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Author Topic: Battery Operation  (Read 6282 times)
cpaul

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« on: June 18, 2008, 02:57:30 PM »

I have a 4-6-0 large scale loco and want to convert it ot battery operation.  Do I have to isolate the motor from the frame on this model?

CM
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A.C. Miller
calenelson
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« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2008, 06:05:57 PM »

Not from the Frame, but from the wheel pickups (tender included) if you plan on running on a track that is supplied with power.  Are you interested in Remote Control or Simple Battery Power?  I have no track power, but isolated my Annie (actually gutted and started over) anyways!

this gent could be of some help!

Dave Goodson
http://dnkgoods.home.mindspring.com/index.html

Give him a call! Wink

cale
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cpaul

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« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2008, 06:36:36 PM »

Thanks cale,

I am just starting out in large scale. 

I'm planning a simple oval (5' x 14') on a raised flower bed and thought I would experiment with using a rechargeable battery connected through a rheostat to to supply track voltage, and eventually move to R/C with on-board battery power.

Building the flower bed has proved to be very challenging. (i'm not the gardening type  Grin)

Thanks again.

CM
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A.C. Miller
calenelson
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« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2008, 07:46:41 PM »

Welcome!

I use and recommend the RCS Brand of RC Control....(no pay, just happy!)
http://rcs-rc.com/

Since you are interested in "just getting started" with battery and mentioned at rheostat you may be interested in Del's Critter Control....for less than $80 complete!!!
http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/DelTapparo/Criiter_Control.htm

here are some other forums you may find interesting? Huh?

http://www.largescalecentral.com/

http://www.mylargescale.com/

http://www.acmrr.org/

http://120pointme.blogspot.com/

http://cs.trains.com/forums/default.aspx?ForumGroupID=7

that should whet your whistle!

again welcome in!

cale
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grumpy

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« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2008, 11:40:47 PM »

I made my layout approx 7'0  x 14'0 . The train runs around the outside and then there is approx an 18" moat filled with 3/4" stone 3" deep and the raised garden is in the centre. The tracks are run on a bed of 8"building block capped with 4x4,paving stone. The raised garden is approx 10" deep made from treated 4x4 timbers.
 Because of the small size all my turns are 4.5'. The biggest problem is overcoming the restrictions created by the small size. My operation is by Aristocraft Train Engineer with power from the track. I was able to squeeze in one siding.
Thiis scale is the most enjoyable for me because the structures are large enough that I have scratch built all my own buidings and most of my own structures.
Have fun.
Don Smiley
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altterrain


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« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2008, 01:47:33 PM »

I'm planning a simple oval (5' x 14') on a raised flower bed and thought I would experiment with using a rechargeable battery connected through a rheostat to to supply track voltage, and eventually move to R/C with on-board battery power.

CM

A typical battery pack used for trains will not work to power your track. Its takes a lot more juice to power track than just a loco and your pack would quickly drain. You can do it with a big gel cell type battery (like a car battery).

-Brian
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cpaul

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« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2008, 10:36:56 AM »

Thanks to everyone for the feedback so far. 

I'm definitely going to order the Enhanced Critter Control.  I like the automated station stop feature.  Smiley

Next step track.

CM


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A.C. Miller
Jim Banner

Enjoying electric model railroading since 1950.


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« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2008, 02:16:49 PM »

Artisocraft (Crest) makes two forms of Train Engineer, the larger track side receiver and the smaller on-board receiver.  The on-board receiver has limited output and limited radio range while the track side receiver can handle up to 10 amps and has a much longer radio range.  I installed a track side receiver and an 18 volt rechargeable drill battery in a Bachmann reefer as a follow car and added a toggle switch to a locomotive so that its motor can run off either a DCC decoder or the follow car.  Pulling half a dozen cars, it ran for over four hours on a single charge on my garden layout with its 3% grades.  Because the top of the Bachmann reefer is easy to remove and because I used a spare charger body as a socket for the drill battery, swapping the batteries takes about 15 seconds.  And the unmodified drill batteries still work perfectly well in my drill.  I have been extremely pleased with this arrangement.
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jsmvmd

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« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2008, 02:59:27 PM »

Dear Jim,

Could you post a schematic of your installation?  This sounds like a nifty project for my electronics student son and his ham fisted dad!  Too, would you post part numbers and sources, please?

Best Wishes,

Jack
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altterrain


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« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2008, 11:09:42 PM »

Its pretty simple to do. I have a TE battery car though I use conventional packs as you can get higher capacity ones than most tool batteries. Here's a good site for doing it -  http://ovgrs.org/ then click on Battery Power and then the Power Cars.

-Brian
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Jim Banner

Enjoying electric model railroading since 1950.


