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Author Topic: Bachmann DCC and G Scale  (Read 14204 times)
traindude109

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« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2007, 08:46:42 PM »

Some of the guys who post good information I guess.
Grades are always an issue, don't know how many times I have to say that.
Because it only takes in the amount of amps it needs because the DCC system is putting out the full power supply all the time when on. The loco only takes the amount of power it needs to stay at the constant set speed.
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Matt

Boulder Creek and Western Railroad (G scale 1:20.3)
Curmudgeon
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« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2007, 09:45:12 PM »

Nathan-

Okay, here's the deal:
First, read the title of this thread:

Then, the ORIGINAL message was:
"Will the Bachmann DCC E-Z digital command control system work with  Bachmanns own G scale engines that come DCC ready? "

NO WHERE does it refer to the three-truck Shay, NOR does it refer to factory-equipped locomotives.

DCC Ready is different than DCC-equipped.
As I have said before, I use aluminum, as it's cheap, I can get 215 codes, at that height it really follows terrain well (unlike 332, especially SS).
Price out SS and NS sometimes as compared to aluminum.
I've got over 1400 feet of aluminum down, and about 80 turnouts.

You want to know how many blocks I have in the entire 1400+ feet?
One.

It goes from one end of the RR to the other.
Not one of the turnouts is "dcc compatible", as you read about in the general forum here.

I challenge you to run anything track powered here, or even wooden rails, or on live steam railroads using live-steamers that have non-insulated drivers.

I've run my Shay (2-truck, original release Ely-Thomas) on a railroad that was 1" under muddy water....try getting packet transfer in that!

I must admit, I have a couple of power packs here.
One is an OLD Tri-Tech "Hogger" I use for testing and to drive my turnouts IN the shed.
The other is a 30+ year old MRC Throttlemaster something, an H0 pack given to me long ago, blown up.
Fixed it and use it for bench testing.

So.

I have no power supplies feeding the railroad.
I have no boosters.
No power districts.
No blocks.
No buried power cables.
No (and read that as NONE) track-cleaning devices of any sort.
No soldered joints in the rails, no jumper wires across joints, and exactly 12 clamps on the entire railroad, 10 of which are for removing bridges for lawnmower and wheelchair access.

Whan I want to run, I turn one switch on the loco on.
I then run.
My maintenance consists of pickup branches off the track on the first run.

I don't worry about decoder recharge current taking out pickup springs.
I never, and once again, read that as NEVER clean my loco wheels, nor worry about collapsed pickup springs or dirty pickups.

I don't have either any special wiring for reverse loops nor any super-duper electronics to automatically do it for me.

I have yet to have to put any of my locomotives on a "programming track", nor obtain any 1K ohm resistors to get them to program, nor plug my engines into any computer interfaces.

Also, I have yet to have any unwanted smoke come out of any of my  equipment.

Of course, my railroad has been outdoors running year-round in the Pacific Northwest for just over 15 years, so I guess I just haven't been at it long enough.

BTW, I have talked at length to folks who do DCC outdoors, and know about the 10-15 minutes it takes to clean SS track, the two hours to clean the brass, then they take the engines off the track (gee, I don't even do that), clean the wheels and pickups thoroughly, and when they start to run, the performance continuously degrades as they run, as crXp biulds up on wheels, pickups and track.

Holy Batpoop, look at all the fun I'm missing!
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Curmudgeon
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« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2007, 09:49:55 PM »

traindude109:

So, dcc is different than dc in current requirements?
The dcc locomotive only takes the power it needs?

"Because it only takes in the amount of amps it needs because the DCC system is putting out the full power supply all the time when on. The loco only takes the amount of power it needs to stay at the constant set speed."

Okay, I'll bite.
How does any other system differ from that?
Are you telling be a track powered loco will take the full 10 amps available just because?

One more thing.
I've been VERY careful to quote the original person who mentioned grades.
Don't take it personal, it wasn't you.

I will say, if you believe all this, then we need decoders in more than the light switches in our houses.
I wonder if spam advertisements for ****** will now be supplanted......

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Jim Banner

Enjoying electric model railroading since 1950.


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« Reply #18 on: February 23, 2007, 10:56:15 PM »

TOC, who was the first to mention grades in regard to this?  On this thread, it was traindude 109, except he mistyped it.  But earlier than that, on the old board, I dimly remember someone explaining to traindude 109 and others that trains going up grades took more power than on the level, and that had to be taken into account when figuring how many trains would run on a given booster.  Was that you?  Or me?  Or one of the others with actual working experience with DCC outdoors?

Just to explain to others where TOC is coming from - he has a major investment in battery r/c operation and it would be as cost prohibitive for him to switch to DCC as it would be for me to suddenly switch to all battery r/c.  TOC started out with battery r/c and stayed with it.  If I had a large railroad with 1400 feet of track, I might have stayed with battery r/c too.  But on my smaller layout squeezed into a suburban backyard, I found battery r/c too limiting and too expensive so I switched to DCC.  I like DCC because I can add another locomotive to my roster. then get it running on DCC for less than $50.  TOC likes battery r/c because he can add another hundred yards of track and not have to buy another booster.  Who is right?  I guess we both are.  And I also guess this paragraph has ended up being as much about where I am coming from as about where TOC is coming from.

