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Layout size poll

Started by rustyrails, June 18, 2009, 09:43:37 PM

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FECfan

#15
My Layout is about 8x5 and is still DC (teen budget).

Cooped

8' x 10' with duckunder access. Only finished building the benchwork last week, laid 2 large ovals just straight on the wood so my son and I can have fun just running trains until I manage to get something a little more lanscaped done. It's on wheels in an unfinished basement. The wheels are so when I finally get around to finishing the basement (I know it's somewhere on the honey do list) I don't have to take it appart to move it around.

Dan
Yes dear, I'm looking at trains again........

sparkyjay31

Approximately 100 sf.  Benchwork is complete, and the track work has been completed.  We have basically two interlocking loops that we can run our trains on.  Total track length is around 140 feet with a max grade of 2%.
Southern New Hampshire around 1920 in HO
NCE Power Cab DCC
Long live B&M steam!

Chris350

60"x144" oval, two main lines, ~36" and inner 24".  ~22" reverse loop, turning wye and sidings.  Atlas code 83, with #4, 6 and 8 turnouts.  Very nice Timber-flex edging.  It's too big to get into my new rooms... May have to cut her in to manageable pieces and reinstall, or sell and rebuild from scratch.  Bachmann contributed a 2-8-4 Mountain with a Hicken tender.  Runs primarily late model steam and early diesel. Photos here

WGL

#19
Jonathan,
My room is 11 1/2' x 21 1/2', but first it was a library.  Its 4 walls are lined with bookcases holding 3000+ books.  My outer oval is 15' 4" x 7' 7"; my middle oval is 7' x 14' 4"; my inner oval is 6' 4" x 13' 7".  From the inner track, a switch leads to a branch of 2 sidings of about 6 1/2' each.  I've made the layout as large as I can without snaking a track through the adjoining room, thence to the bathroom, & out to the library again.  ;)

WGL

rustyrails

WGL,
Would you look at your numbers please.  You have a 15' wide oval in a 12' wide room.  Thanks
Rusty

jward

interesting that just about everybody on here is thinking in terms of "ovals" or loops. does anybody here have a point to point type track plan? this is essentially what i am building now.
Jeffery S Ward Sr
Pittsburgh, PA

Atlantic Central

Quote from: jward on June 20, 2009, 01:52:41 PM
interesting that just about everybody on here is thinking in terms of "ovals" or loops. does anybody here have a point to point type track plan? this is essentially what i am building now.

I know a number of people with point to point layouts - BUT - they seem to be falling out of favor after a long run of popularity.

While they are great for branch line/back woods/logging sytle railroads, they have some serious drawbacks when trying to simulate part of a large Class I railroad.

Basicly they leave you with too much switching at each end in proportion to the mainline running time, even if you have a large/long mainline run. So many today are going for continuious track plans with some part of the loop hidden from view and used for staging.

And many people want both good operation and good display running for shows/open houses, so continious plans offer that advantage as well.

Sheldon

Jim Banner

For operational purposes, mine is point to point or more correctly, hidden yard to hidden yard.  But I will plead guilty to having an extra track, not used in operating sessions, which allows continuous running for open houses and when I run alone.  During operating sessions, the layout functions as a single division with connection to other divisions at the ends.  In fact, the hidden yards are called "Yonder Division" and "Hidden Valley Division."

Would it be fair to call it point to point to point when you have a third way on and off the modelled part of the layout?  The third way, at about the mid point, is a barge operation which allows interchange with a friend's layout.  It also allows barge to hidden yard or hidden yard to barge operation in addition to hidden yard to hidden yard.  That gives 9 possible trains based on start and end locations.


But yes, I agree, point to point is no longer as common as it once was.  Do you think this might be related to the use of DCC which makes it easy to have one train running around the oval while you switch with a second train?

