Plug-n-Play speaker connect?

[Greg Elmassian]

Of course...

Since this has the updated electronics...

The first thing is to be sure the stock bachmann motherboard is powered, otherwise none of the chuff electronics work.

Then try your voltmeter on the chuff sensor (and reference minus with the other probe)

I think you may find that the Bachmann sensor goes POSITIVE when it should "chuff"

Most sound board electronics were designed to detect NEGATIVE when it should "chuff"

This has been changed over the years in Bachmann locos, so you need to determine yourself.

did you actually test the Revo independently? You stated "it should work", but you did not explicitly verify that connecting the 2 pads on the revo made it chuff...

I don't remember, but I thought there was also a setting in the Revo to switch from autochuff to triggered chuff.

[StanAmes]

Greg

The K27 board has chuffs that go positive when a chuff is made. (Note we now have a replacement chuff board that goes negative)

All the Bachmann Locomotives since the K27 that have a chuff circuit that goes to ground when the chuff is trigerred.

I suggested 4 steps for Pete to take

1) ensure the revolution chuff is configured correctly by taking the revolution chuff trigger input and touching it to ground.  You should get a chuff each time you make a connection to ground and no autochuff.

2) As you suggested make sure there is DC voltage on the Bachmann's B+ and ground connections.

3) if 1 and 2 are successful try bending the revolution pin J1-5 so that it does not make a connection to the Bachmann main board.  This may not be required but I have no idea if JK makes any connection to this pin

4) Connect the revolution chuff input pin to the Bachmann Chuff Sensor on the main board ensuring that the connection does not overlap to any other solder pad.

Hope this helps

Stan

[Greg Elmassian]

Yeah, good safety idea on pin 5, I have a revolution, so I might check that myself, but there were abortive attempts at Aristo to control the smoke unit... remember the Digitrax what DG583 or some similar number?

Also good catch on making the ground common between boards.

Greg

[Fred2179]

make sure there is DC voltage on the Bachmann's B+ and ground connections

It actually has a battery squashed behind the motherboard, connected to the battery input, and the loco and chuff work fine - except the chuff isn't synchronized.
I will try grounding the chuff trigger, but I think the trigger wire from the Revo is connected to the Chuff Sensor pad and nothing changed.  See my photo on post #14.

[Greg Elmassian]

I looked, and I thought there was a menu setting for autochuff vs triggered chuff.... but I don't see it in the manual...

something does not make sense, as there should be a setting I think...

try just "flicking the chuff wire to ground... also the other wire should do the whistle..

[StanAmes]

make sure there is DC voltage on the Bachmann's B+ and ground connections

It actually has a battery squashed behind the motherboard, connected to the battery input, and the loco and chuff work fine - except the chuff isn't synchronized.
I will try grounding the chuff trigger, but I think the trigger wire from the Revo is connected to the Chuff Sensor pad and nothing changed.  See my photo on post #14.

Please follow all 4 steps I posted providing the answers for each step.  You need to check the voltage at the B+ and Ground  Battery input 1 is connected to J1-1 and J1-12 only when you have the battery switch on.  It is not connected to B+ and ground.  I believe the revolution provides this voltage but best to confirm.

In step 2 you need to disconnect the solid conection to the Chuff sensor and simply "flicking the chuf wire to the locomotive ground" as Greg suggests.  Each time you flick the chuff wire to groud you should get a single chuff. If the revolution is in auto chuff mode then you might get a whistle of bell sound.

You need to disconnect the chuff wire to the sensor when you do this, If there is no voltage on B+ to ground you will get no chuff and if the Revolution  is not configured for sensor chuff you also will get no chuff.

Your photo shows how you connected wires to the Bachmann board.  I believe this is a revolution issue and not a bachmenn locomotive issue. 

Stan

[Fred2179]

1) ensure the revolution chuff is configured correctly by taking the revolution chuff trigger input and touching it to ground.

OK. Yes, that works.

) As you suggested make sure there is DC voltage on the Bachmann's B+ and ground connections.

Yes, there is power between the GND pins and B+.

4) Connect the revolution chuff input pin to the Bachmann Chuff Sensor on the main board

And that worked - we have 4 chuffs per rotation [I was going to type 'revolution' but that might be confusing.]  Thank you.

What is confusing is the Revo talks abut the 'common' trigger pin, but there is no indication whether that is the same as motherboard GND or not.

3) if 1 and 2 are successful try bending the revolution pin J1-5 so that it does not make a connection to the Bachmann main board

It doesn't look to be connected, so before I snipped it off, I figured I would continue testing, which had the required results.

Thanks for all the inputs and help. Pity the Revolution isn't completely plug-n-play.

[Greg Elmassian]

Actually it was developed before the advent of an international standard

and the Bachmann K27 has a reversed chuff logic (stock)

so you can blame Aristo, Bachmann and whatever else.

Your main issue was the Bachmann logic, which is NOT Aristo's fault... if you want to say:

"Pity the Revolution isn't completely plug-n-play."

then you are blaming Aristo... in this specific case, you need to blame Bachmann...

Although in this case, it seems that Bachmann has a solution that would have made it plug and play.

[Fred2179]

Your main issue was the Bachmann logic,

How do you figure that? The Bachmann motherboard seeems to be set up for a proper p-n-p board. My problem was/is that the Revo doesn't have it's speaker output on the correct pins, nor does it use the J1-5 chuff sensor pin. If they had done that, I wouldn't have had all this trial-and-error.

[Greg Elmassian]

Huh? Oh, you want the Aristo product invented and designed before ANY socket other than Aristo existed... that socket to be updated to current sockets?

Yeah, I get that, it would be nice... but the Revolution is no longer supported by Aristo, because they went out of business, and believe me, no one is getting rich on ANY G scale only electronic product.

Phoenix sound - gone
Soundtraxx Sierra - gone
Aristo - gone
Locolinc - tragically small market share
Piko - they oem from major DCC manufactures.

But, why not? Why not contact the Revolution people and ask for a new board layout... (of course what NMRA standard? 21MTC? now that would make sense, but too much work)

What is the suggestion? Surely not the non-standard Bachmann socket? (no offense Bachmann, you need to embrace a standard socket NMRA and MOROP/NEM)