node/13194?size=_original#caption

Quote
Circa 1899. "Near Lewiston, Minnesota -- The Pulpit." Yet another rock formation with a fanciful name. 8x10 inch dry plate glass negative. | Click image for Comments.
http://www.shorpy.com/node/19845?size=_original#caption
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When all esle fials, go run trains
Screw the Rivets, I'm building for Atmosphere!
later, Forrest
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