4-4-0 - Your opinions, please

[Pacific Northern]

Copied from the Model Railroader review

Steam fans now have a superdetailed American-type to add to their HO scale rosters. Bachmann's Spectrum modernized 4-4-0 American comes equipped with a factory-installed dual-mode Digital Command Control (DCC) decoder, so the model is ready to run on DC or DCC layouts. American Standard. By the latter half of the 1800s, locomotives with a 4-4-0 wheel arrangement were so prevalent in the U.S. that they were classified as the American Standard or American type. A surge in new locomotive designs in the early 20th century quickly made the 4-4-0 obsolete, and few new Americans were built after 1900. Many 4-4-0s remained in service on Class 1 railroads through the 1920s and on short lines into the 1950s. A "modernized" American. The prototype for the Bachmann 4-4-0 is Maryland & Pennsylvania no. 6. American Locomotive Co.'s Richmond Works delivered this engine along with two identical locomotives, nos. 4 and 5, to the Ma & Pa in 1901. These 4-4-0s were similar to other modernized American-type engines built for several other railroads around the country.

The model's dimensions match drawings of Ma & Pa no. 6 published in the March 1965 issue of Model Railroader. Cab style, stack and dome arrangement, piping and other details also match prototype photos of no. 6.

The drawings show no. 6 with piston-valve cylinders that were added to the locomotive in 1924. Some of the Bachmann 4-4-0s also have these cylinders. The sample we reviewed has the earlier slide-valve type but has other features of a modernized 4-4-0, such as a steel cab, and an electric headlight.
Roadname-specific details. Our sample came decorated and detailed as Maine Central no. 84. The Bachmann engine has a tapered boiler and dome and stack arrangements similar to modernized 4-4-0s found on the MEC as well as other roads. The model has roadname-specific details, such as the cab type (wood or steel) and the headlight type (with or without visor), and bell, headlight, and classification light arrangements.

Our MEC sample has a factory-installed solid pilot and coal bunker. Two different types of user-installed spoked pilots as well as a footboard pilot and wood and oil bunkers are included.
Model construction. Most of the Bachmann engine is made of die-cast metal. The quality of the boiler casting is excellent with sharp cast-in details, including rivets and boiler bands. Other detail parts, such as the bell, whistle, air compressor, and piping, are metal.

The cab has a detailed molded-in backhead with a separately applied throttle, painted figures, and window glazing, including open wind deflectors. Another neat detail is the hinged cab apron.

The tender has a plastic tank with well-defined rivet detail. The metal archbar trucks include safety chains. These rattle a bit when the locomotive is under way, but they sure look cool.

Paint coverage is smooth and all lettering is crisp and opaque. The railroad roman font looks close to that used by the MEC. The Alco/Manchester builder's plate is legible and shows a built date of July 1905 and construction number 37754.
Drive train. Inside the boiler, a five-pole can motor and brass flywheel are enclosed in a metal housing. A cogged belt connected to the motor drives a worm shaft that runs below the motor. This shaft drives a worm gear on the front axle driver. This arrangement is the same as on other Bachmann HO steamers.

The model picks up power from both sets of drivers and all the tender wheels. Inside the tender, the DCC decoder is plugged into an 8-pin socket on a printed circuit (PC) board. Two sets of wires connect the PC board in the tender to a two-pin and a four-pin socket, each located under the rear of the engine's cab.
DCC on board. The model has a factory-installed dual-mode two-function one-amp decoder that operated correctly. I found I could turn the headlight on and off by pressing function 0 and dim the headlight (for Rule 17 lighting) by pressing function 1.

The decoder supports some configuration variable (CV) programming. A printed instruction manual for the decoder wasn't included, but you can find programming information for E-Z Command decoders on Bachmann's Web site.
HO scale 4-4-0Price: $240.00
Manufacturer
Bachmann Industries Inc.
1400 E. Erie St.
Philadelphia, PA 19124
www.bachmanntrains.com
Description: Metal and plastic ready-to-run steam locomotive with dual-mode DCC
Road names: Maine Central; Maryland & Pennsylvania nos. 4 and 5, each with wood cab; Ma & Pa no. 6 with steel cab; Seaboard; Southern (green); painted/unlettered with steel cab, or painted/unlettered with wood cab, or undecorated Russia iron jacket with pinstripes and wood cab
Performance. The 4-4-0 can run on DC or DCC layouts. In both DC and DCC the engine's speed range allowed for realistic performance, but its top speed was a bit high for a model based on a prototype with only 62" drivers.

In DC the model began moving at 3.8 scale miles per hour, and its headlight shone dimly. The headlight reached full brightness at 3 volts with the engine running at 10 mph. The model's top speed at 12 volts was 108 scale miles per hour. Real 4-4-0s of the same size and type had a maximum speed of between 60 and 70 mph.