There are even things TOC and I agree on.  One is the use of aluminum rail.  We both like the price, the low profiles, and the ease of installation.  But TOC sees is as useful only for battery r/c whereas I see it as a wonderfully conductive metal that carries electricity well and willingly transfers it to locomotive wheels if you know how to treat it properly.  Of course I have to clean it, usually once in the spring and maybe one or two more times during the summer, at ten minutes a time for my 300 feet of track and half a dozen turnouts.  Other than that, it is just a quick walk around the layout, picking up twigs, branches, and dog crXp.  I imagine TOC has to do the same, unless he lives in an area with no trees, no bushes and no dogs.  At least I don't think that is the kind of crXp he is talking about building up on his wheels, pickups and track.
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Growing older is mandatory but growing up is optional.
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« Reply #19 on: February 24, 2007, 12:15:50 AM »

We just flick branches off when needed.
Fall we use the backside of a shopvac.
Never have cleaned this track, though.
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Jim Banner

Enjoying electric model railroading since 1950.


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« Reply #20 on: February 24, 2007, 12:19:55 AM »

And the lucky winner of the "who was first to mention grades" contest was??
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Growing older is mandatory but growing up is optional.
Curmudgeon
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« Reply #21 on: February 24, 2007, 01:34:38 AM »

Ollie's buddy was, of course, and he doesn't know where that came from.

Several not participating on this thread are still trying to figure out how grades don't make a difference.

And:
 “Bachmanns 5 amps is a lot more then others 5 amps.” 

Okay, I'll bite.
An amp is a unit of measurement..............

“I suspect it is this non-interchangability of radio control components that makes the compatability of DCC decoders so hard to accept for radio control proponents.”

I don't have any issues with interchangeability. We really want to go there?
Try running the Quasinami on an MTS system out of the box.
Or, try a Maerklin system.
All DCC.......

“Lets look at DC.  You want to run 4 trains, you buy 4 power packs.”

I never did that. Even in the old days with block control. Plus, I haven't seen anybody be able to actually keep track of more than one effectively, two if you're real good, and three?
Do it and I'll engage you in convesation......
Or, as one said.."Really?  I can run several from one.  Maybe mine makes those special volts and amps Stan uses".


One of the funnier e-mails:
"I don’t care if your booster puts out 50 amps ... if your locomotive draws three amps, and has a decoder made by Bachmann, Soundtraxx, or Santa Claus that becomes a rocket igniter at 1.9 amps, you’re not going far."

of course, there is this:
"And... as to the Ford having all Ford components .... I wonder if the folks at Troop F, Conn State Police would have thought it so if someone tried to replace their Calloway equipped Camaro with a standard Chevrolet exhaust .... "

Ah, the English, it so confusing be......

 



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Jim Banner

Enjoying electric model railroading since 1950.


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« Reply #22 on: February 24, 2007, 01:51:17 AM »

I guess TOC and Stan were both a little confused by traindude 109's "gardes" for "grades"  in his first posting on this thread.

Well, I'm off to install decoders in all my light switches, leaving TOC to have the last word.
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Nathan

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« Reply #23 on: February 24, 2007, 09:42:51 AM »

“Lets look at DC.  You want to run 4 trains, you buy 4 power packs.”

"I  never did that. Even in the old days with block control. Plus, I haven't seen anybody be    able to actually keep track of more than one effectively, two if you're real good, and three?
Do it and I'll engage you in convesation......
Or, as one said.."Really?  I can run several from one.  Maybe mine makes those special volts and amps Stan uses"."

I regulary run two trains with DCC.  If a sceond person is avalable, three or four is no problem.  At a club or group operating seeesion four is easy to do.  At operating sesions on a properly dedigned layout, you can even have a crew for each train.  And you have to watch for 'signals' if they are installed, or watch of other trains, head on's can happen if you do not.

When I run my two trains, one is just  'going on its own' and I am runnig the other one.  At train shows people like to see the trains going both ways on the same track, they don't care if it is DC or DCC.  On a simple loop with four passing sideings  at train shows I regulary run 4 trains on DCC, two each direction.  Yes, I have taken the time to 'match' the locomotives, and even then I have to keep and eye on them, adjusting the spped of one or two of them every so often.  If I have a second person to help, we have run four trains and one locomotive by it self.  I use this one to 'chase' other trains, changing it's direction to change which train it is 'chasing'.

MTS and some versions of the Marklin systems are not DCC.  There are possable problems as a result.

Nathan
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traindude109

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« Reply #24 on: February 25, 2007, 12:58:39 AM »

Well, it seems that every time I say something on this thread, it gets twisted around and suddenly means something else, completely different from what my original post was supposed to mean. So.....I think I am going to just get out now before anything else, again.............

Why is that this always happens to me on these kind of threads. **SIGH**

Well, whatever. Good luck to the rest of you!
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Matt

Boulder Creek and Western Railroad (G scale 1:20.3)
Curmudgeon
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« Reply #25 on: February 26, 2007, 04:38:45 PM »

Join the club.
Just remember to be a clear as possible, as you will get quoted.

Exactly what got twisted around?

Nathan- Ah, yes, loopty-loops.

I've experienced trains just left to run on their own, looping, have seious issues, especially at shows, where some kid reaches over and throws a turnout.

Laying a brick on the dead-man's pedal and letting it run with no engineer is certainly my idea of model railroading!
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Pospete

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« Reply #26 on: March 12, 2007, 02:46:14 AM »

Will the Bachmann DCC E-Z digital command control system work with  Bachmanns own G scale engines that come DCC ready?



 Hey Wally, for what it's worth ( no doubt creating a few more comments) In all my Bachmann Locos I use the MRC 8amp decoder. I've used it in the Diesels and My Climax,( And all the single motor trains) which I even managed to work out and fit a chuff cam on a wheel for syncronised chuff.  I fit sound when I fit the decoder as the MRC decoder does Hum a bit, tho not noticeable with sound on board.
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