Northern 4-8-4 Santa Fe 3780 Empire Builder Locomotive Issues

[geo61bird]

Hello,

I picked up a Bachmann Empire Builder Set #24009 last week Friday and have had some fun enjoying it since then.

I have a few questions regarding the Locomotive.

#1 My second drive axle inline has a horrible wobble to it that sometimes can derail the locomotive, worse at slow speeds. When the wobble is at it's worst the wheel does not make contact with the track. So every 1 revolution it will pound the loco back down on the track and you can hear and feel it on the table top.
The pistons are not binding and the axles are quartered correctly with the axle hubs seated properly. What happens is that after one rotation the right side binds and the axle will lift off the track like it wants to jump an internal gear. Maybe a high spot or warped drive gear? Bent or not seated correct axle?



#2 The rear guide truck side mounts hang far down almost touching the railroad ties. There is a lot of play in the axle in the seat of the truck. Not good. Mounting screw is properly adjusted to locomotive.



#3 The draw bar has a slight bend in it. Is it supposed to be straight or is the slight bend part of the leveling?


All in all the train does go around the track pretty decent but the front truck tend to derail when the loco wobbles from the out of shape second axle... is this a normal thing for these trains? Am I expecting to much from this train? I only say that because the other three axles are perfectly straight and do not bind or wobble and run very smooth, if that was the case with all four axles I would have to believe the train would run super smooth and perfect.

P.S. all of the rolling stock in the set function great with no derailments and the EZ track is so so much better than my set from the 90's...  

Any suggestions are welcome. Thank you for your time.

[brokemoto]

Number 3 driver pair is out of quarter.  I do not know if it is connected to the main road, but, if it is, that could be the source of your trouble.

It does look as if the truck is sitting too low.  There should not be that much play in the seat/bearing of the trailing truck.

I do not know which version of this you have; there have been several.   I have only the very oldest version of this, with the half wheels live tender.  That one ran horribly.  In fact, the first time that I put it onto the track, GF asked me if it were broken.   Subsequent versions of this had an electrically neutral tender.  They were not the best runners.  I do have several tenders from the later issues of this.  Neither they, nor the oldest version, have an "bent", "angled" or anything but a straight drawbar.

The last version of this one is supposed to be allright.   I do not have it, so there is not much that I could comment about it.

Considering that there appears to be some manufacturing defect in the trailing truck, I would send it in to Bachmann and ask for a repair or replacement.

[geo61bird]

Number 3 driver pair is out of quarter.  I do not know if it is connected to the main road, but, if it is, that could be the source of your trouble.

axle 3 does not attach to the rods

It does look as if the truck is sitting too low.  There should not be that much play in the seat/bearing of the trailing truck.

I fixed this by seating it better in it's slots

I do not know which version of this you have; there have been several.   I have only the very oldest version of this, with the half wheels live tender.  That one ran horribly.  In fact, the first time that I put it onto the track, GF asked me if it were broken.   Subsequent versions of this had an electrically neutral tender.  They were not the best runners.  I do have several tenders from the later issues of this.  Neither they, nor the oldest version, have an "bent", "angled" or anything but a straight drawbar.

It's brand new, no pick up from tender. plastic white and black drive gears.

[Mike C]

Return it for replacement . The new one is supposed to be better .

[spookshow]

A common issue with Bachmann steam locomotives is eccentric driver motion due to poorly rendered chassis cutouts. If the cutouts in the chassis (wherein the driver bearing blocks seat) are not cut/molded properly, the bearing blocks will be free to move around more than they should, thus creating eccentric movement on the drivers.

The simple fix is to pull out the offending bearing block and add a shim to the cutout (I use a small piece of electrical tape). Or failing that, just send the offending loco back to Bachmann for replacement.

Cheers,
-Mark

[geo61bird]

My loco doesn't have gears on the three axles show in this diagram, only the middle two have sprockets.

Is this normal?




Glad I got my F7A in the mail today, runs awesome, nothing but frustration from the Northern...   

[brokemoto]

I do not know about the missing gear as I do not have that locomotive.   Perhaps Spookshow or someone else on this forum who has it does.

If you are buying other locomotives, and want a steam locomotive, you might try a SPECTRUM 2-8-0.

The earlier runs of this one did not have a factory installed decoder.   If you find one from the first two runs, it is try-before-you-buy.  If you get a good one, you get a really good one.  Do be aware that it will require a very long break-in.  The last run of the 2-8-0 does have a decoder.

There is a USRA light 4-8-2 that did not have a decoder, as well.  The first run had some problems with the tyred driver's making proper contact with the rails.   I understand that B-mann addressed this in subsequent runs of it, but I do not have any from other than the first run.

There is a USRA heavy 4-8-2 as well as a Baldwin 4-6-0 and an ALCo 2-6-0.  All of them are excellent runners, but they do have factory decoders in them.  They are supposed to be dual mode decoders, and, the locomotives will run on DC, but the last two do run better on DCC with the decoder present.  If you take out the decoder from the 4-6-0 and 2-6-0 and re-wire, they are very good runners, especially at slow speed.   There is a 4-6-0 available in a trainset without a decoder.  It runs well.

The USRA heavy 4-8-2 runs very well either on DC or DCC.

[geo61bird]

I do not know about the missing gear as I do not have that locomotive.   Perhaps Spookshow or someone else on this forum who has it does.

If you are buying other locomotives, and want a steam locomotive, you might try a SPECTRUM 2-8-0.

The earlier runs of this one did not have a factory installed decoder.   If you find one from the first two runs, it is try-before-you-buy.  If you get a good one, you get a really good one.  Do be aware that it will require a very long break-in.  The last run of the 2-8-0 does have a decoder.

There is a USRA light 4-8-2 that did not have a decoder, as well.  The first run had some problems with the tyred driver's making proper contact with the rails.   I understand that B-mann addressed this in subsequent runs of it, but I do not have any from other than the first run.

There is a USRA heavy 4-8-2 as well as a Baldwin 4-6-0 and an ALCo 2-6-0.  All of them are excellent runners, but they do have factory decoders in them.  They are supposed to be dual mode decoders, and, the locomotives will run on DC, but the last two do run better on DCC with the decoder present.  If you take out the decoder from the 4-6-0 and 2-6-0 and re-wire, they are very good runners, especially at slow speed.   There is a 4-6-0 available in a trainset without a decoder.  It runs well.

The USRA heavy 4-8-2 runs very well either on DC or DCC.

Thank you for the info.

[spookshow]

My loco doesn't have gears on the three axles show in this diagram, only the middle two have sprockets.

Is this normal?

Is that the parts diagram that came with the trainset? If not, you may have an older version than what Bachmann currently sells (Bachmann has modified the 4-8-4 mechanism numerous times over the years).

Cheers,
-Mark

[geo61bird]

That is the diagram that came in the box yet, but my loco is different, number of drive gears for one, also the shell doesn't have the screw to hold it in place at the front like the diagram but in the middle and two underneath the shell in the back.

Very disappointed that all the loco is good for is sitting on the side of the track looking pretty lol

I didn't buy it not to run it. The second axle from the front lifts off the track causing the first axle to derail. Frustrating.

[spookshow]

Bachmann has an excellent warranty program, so I'd just send it back. Most of them are fine runners.

Cheers,
-Mark

[geo61bird]

Northern has departed via UPS, now we play the waiting game... Good thing I picked up the super chief set, the F7 diesel is great!!!

Thanks for all the help guys!!! Will let you know how the replacement runs.