The model's decoder supports 28 speed steps. We tested DCC performance using an MRC Prodigy Advance system that delivers 16.4 volts to the track. In DCC, the 4-4-0 began moving in speed step 6 at 4.2 scale miles per hour and accelerated to 59 mph in step 14 and to a top speed of 98 mph in step 28.

Initially, our sample had a noticeable lurch when starting in DCC. Increasing the value of CV 2 (starting voltage) slightly to 15 and adding some acceleration and deceleration (I set CVs 3 and 4 to a value of 5) made the lurch disappear and let the model run more realistically at slow speeds.

I ran the model through a 15"-radius curve of Atlas track, but the
4-4-0 looked better rounding the wider-radius curves of our Black River Junction project layout. It ran through that layout's no. 4 turnouts without any derailments.

The model's pulling power is below average but is enough for trains appropriate to a locomotive of its size. On straight and level track the 4-4-0's drawbar pull equaled 34 HO scale freight cars.

The Bachmann modernized 4-4-0's excellent level of detail and factory-equipped DCC control make it a standout locomotive for a steam

[richG]

Excellant. I have heard bits and pieces about the loco but never saw this review.

Rich

[Beatthe9ers]

Okay, that pretty much seals it for me.  Thanks for the heads up on the ebay seller, those look like terrific deals.  At that sort of price, you can afford to put in a new decoder if you don't like the one it comes with and still be way ahead.

[Yampa Bob]

Thanks drhone,
It's a must have for me, probably the Russia Iron.

Bob

[sparkyjay31]

The Spectrum 4-4-0 is an OUTSTANDING locomotive from a looks and operational standpoint; however, it struggles pull two 80' coaches on a flat grade, so you should be close with 5 cars.

There is nothing even in this engine's league with other 4-4-0 offerings from anyone, and it really is sweet sitting next to a couple of Spectrum
4-6-0's.

Matt

I'll disagree with you if that is all your 4-4-0 will pull.  My Roundhouse 4-4-0 has not trouble at all with my 4 fifty foot B&M coaches and a 2% grade around an 18" radius.

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

The Spectrum 4-4-0 is an OUTSTANDING locomotive from a looks and operational standpoint; however, it struggles pull two 80' coaches on a flat grade, so you should be close with 5 cars.

There is nothing even in this engine's league with other 4-4-0 offerings from anyone, and it really is sweet sitting next to a couple of Spectrum
4-6-0's.

Matt

I'll disagree with you if that is all your 4-4-0 will pull.  My Roundhouse 4-4-0 has not trouble at all with my 4 fifty foot B&M coaches and a 2% grade around an 18" radius.

Maybe it's the coaches, not the locomotive. Are those 80-foot coaches Bachmann Spectrums? They're pretty heavy. My Mantua Atlantic with a can motor really struggles to pull four of them. Are those B&M 50-foot coaches Roundhouse cars? I have a couple of them myself and don't think they're particularly heavy.

[sparkyjay31]

The Spectrum 4-4-0 is an OUTSTANDING locomotive from a looks and operational standpoint; however, it struggles pull two 80' coaches on a flat grade, so you should be close with 5 cars.

There is nothing even in this engine's league with other 4-4-0 offerings from anyone, and it really is sweet sitting next to a couple of Spectrum
4-6-0's.

Matt

I'll disagree with you if that is all your 4-4-0 will pull.  My Roundhouse 4-4-0 has not trouble at all with my 4 fifty foot B&M coaches and a 2% grade around an 18" radius.

Maybe it's the coaches, not the locomotive. Are those 80-foot coaches Bachmann Spectrums? They're pretty heavy. My Mantua Atlantic with a can motor really struggles to pull four of them. Are those B&M 50-foot coaches Roundhouse cars? I have a couple of them myself and don't think they're particularly heavy.

Mine are indeed the Roundhouse 50' cars.  Not very heavy at all.  Maybe you are right and that is the difference.  My apoligies as I did not think of the different manufacturers and car weight.  Rookie mistake.

[richG]

I have the Roundhouse 4-4-0 and it pull a little more than the Spectrum as they have two drivers with rubber tires. I have tried this with the same rolling stock for both locos. Same grade, same curves.
The Spectrum loco by itself, weighs 7 oz. The tender weighs 2.3 oz.
The Roundhouse loco by itself weighs 8.5 oz. The tender weighs 2 oz.
I picked up a small scale good to about 10 oz from ebay a couple years ago. It was about $20.00 and perfect for weighing model trains.
The Spectrum is still a better looking loco.

Rich

[wade]

The Richmond 4-4-0 is pretty typcial of the type being built from about 1890 into the early 1900's (the prototypes were built in 1901).  It might be a bit too modern for the 1880's, though.  Ma & Pa 4, 5 and 6 ran into the 1930's, when No. 4 was retired.  No. 5 was retired in about the mid-1940's, while No. 6 lasted until the end of 1950.  No. 6 was the only one of the three to get modernized with the piston valves and steel cab.  The model will likely pull up to 8 small, free-rolling freight cars on level track, thought that is probably its limit. 