Jim 
Growing older is mandatory but growing up is optional.

jward

that a point to point layout is only suitable for branchline and switching is a common misconception. add a staging yard in a reversing loop at each end and you add another dimension to the railroad. now, instead of your trains endlessly orbiting in the same direction, they are actually going somewhere, and they have to return from where they went.

having 2 or mroe large yards is not only unnecessary, it is redundant. one yard can handle all traffic, or you could operate what the real railroads call "relay" trains which bypass the yard altogether. the loops at each end can represent an infinite number of destinations.

the best part of it all is that now, with dcc and auto reverse units, you can eliminate all that "scary" wiring that has kept many from seriously considering the potential of such a design.

naturally, this is not the type of layout that will fit in a 4x8 area, at least not in HO scale.

as an example of how this works, consider my dad's layout. he has a loop at the north end alond with a major yard. transfer runs come in and out of the loop represemnting interchange runs from connecting lines, and terminate in the yard. the loop is also home to several relay trains as well.

the main yard sorts cars for the connecting lines, as well as local online traffic.

halfway down the main, a branch line heads for anothe small yard in a mining area, where several coal mines are served. this yard recieves empty cars, and sorts out the loaded ones by destination, north or south.

on the southern end of the mainline, is a small 2 track yard where coal and other low priority traffic is dropped off for pickup by a connecting line. there is also another hidden loop where relay trains lay over, along with a transfer run ffrom the connecting line. its job is to come into the 2 track yard, drop its cars and pick up whatever has been left for it.

there usually is no schedule to the trains, when one enters the staging yard at either end it bumps another one out. and whichever one is next out is what he runs.

this would be a busy railroad with just the two loops, but the addition of the branch line introduces equipment imbalances such as exist on the real ones. often the locomotives needed to move a train are somewhere else and must be deadheaded. or one area of the railroad may be starving for cars, while another is swamped.

the end result is a realistic ebb and flow of traffic, and the dispatcher has to keep on his toes lest he plug up the railroad. it ends up like a chess match in that you always have to be thinking ahead, and the wrong decision could have unforeseen consequences.

i honestly think that he's overcome the drawbacks of point to point layouts. after all, it's kept him interested for 30 years, and he runs as many trains now as when it was new. the novelty has never worn off for him......

Jeffery S Ward Sr
Pittsburgh, PA

jward

Quote from: Jim Banner on June 20, 2009, 05:45:56 PM
Would it be fair to call it point to point to point when you have a third way on and off the modelled part of the layout?  The third way, at about the mid point, is a barge operation which allows interchange with a friend's layout.  It also allows barge to hidden yard or hidden yard to barge operation in addition to hidden yard to hidden yard.  That gives 9 possible trains based on start and end locations.


But yes, I agree, point to point is no longer as common as it once was.  Do you think this might be related to the use of DCC which makes it easy to have one train running around the oval while you switch with a second train?

Jim 

jim,
your layout is still point to point no matter how many intermediate destinations you may have. in fact, that barge terminal serves the same function as the mining branch on my dad's layout. (see above post)

as for letting one train run while another works the yard, this is nothing that couldn't be done in dc, with 2 cabs. in fact, many of the layout plans in the atlas layout books specifically describe just this scenario, and show how to wire the layout to do this....
Jeffery S Ward Sr
Pittsburgh, PA

Atlantic Central

#26
Jeffery,

Not sure I understand your comments.

If you have a staging yard in each of two loops, that is two yards. Are you refering to visable yards outside the staging when you say two yards are not needed? No fooling, I belive in only modeling each major feature once.

The advandage of continious over loop to loop is that one staging yard can serve both directions and efectively be the end point for both ends. Many with this type of layout conduct their operating sessions in a point to point manner. Each train can be run only once in a session and is automaticly "re-staged" for the next session.

And having continious loops does not preclude have loops to turn trains in the staging that you want to have "return" from where they came. One other advantage of continious loops is open top loads, empties can always be moving west, loads east, as in the mountain to port senerio.

Continious is especially good for double track mainlines.

Also, I know people with loop to loop layouts with staging tracks in the loops. It works good for about 4 tracks on a loop, after that the loops get real big and space eating or the trains get real short.

A staging yard that is straight and double ended can be easily positioned under the scenic portion of the layout and still have good access from the edge of the layout, especially if the scenic portion is 40" high or better. And it can be designed to hold a lot more than the six trains you are likely to store in "loop" staging yards, and loner trains as well.

The idea of where the train goes, or where it comes from is in your head anyway.

Sheldon

mf5117

5x9 2 levels  . even texas has its beauty mr ward . its a whole nother country .

WGL

Rusty, I re-measured & corrected the width of my outer oval.  I inadvertently put a 1 in front of the 7' 7".

pdlethbridge

Me thinks your inner oval is longer than the outer ovals ???