Early 4-4-0 traction problem

[NevadaCityChris]

Howdy Folks,
I acquired an "Old Timer" 4-4-0 Bachmann N scale train set. Still has rapido couplers to give you an idea of age. The loco (Jupiter paint job) runs fine after some Very light lubing and some extended 15 min. run time on a test oval. The issue is the lack of pulling power. Any rolling stock added to the train and the drivers just spin the wheels. Not sure if the motor in the tender gets the weight off the drive wheels or maybe the front "4" wheels take off drive weight by supporting too much loco weight. Rubber traction rings are in place and seem to be viable. Any ideas?

[Desertdweller]

These locos were intended only to pull the very light shorty passenger cars and old-time freight cars.

How many cars of what type are you trying to pull?

Les

[James in FL]

Hi NevadaCityChris,

A couple of things...

First, clean your entire track with some isopropyl alcohol and a lint free cloth. I like to use 91% I buy at the CVS.
Second, clean all your Lokie wheels with the same iso applied to a Q-Tip. Lightly press the tip to all the spinning drive wheels (yes, the ones with traction tires also). Turn the pony truck wheels and the tender wheels with your finger while holding the Q-tip against them. Do the same to all your rolling stock wheels.
Third, Check how free the pony truck and tender wheels spin. Check all the wheels on your rolling stock as well. You want all your wheels to spin as free as possible.
You have to be careful when lubing the side rods at the crank pins. Excess oil will be spun outward down to the wheel contact surface (centrifugal force). I prefer lite oil here rather than extra or ultra-lite.
No lube on rolling stock axel points.

Try this and see if you have some improvement.

Good Luck

[NevadaCityChris]

DD, one of the old time box cars from the set is "OK". Add The second car, everything slow and slips s on the curves.
So...Les. I will give everything a good wipe with Alcohol and see what happens. When I ordered this off EBay I was hoping to get one of the later release units that Spookshow.net gave a "B". Turned out to be older than I wished. It definitely runs better after some "break-in" running.
I was thinking of trying to add some chunks of thick solder under the body...

[bobwrgt]

Old traction tires can get hard and brittle with age. This will cause them to slip easy. I have taken Bullfrog Snot and painted it on over them and it grips better. You might also try a thin coat of clear silicone over the traction tire. Both work well and improve grip of the drivers. Make sure you wait for it to dry.

Bob

[NevadaCityChris]

Hi Bob,
Bullfrog Snot is a new one on me.
Is this a trade name or a nick name for something like E-6000 cement?
I would assume application with a toothpick or something equally small.

Hi James,
Thanks for the tip on checking the the free wheeling. Turns out one of the wheels on the tender (electrical pickup no less) is jammed or frozen and I now have a small flat spot where the wheel ground down on the rails! Once I get it free, will do more checking.

NC Chris

(Nevada City, CA is home of the Nevada County Narrow Gauge Railroad Museum! The members there get to run a 12" to the foot train ;-) )

[Mike C]

 Chris , Bullfrog snot is a real product. Comes in a small bottle and does work to help add traction. http://www.bullfrogsnot.com/   I believe you have more of a problem though. The tender trucks are made of a cheap potmetal that tends to expand with age. The truck frames are, I'm guessing, pinching the wheels and causing them not to turn. There was a discussion on Trainboard.com a couple months ago where a gentleman was having problems with a couple older 4-4-0s. He tried just about everything to get them to spin freely, but had little success. You could try fileing the frames a bit, but I wouldn't expect too much. Sorry.  It may be possible to send your loco in to Bachmanns service dept. where they may replace it for you.....Mike

[James in FL]

To get the tender trucks off look here;

http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/dwg/dwgs/11751.pdf

[NevadaCityChris]

Will be attempting the Bull Frog Snot over the traction tires.

Anyone have experience with sending in a warranty to BMann after the snot has been applied?
Just getting some feed back to see if the effort to send it is worth it if I can't get the tender truck/wheel to spin free.

Thanks folks
NC Chris

[Don Stafford]

Haven't had any experience with sending a "snotted" loco to Bachmann, but they replaced an aged and limping 0-6-0 of mine for $15 a few months ago.
I improved mine's traction by adding a thin slab of lead to the top of the cab. After painting to match it doesn't look strange unless you're a real purist.
These are wonderful little locos which the potential for improvements such as conversion to MT couplers and even addition of DCC decoders.
Good luck.

[TJ]

I have several of these little beauties all MT equipped. May I suggest loosing one screw on the tender shown in the diagram then place the MT 1128-1130's in the coupler pocket, I found that 1128-1129 worked the best for this conversion.

MT 1128-1130's Are now

MT 00130012
MT 00130013
MT 00130014

                     T.J

[Don Stafford]

TJ.. Are the 1128-1130s (00130012/13/14s) offset?  I had to do some Dremel work on the one I converted using  (I think) an 1115 0r 1116.

[TJ]

TJ.. Are the 1128-1130s (00130012/13/14s) offset?  I had to do some Dremel work on the one I converted using  (I think) an 1115 0r 1116.

You have a incoming email.

       T.J

[NevadaCityChris]

BFS update on the 4-4-0 old timer
The good, bad and ugly.
Well folks, the Bull Frog Snot application went well after some trial and my error. My suggestion is to anyone using it, please follow the instructions! Use a small amount and make sure the wheels are turning away from your tooth pick applicator. Too much on the pick and the BFS gets everywhere (ugly).
My traction issues unfortunately have not diminished.
I can pull just one car. Two cars and all we can do is spin the drivers. Rats! Back to the drawing board. Sure like the look of this little loco. Might try the extra weight on the cab...
Thanks for listening
NC Chris

[Mike C]

John Moore at Trainboard did an extensive rebuild of these last year. Here is the thread.   
http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine/showthread.php?148882-Improving-the-electrical-pick-up-of-the-Bmann-4-4-0&highlight=bachmann+4-4-0