Accually #6 lasted into '52 and it even got a superheater, #5 was retired around '36 but did get a steel cab before retirement (I heard it was wrecked - not too bad but not worth fixing in the Depression) and #4 was retired in '47 and kept her wood cab to the end.
I can't help it - Ma&Pa is sacred in our family. By the way, the Bachmann #6 is such a good runner it has displaced my brass #6.
  Wade

[Pacific Northern]

The Spectrum 4-4-0 is an OUTSTANDING locomotive from a looks and operational standpoint; however, it struggles pull two 80' coaches on a flat grade, so you should be close with 5 cars.

There is nothing even in this engine's league with other 4-4-0 offerings from anyone, and it really is sweet sitting next to a couple of Spectrum
4-6-0's.

Matt

I'll disagree with you if that is all your 4-4-0 will pull.  My Roundhouse 4-4-0 has not trouble at all with my 4 fifty foot B&M coaches and a 2% grade around an 18" radius.

Maybe it's the coaches, not the locomotive. Are those 80-foot coaches Bachmann Spectrums? They're pretty heavy. My Mantua Atlantic with a can motor really struggles to pull four of them. Are those B&M 50-foot coaches Roundhouse cars? I have a couple of them myself and don't think they're particularly heavy.

Mine are indeed the Roundhouse 50' cars.  Not very heavy at all.  Maybe you are right and that is the difference.  My apoligies as I did not think of the different manufacturers and car weight.  Rookie mistake.

Note the following specs from the review.

The model's pulling power is below average but is enough for trains appropriate to a locomotive of its size. On straight and level track the 4-4-0's drawbar pull equaled 34 HO scale freight cars.

I think there may be an axle or wheel problem.

I pull either 3 of the new Rapido cars or 4 of the 60' Riverossi coaches.

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

The Spectrum 4-4-0 is an OUTSTANDING locomotive from a looks and operational standpoint; however, it struggles pull two 80' coaches on a flat grade, so you should be close with 5 cars.

There is nothing even in this engine's league with other 4-4-0 offerings from anyone, and it really is sweet sitting next to a couple of Spectrum
4-6-0's.

Matt

I'll disagree with you if that is all your 4-4-0 will pull.  My Roundhouse 4-4-0 has not trouble at all with my 4 fifty foot B&M coaches and a 2% grade around an 18" radius.

Maybe it's the coaches, not the locomotive. Are those 80-foot coaches Bachmann Spectrums? They're pretty heavy. My Mantua Atlantic with a can motor really struggles to pull four of them. Are those B&M 50-foot coaches Roundhouse cars? I have a couple of them myself and don't think they're particularly heavy.

Mine are indeed the Roundhouse 50' cars.  Not very heavy at all.  Maybe you are right and that is the difference.  My apoligies as I did not think of the different manufacturers and car weight.  Rookie mistake.

Fuggedaboudit.    It occurs to me now that how free-rolling the wheels are on the coaches probably also affects the performance of the locomotive.

And I'm glad for drhone's follow-up. Sent me back to read the review again. I'd been wondering whether the Richmond 4-4-0 would take a 15"-radius curve. Apparently it will, but it won't look very good doing it (few locomotives do). I'd missed that in the review.

[Beatthe9ers]

I don't get this.  Am I understanding correctly that the review says that the loco has enough pulling power for 34 freight cars, yet drhone, in real world conditions, can only pull 4 Riverossi Coaches?  Am I to assume that a 60' Riverossi coach weighs about the same as 8 or 9 40' freight cars?

What am I missing?

[Matt Bumgarner]

As I said, my 4-4-0 struggles with a couple of 80' coaches, and yes, they have stock wheelsets, not some $12 precision crafted laser-honed doo-hickies. I wish they did, but they don't.

I'm ok with it because I generally pull a small combine and two shorter coaches; or, 4 to 6 forty foot cars. I don't see anyway/anyhow that MR found it to have the tractive effort to pull 34 cars. Or 24 for that matter. Or even 14.

That being said, it is a *GREAT* locomotive, and given my model roster and the real life one I model, the 4-4-0 was the weakest of the bunch anyway. That's why it was/and is assigned to my branchline short passenger train.

Matt

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

I don't get this.  Am I understanding correctly that the review says that the loco has enough pulling power for 34 freight cars, yet drhone, in real world conditions, can only pull 4 Riverossi Coaches?  Am I to assume that a 60' Riverossi coach weighs about the same as 8 or 9 40' freight cars?

What am I missing?

Something does seem a little goofy there, doesn't it?

I'm ok with it because I generally pull a small combine and two shorter coaches; or, 4 to 6 forty foot cars. I don't see anyway/anyhow that MR found it to have the tractive effort to pull 34 cars. Or 24 for that matter. Or even 14.

And I guess a combine and a couple of coaches, or six freight cars, is prototypical for a circa-1900 eight-wheeler anyway.

[SteamGene]

Remember that MR's pulling test is on "straight and level" track.  Your mileage may vary greatly.
Gene