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Author Topic: K-27 #453 No Smoke  (Read 5174 times)
tnpguy

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« on: November 06, 2008, 04:23:32 PM »

I have just added a DCC capability to my new K-27. It is the plug and play Digitrax DG583AR, It plugs nicely into the tender board and the loco runs fine with the locomotive and tender lights working correctly in the correct direction. I assigned functions for the class lamps, firebox light and cab light and they are working nicely. I will soon add a Tsunami sound system to complete the installation. My problem is I cannot produce any smoke. I looked down the stack and have added about 8 drops of smoke fluid but there is no action happening in the stack. The front smoke switch is set to DCC. I tried setting it to DC but it had no effect. Any suggestions? I am also looking for ideas for connecting the Tsunami "chuff" wire. I have not seen any references on the list to installers of the Soundtraxx products with synchronized chuffs.
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Jon D. Miller

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« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2008, 07:35:01 PM »

For the smokd unit, power up the locomotive and then with a multi-meter check for power at the smoke unit.

If there is power at the smoke unit then the unit is defective.

Checking the smoke unit will at least be a first step in locating why your unit will not smoke.

Beyond that, check the wiring diagram to locate the source of power to the smoke unit.  Check at the source with the multi-meter.

That's about it for all I could suggest.  DCC is way beyond me.  I'm a battery/RC operator.

JD
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StanAmes


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« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2008, 11:12:01 PM »

To check out the smoke unit put in the dummy plug turn the motor off and place the locomotive on the track.  The smoke should work in the DC mode.

To get the smoke to work in DCC mode you need to have both a + and - voltage to the locomotive.

The Digitrax decoder has its - pin cut at the factory so you will have to add a small rectifier to make it function properly.  Any 1 amp or greater rectifier will work.

Connect the rectifiers AV input to the locomotives J1-1 and J1-12 connections and connect the + and - to the locomotives + to J1-6 and - pin to J1-7.

Hope that helps.

Stan
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Tony Walsham

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« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2008, 02:12:39 AM »

Is that Plug'n'Play or Plug'n'Pray?   Grin

Just a joke. 
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Tony Walsham
Founding member of the battery Mafia.


(Remote Control Systems).
Steve Stockham


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« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2008, 08:04:55 AM »

Kinda defeats the whole purpose don't you think?  Shocked
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Joe Satnik


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« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2008, 08:49:17 AM »

Dear Stan,

You wrote:   "rectifier" and "AV"

Did you mean "bridge rectifier" and "AC"?

Why do you need the diode bridge?  Is there a DC fan to blow the smoke?

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik





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If your loco is too heavy to lift, you'd better be able to ride in, on or behind it.
Tony Walsham

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« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2008, 09:21:49 AM »

Joe, there is a fan in the K-27 boiler to blow smoke.
Only problem is it is mounted backwards and sucks the smoke down the chimney and blows it out under the boiler.
When the fan is reversed (a big job) it works specatularly well.
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Tony Walsham
Founding member of the battery Mafia.


(Remote Control Systems).
StanAmes


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« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2008, 09:35:44 AM »

Is that Plug'n'Play or Plug'n'Pray?   Grin

Just a joke. 
Tony

Yes indeed product development cycles differ.

Dear Stan,

You wrote:   "rectifier" and "AV"

Did you mean "bridge rectifier" and "AC"?

Why do you need the diode bridge?  Is there a DC fan to blow the smoke?

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik

Sorry yes "bridge rectifier" and "AC".  

The smoke generator has a voltager regulator and draws current. The desire is to not load the function wire with this current.  When the item in the socket brings the trigger line for the smoke unit to ground it is actually activating a transistor which conects the smoke unit to the locomotive DC.

The DC in the locomotive also activates the motor fan and the optos for the chuff.
Joe, there is a fan in the K-27 boiler to blow smoke.
Only problem is it is mounted backwards and sucks the smoke down the chimney and blows it out under the boiler.
When the fan is reversed (a big job) it works specatularly well.

True indeed.  Apparently some K27s have the fan in backwards.  I have one that does not smoke well because of this and two that smoke exceptionally well.

Stan
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Joe Satnik


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« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2008, 09:55:03 AM »

Thanks, Tony.

IIRC you said that the fan has to be turned around, that you couldn't just reverse its polarity.

Stan,

Thanks for the detailed reply.  Voltage regulator, transistor and fan all need DC, hence the diode bridge for DCC.   

I suppose trying to build/test for 3 different power/control systems (DC, DCC and Battery R/C) is a challenge.    

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik
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If your loco is too heavy to lift, you'd better be able to ride in, on or behind it.
Tony Walsham

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« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2008, 07:45:36 PM »

Stanley.
Every K-27 I have had through here has had the fan in backwards.

Joe.
The fan is polarised for direction and can only rotate one way.  The boiler has to come off and different length screws installed to remount it.
Mounted the right way around it works exceptionally well.

BTW.  The last two K-27's that have been in here for battery R/C conversion have different tender trucks to the first run ones.
The easy way to tell is they don't have wiper pick ups on the axles and now have metal side frames.
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Tony Walsham
Founding member of the battery Mafia.


(Remote Control Systems).
Joe Satnik


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« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2008, 10:10:48 AM »

Tony,

Does that mean fewer wheels picking up power?

(If so, previous count vs. new count, please.)

Thanks.

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik

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If your loco is too heavy to lift, you'd better be able to ride in, on or behind it.
Tony Walsham

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« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2008, 05:54:08 PM »

Joe.

Same number of pick up points on tender.
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Tony Walsham
Founding member of the battery Mafia.


(Remote Control Systems).
Doug.Oaks

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« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2008, 04:11:35 PM »

I would like to correct the fan direction. Is there documentation, or is this a learn-as-you go process?
Thanks.

Doug
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bobgrosh

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« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2008, 10:26:44 AM »

Take boiler off.
Four screws hold the fan.

Remove the screws.
Discard the two LONGER screws.
Flip the fan over and re-install the two SHORTER screws.

Put the boiler back on.
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