Max slopes for new HO engines?

[rbryce1]

I have looked over scores of track plans, and either do not like them or they do not fit my area's geometry, mostly the second.  Also, I do not want a point to point layout.

Below is where I am so far, and have already imagined a few revisions as well.  The layout area is 9'-6" (vertical) and 10'-6" (horizontal).  

The turntable is at the lowest level.  The track from the turntable enters a tunnel and proceeds up the dashed pink rail to climb to an elevation of 8".  It exits a tunnel and joins the light orange "Industrial" section which varies between 8-1/2" and 9" in elevation.  One change, the pink dashed track section at the very top will not be concealed like it is shown, but will exit a tunnel above the green track section, become visible, reenter a tunnel above the green track section and finally re-emerge from the mountain where it links to the Industrial track section.

The green and violet track is a passenger/freight line in a mountainous region, where it is between 9" and 12" in elevation, the violet region being the 9" portion and merging with the Industrial scenery.  A station will be there and the siding will be extended to be long enough to hold an entire freight or passenger train.

The portion of grey track between the two green sections is a 24" long trestle spanning a gorge between the two mountains.  

The dark orange section of rail is around a town and which will be slightly lower than the Industrial rail (light orange) and will contain a small lake which will be fed from a waterfall down the mountain and pass under the mountain and industrial rails.  

Again, still lots to work out, but the grades are all at or below 2% everywhere except the concealed section where it is 3%, but again, it will only be traveled by unloaded engines.  Also, ample headroom is available for materials and trains where tracks cross over/under each other.  

Well, that's where I am so far.

[jward]

just a suggestion.     i'd put some connecting tracks between your different loops.  it will add interest when you can shift entire trains between lines.

[rbryce1]

I have been looking really hard at that, but I'm finding it's not very easy due to the different elevations and track radius, which includes 15"R, 18"R, 22"R, 26"R and 28"R.  Some 33.5 partial sections as well to make things work.  Very few of these seem to blend well with Bachmann's turnouts.  

Actually, there may be two points where I can go from the Mountain rail to the Industrial rail and back.  I will try this this evening with Anyrail and see how it fits and works with the desired scenery.  Good suggestion though!

Again, not finished trying yet.

[Doneldon]

rb-

Itlooks like you'll have a busy and interesting layout. I agree with Jeff's suggestion about installing some crossovers. I also think you can put a significant staging yard on your lower level as long as you don't have it too much under the low overhead. Your new grades will tolerate moving whole trains up and down.

I am a little concerned about having any 15" curves. I'd avoid them at all costs.
                                                                                                                      -- D

[rbryce1]

No possible extra room on the lower level.  The visable area has just enough room for the turntable, structures and planned scenery and the non-visable area is consumed with the track getting up to the upper level, which consumed far more real estate than I imagined at a 2-3% slope.  Also, I will be extending the siding on the purple track all the way around to allow much longer trains on the siding, and the purple track section is 9" higher than the turntable level, with a sharp landscape dropping down.  I'm good with that though.

As far as the 15" curves, I share your concern, but there will only be 3 track section at 15", all within the stock yard where there will only be two small switchers and freight cars.  Everything else is 18" R and longer.  The only engines I will be using on the 18" R area will be two 0-6-0 steam engines I have for nostalgia, one looks like it was used at Disney.  Also, may use my newly DCC converted San Fransisco Cable Car. Definitely nothing over 6-7 inches in length on the 18" R sections.

[rbryce1]

Did some more work on my plan and this may be the final run, at least for now.  I loaded two pictures from Anyrail with one showing the tracks, one showing the tracks with scenery and one picture in basic 3D.

The only change I made to the tracks was I took the 4 sidings in the Industrial Yard and made one of them loop back onto the Industrial main line.  I tried to connect two of them, but using just Bachmann track sections, the geometry just was not available.  If I decide to try this, I will need to use some flex track and two different style roadbeds, which is not impossible, just unlikely.  Also, I made use of the #6 double crossovers (shown in light blue) I have to link the Industrial main line with the Residential main line.

I did notice after I shot the plan views photos of the layout there were two small track pieces missing from the Industrial line.  They were mistakenly placed on the landscape layer which was turned off for this photo shot.  They are really there, just not visable on the plan view photo, but are seen on the plan view with landscaping.

Finally, I tried to link the Mountain Rail line (purple) with the rest, but could not.  Everywhere I tried, there just was not the right geometry or the elevations between the two rails were too different.  I was able to extend the secondary siding on the far right enough to hold a very substantial second train and locos.  The scale of the drawing is every dark grid line is 6", every light grid line is 2" and again, the shape is dictated by the parameters within the room (doors, closets, etc).