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« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2008, 03:22:26 PM »

Sorry, Jack, but I didn't see your post until just now.  How about I post a few photos?

Brian, the reason I went with drill batteries is that the 18 volt, 1.3 Ah batteries came complete with a drill and a charger for $19.98 a set.  Two of them yielded two batteries, two chargers (one of which I cannibalized for the socket), one 18 volt motor c/w planetary gear box for a future project, and one working drill.  These battery packs will each run a two motor Aristo-Craft RS-3 for 4 hours with half a dozen cars in tow and the socket plus the slightly modified roof on the reefer follow car makes battery changing a snap.  I was really glad to see that I am not the only one using a track side TE as a mobile unit.
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jsmvmd

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« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2008, 04:26:49 PM »

Dear Brian & Jim,

Keep getting timed out! (and still married!)

Will try to post.

I have the 27 Hz TE that Atl. Central talked about. I intend to use it for an HO layout, but also want to run it with LS.

That is why I want to do it cheap, since Jim said he is getting 4 hours. Plenty time for me. Not interested in Li-Po power, just regular "bat-trees."

Best Wishes,

Jack
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Jim Banner

Enjoying electric model railroading since 1950.


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« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2008, 04:09:32 PM »

Jack, here are some photos of what I did.  The first one shows the Train Engineer Receiver ART-5471 (new number CRE55471) D installed in a Bachmann reefer.  To make it fit, I had to take it out of its case, but only a few Phillips head screws are involved.  The receiver shares the reefer  along with a 5 amp fuse B, a spare 5 amp fuse A, and a drill battery charger stand cut down to make a socket for the drill battery C.  If I hadn't had the spare charger stand, I could have cobbled one up with some styrene and phosphor bronze or clock spring for contacts.  Or I might have been lazy and used a plastic spring clamp with the pressure pads covered with stick on copper tape (glass workers foil.)  Hidden at E is a 6 pin Molex socket.  You can use any kind of 2 pin socket here, but I formerly had a 12 volt plus a 6 volt battery permanently installed and needed the extra 4 pins for charging them.



The second photo shows the Molex socket (ugly but functional) on the end of the reefer and the 1300 mAh 18 volt drill battery waiting to be plugged in.  The battery is large enough that the socket hangs below the bottom of the reefer, but not so far as to interfere with the track.  It is also heavy enough that it needed to be mounted dead center in the car. 



The third photo shows why I chose a reef for this job.  When I cut off the loops at the four corners of the roof (green arrow) there were still four more loops to hold the roof on.  But when I want to access the interior, such as to change the battery, all I have to do is open the side doors, spread the top off the car with my finger tips while pushing up gently and the roof pops right off.  The battery can be changed in less than 30 seconds.  The ice hatches also allow easy access to the controls on the end of TE receiver circuit board, and a place to stuff the antenna wire safely into the car when it is put away at the end of the day.



My transmitter is an ART-5471 (new number CRE55471) but with the long telescoping antenna.  I am not sure what the range is, but I am guessing more than 100 feet with the antenna collapsed.  In fact, the only time I have had the antenna on the transmitter pulled out was when the locomotive derailed on a mis-set turnout and a friend blocked the receiving antenna when he rerailed it.  I think the good range is due in part to the receiver board being mounted a bit away from the traction motors and to the antenna being well away from them.  I run the antenna wire down the roof walk of the reefer and then down the roof walk of the following car.  In the one experiment where I ran it over the locomotive, the range was not nearly as good.   The next time I do this (and I already have contracts for two more) I think I will try putting the receiver board and antenna at the trailing end of the car.  Perhaps even more separation from the locomotive motors will give even more range.

The wiring diagram is very simple and can be had by clicking on the link below.  It is quite big, so I didn't want to post it here.

http://members.shaw.ca/sask.rail/TE-RC-follow-car/wiring-2.jpg

I apologize for taking so long to post the photos.  New camera, old brain, you know the story. 
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jsmvmd

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« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2008, 11:11:33 AM »

Dear Jim,

Brilliant!

Thanks a million!

No need to apologize since this response took quite a bit of work.

Electronics is not my line of work, so I get a bit confused. This is simple enough for a baby to do!

Hope to meet you some day, if you ever get to central Pennsylvania so we can spin yarns over a brew!  I live a stone's throw from the Horseshoe Curve.
Best Wishes,

Jack
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jsmvmd

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« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2008, 11:43:04 AM »

Dear Jim,

Based on a conversatio with "Atlantic Central," I purchased a "rubber ducky" antenna which is shorter and less prone to damage.  I have not used it, but intend to get a small garden rr up next summer. Will share some pix with y'all, or "all y'all" !!!

Best Wishes,

jack
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