Wiring Standards.....

[Ten Wheeler]

Recently I had a real wiring headache with a new Bachmann Spectrum 4-8-2 Light Mountain.... and a B'mann Vandy tender that I bought from Bachmann to use with the new engine instead of the original USRA tender that came with that locomotive. I decided to write NMRA, because this model is clearly advertised as DCC Ready, and has DCC Ready printed both on the instruction sheet, and the box that the locomotive was packaged in. The forum thread where I posted the details of the hard-wiring of both the Bachmann locomotive & tender is shown below... in case you want the whole story.

                                                             Http://www.2guyz.info/Forums/viewtopic/t=4843.HTML
 
I have just received the reply back from NMRA, only to find that NMRA Tech, Bill Jameson... had the same exact problem with a Con Cor locomotive that he had purchased.  He explained that "DCC READY" actually means nothing.... unless it is accompanied by the NMRA Conformance Warrant seal  !!! ( Which is an oval, or "football" shaped sticker or imprint)  Manufacturers are free to list their engines as DCC Ready and DCC Installed without conforming to any NMRA Standard.  I have 5 Bachmann Spectrum , 4 BLI, and 1 Proto locomotive, and I have just checked the boxes and I did not see a "football shaped" seal.  Here is Jamison's e-mail reply...  I'm just baffled by Bachmann's practice to keep building such great looking, and great performing locomotives that do not seem to honor the standard wiring conventions!

Read it and weep !!!!

Bob Hollowell
IronGoat@comcast.net

       

-------Original Message-------

From: b-n-ferrco@cfl.rr.com
Date: 6/26/2008 4:10:35 PM
To: Robert Hollowell
Subject: Re: Fw: Wiring issues...

Hi Robert,

I really hate to hear modelers having the kind of problems that you are having.  I don't know much about the Bachmann Spectrum line of steam locomotives.  However, I will try to shed some light on the term "DCC Ready."

Is there an NMRA Conformance "Football" on the package that the models came in?  If  an NMRA Conformance Warrant that has been issued for this model, I would expect the wiring to conform to the NMRA standard.  If there is no Conformance Warrant issued for the model, the manufacturer is free to do what ever they want as long as the model runs on DC (and DCC if they claim it to be "DCC Ready").

The term "DCC Ready" is rather vague and leaves a lot of room for interpretation.  In the most basic term, "DCC Ready" means that you can remove the jumpers in the model that allow it to run on DC and install (Plug and Play) a DCC decoder and have the model run on DCC.  "DCC Ready" makes no claim to be compliant with the NMRA DCC standards other than to run on DCC and have the basic light functions work, i.e.; front head light on when going forward and rear head light on when backing up.

I recently purchased a Con Cor Zephyr in HO scale.  I also purchased the "add on car" when it was released.  The "add on car" had the wiring for track power wired back wards to the rest of the train.  What really got me, the "add on car" came with instructions that stated that the second run of the basic train was wired backwards to first run of the train and the car was wired to match the second run of the train.  So the first thing that I had to do was take the model a part and fix the wiring problem.  The model did not have a Conformance Warrant issued to it so I was not surprised.

The only time a model meets the NMRA Standards is when it has a Conformance Warrant issued to it.  If there is a problem with a model that has been issued a Conformance Warrant and the Tech Department is notified, we can retest the model to insure that it still meets the Standard.  If the model fails to meet the standards, the manufacture is advised that the Conformance Warrant has been revoked and to remove the Warrant from the packaging.

Regards
William E. Jameson
Coordinator, HO Standards

[Hunt]

Trust you have William E. Jameson permission to post his reply to you?

It seems this is news to you but it is not for some.

I have posted the working definition of DCC Ready for many years!

DCC Ready means the motor brushes are isolated from the power pickups and there is some means to accept the installation of a decoder... a socket, solder pads, wires or something else.



The easiest way to isolate the motor bushes is to isolate the motor.

Also note wiring is a NMRA Recommend Practice not a NMRA Standard.

Bob,
Are you the IronGoat that posted on Newbie Choo-Choo's forum when he was alive?

[Ten Wheeler]

No Hunt, I have never posted on Newbie Choo-Choo's forum (this is the first I've ever heard of it)

As I said, I have five B'mann Spectrum lokeys and I love 'em... I just have a hard time with the difference in the wiring. I have heard this same thing from the owners of LHS, members of my train club, and folks on several forums, etc.  None of them are "enemies" of B'mann... they, like me, would just love to see an improvement in the wiring standardization.

[Hunt]

. . . would just love to see an improvement in the wiring standardization.

Most of us would. Relevant documentation would be better for it would include a wiring diagram.

[Ten Wheeler]

AMEN, Hunt !!! I would be one happy camper if they would just do that... as I am no "wiring wizard", and these hard-wire jobs really get to me.

Thanks, Bob/Iron Goat

[Pacific Northern]

Seeing as Bachmann is selling individual tenders I would assume that wiring diagrams would be available for all of the Spectrum steam engines as well as each of the different tenders.

I wonder how many DCC on board engines have been victims of mis-matched tender swaps?

[SteamGene]

Never assume!  There are at least three different curcuit boards, none of them compatable in Bachmann tenders.  Then there is the problem, at least in in instance, where male and female plugs are backwards to everything else. 
Gene

[ta152h0]

Bachmann is an international company, that probably has to adhere to the standards of each country ( or lack of ). I can imagine the nightmare of standarising wiring with so many distributors all over the globe and Ebay to boot, all crossing political boundaries. You have to have pretty good eyes to solder nine wires to circuit boards in the correct order, specially if the wires are all black. I  have a MANTUA loco that I need  to " rewire " and the way it looks, the beast will remain in the box.. I guess with a lot of patience and a decent ohmmeter, with my favorite music, i can rewire the beast.  Long gone are the days when you could only get one steam engine, as long as it is black     Oh yeah, the directive at work has always been, anything you put in an email can and will be used against you.