Pink dashed lines show the rail to transport engines from the turn table level up to the main lines (without any rolling stock) and are hidden under the upper scenery and mountains.  Again, the lime green track section is a 24" long trestle spanning the gorge between the two mountain ranges.








Now back to finish building the Christmas layout so it is done in time.

[jward]

how were you able to colour the tracks?

[rbryce1]

To color the tracks in Anyrail, first you must create a "Section" of tracks.

A section is a stretch of track with a specific function or purpose, as defined by you. You can turn any stretch – that is a connected group of pieces - into a section, as long as both ends have an isolator.

Select the stretch of track click on "Create Section" to make them into a Section.

Once they are a Section,  you can change the color to practically any Windows color by selection the color icon.  You can also give the Section a name and/or specify it's usage.  If you add a new piece of track to the section, it automatically assumes the sections color.

[Doneldon]

rb-

Unless I'm forgetting something from an earlier post or misinterpretting your layout plan, you are building an island layout in the middle of your room. That is generally not the best way to configure a layout. Around the walls looks and works better, provides longer runs, minimizes reach-in distance and allows better clearance/access to the pike. Doors can be a challenge with an around-the-walls plan, but not an insurmountable one. Low windows can also be problematic but windows at normal height aren't much of an issue. I think an around-the-walls plan would solve most of the problems you've had so far, as well as giving you the real estate necessary to connect all of your lines together.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          -- D

[rbryce1]

As I said before, I do have limited room use and several obstacles.  This is all the space I have to work with due to the room's constraints.  I am well aware that if I could use all the walls, it would be better, but I can't!  This room is a Den.  It has a closet, a bathroom and some other furniture.  

Here is the space I have to work with, and only this space.



So again, this is the room, it is 12' X 20' and these are the dimensional constraints and geometrical constraints of the layout.  I appreciate all suggestions, but some things are just not options, and the shape and size of the layout here are my limits.  And before someone suggests that if I crossed over the closet doorway and crawl under the layout to get into the closet, which would allow me to use the entire wall, I remind you I have a wife who will happily tear your guts out (and mine) if that idea is even suggested!!!  So, as they say, Happy Wife, Happy Life.  This is IT!  I've been scanning the papers for an available gymnasium, but they all have model railroads and/or boats in them already!  And, here in Florida, due to the high water tables, a basement is also called an indoor swimming pool!

But really guys, these are my limits and I've pushed them already.  There are some accesses being built into the center and outer edges to provide some operational access to the center areas as best I can.

[jward]

it really does help to see the layout in the context of its surroundings. thanks for posting.

[Doneldon]

rb-

Aha! I see that your circumstances really do prevent an around-the-walls layout. However, I'll still offer one sugestion: Put an opening near the back corner or perhaps in the middle of your large town so you can reach the tracks along the two walls. You won't need that access all of the time, just when there's a problem, so you can probably use a lift out section which won't mess up your structures and scenery. I suggest that you do it in the town area because it won't disturb any tracks. Assuming you'll have power to the town area for lights or other accessories, you may have to unplug a couple of things, but that won't be an issue as long as you put the plugs in from the start.

By the way ... I like your plan.
                                                 -- D

[rbryce1]

Thanks for the suggestion and the compliment.

If you look at the plan, there is a triangle at the top left and a square in the left center that will be my main access locations.  Also, the town in the center of the loops will be made from 24x24 sections which will be removable to provide access to the center if needed.  Plan on covering the 24x24 squares with just ceiling tile covered with grass in the beginning to simulate land, and then replace each with a finished developed block, just like developers do it in the real world! (at least that is the plan!).  Man's gotta have a plan!

For the grid work, I am contemplating using 24x24 suspended ceiling grids to hold 24x24 thick foam sections in place.  The grid will not be visible once the scenery is in place, but I hope it will make it real easy to install and remove as necessary the 24x24 sections.

Again, at least that is the current PLAN!

[Doneldon]

rb-

That corner looks too small to actually get up in to access the tracks there. A removable hatch or two, like you described, will give you access to that corner area, the rectangular area at left center (without disturbing the tracks) snd the trackage between the town area and your engine terminal.
                                                                                                                                                                      -- D

[rbryce1]

The triangle corner is 1/2 of a 24x24 square.  I have tried it and it does work.  I was an engineer on US Navy Nuclear Submarines for 21 years, and I if I was able to get to some of the areas there, I can get to practically anywhere!